Should Christians Be Keeping the Sabbath?

[WALL]

Isn't it arguable that Christians should be keeping Shabbat since they claim to follow the ten commandments? Certainly Jesus and the disciples kept it, seeing as they were Jews. What argument can really be brought forward that Christians shouldn't be keeping it, and do the gospels anywhere explicitly suggest Jesus wouldn't want his followers to?

Yes we as Christians are to keep Gods 10 commandments

HEBREWS 13 [8] Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Does this new testament scripture really mean what it says?

PROVERBS 24 [19] Fret not thyself because of evil men, neither be thou envious at the wicked;[20] For there shall be no reward to the evil man; THE CANDLE OF THE WICKED SHALL BE PUT OUT.[21] My son, fear thou the LORD and the king: and MEDDLE NOT WITH THEM THAT ARE GIVEN TO CHANGE:[22] For their calamity shall rise suddenly; and who knoweth the ruin of them both?

PSALM 89 [30] IF HIS CHILDREN FORSAKE MY LAW, and walk not in my judgments; [31] If they break my statutes, AND KEEP NOT MY COMMANDMENTS; [32] Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes. [33] Nevertheless my lovingkindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail. [34] MY COVENANT WILL I NOT BREAK, NOR ALTER the thing that is gone out of my lips.

The "many" believe that Gods 4th commandment has been altered

ECCLES. 3 [14] I know that, WHATSOEVER GOD DOETH, IT SHALL BE FOR EVER: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him. [15] That which hath been is now; and that which is to be hath already been; and God requireth that which is past.

MALACHI 3 [2] BUT WHO MAY ABIDE THE DAY OF HIS COMING? AND WHO SHALL STAND WHEN HE APPEARETH? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:[3] And he shall sit as a refiner and purifer of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.[4] Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years.[5] And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts.[6] FOR I AM THE LORD, I CHANGE NOT;

So why do many believe that their god is a wishy washy God. Changing continually.

Old testament – keep the sabbath

New testament – dont bother

1000 yr rest (in the Kingdom) – Gotta keep the sabbath again (scripture below)

ISAIAH 66 [22] For as the NEW HEAVENS AND THE NEW EARTH, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. [23] And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and FROM ONE SABBATH TO ANOTHER, shall ALL FLESH COME TO WORSHIP BEFORE ME, saith the Lord.

So has the sabbath been changed or altered? Many make that claim. But i gotta believe that Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever

 

[metis]

The Ten Commandments are only the first 10 of 613 Commandments, and a listing of them and where they can be found in Torah is here: Judaism 101: A List of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments)

 

[WALL]

Anyhow, Jesus said not to judge others, but you ignore what he said, so that pretty much sums up what you think about Jesus' teachings.

Hi Metis. Im not sure that you can {biblicly speaking} judge others by words. I think its physical judgement thats being spoken of.

 

[WALL]

NO ONE has to keep the Sabbath.


The commands to observe special days are NO MORE.

Where do you find this

 

[metis]

Hi Metis. Im not sure that you can {biblicly speaking} judge others by words. I think its physical judgement thats being spoken of.

Yo WALL. Since Jesus taught not to do as such, I would suggest that those who profess to believe in Jesus might consider taking his teachings seriously on this and other matters. In Romans, it says one should not try and be "God's counselor", but unfortunately there are some who seemingly try and do just that. I'm not saying nor implying you do this, btw.

 

[WALL]

The Ten Commandments are only the first 10 of 613 Commandments, and a listing of them and where they can be found in Torah is here: Judaism 101: A List of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments)

God separates them. The 10 and the law. No need for us to lump them together

EXODUS 24 [12] And the Lord said unto Moses, Come up to me into the mount, and be there: and I will give thee tables of stone, AND a law, AND commandments which I have written; that thou mayest teach them.

 

[WALL]

Yo WALL. Since Jesus taught not to do as such, I would suggest that those who profess to believe in Jesus might consider taking his teachings seriously on this and other matters. In Romans, it says one should not try and be "God's counselor", but unfortunately there are some who seemingly try and do just that. I'm not saying nor implying you do this, btw.

Do this? I dont even know what you said

 

[metis]

God separates them. The 10 and the law. No need for us to lump them together

.

Absolutely, false, and let me encourage to actually go back and read what it actually says in Exodus, including where Moses got the whole Law from.

 

[WALL]

Absolutely, false, and let me encourage to actually go back and read what it actually says in Exodus, including where Moses got the whole Law from.

Again? Why? Itll still read the way it did the many times ive read it

 

[WALL]

Again? Why? Itll still read the way it did the many times ive read it

Ill post Ex.24 again

EXODUS 24 [12] And the Lord said unto Moses, Come up to me into the mount, and be there: and I will give thee tables of stone, AND a law, AND commandments which I have written; that thou mayest teach them.

AND means AND. We can see that the law AND the ten commandments are separate. They are not lumped into 600 plus commandments called the law as the "many" claim. The reason they make this claim is to point to one liners which are usually talking about the law of circumcision and apply that one liner to the ten commandments. This is done to extreme with the book of Galatians

1 COR.7 [18] Is any man called being circumcised? let him not become uncircumcised. Is any called in uncircumcision? let him not be circumcised.[19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

In above scripture we find that even though circumcision was nailed to the cross, we are still to be keeping Gods ten commandments. Yup...separate

JOHN 7 [21] Jesus answered and said unto them, I have done one work, and ye all marvel.[22] Moses therefore gave unto you circumcision; (not because it is of Moses, but of the fathers and ye on the sabbath day circumcise a man.[23] If a man on the sabbath day receive circumcision, that the law of Moses should not be broken; are ye angry at me, because I have made a man every whit whole on the sabbath day?

Jesus himself separates the law of Moses and the 10 commandments. He clearly separates the sabbath day {4th commandment} on which no work is to be done and the law of circumcision being done on the sabbath so as the law of Moses be not broken.

 

[metis]

Again? Why? Itll still read the way it did the many times ive read it

One can read something and not understand it.

Of the 613 Laws, how do you think Moses got them, for example? Did he buy them at Laws-R-Us?

 

[metis]

Ill post Ex.24 again

EXODUS 24 [12] And the Lord said unto Moses, Come up to me into the mount, and be there: and I will give thee tables of stone, AND a law, AND commandments which I have written; that thou mayest teach them.

AND means AND. We can see that the law AND the ten commandments are separate. They are not lumped into 600 plus commandments called the law as the "many" claim. The reason they make this claim is to point to one liners which are usually talking about the law of circumcision and apply that one liner to the ten commandments. This is done to extreme with the book of Galatians

And if you kept on reading the Exodus citation, you'll see that, over time, Moses continues on with more and more of the Law, which he states is from God.

Also, there's an easy way to check this out. Here's a link to all verses in the Tanakh that use the word "Law", and all you have to do is to read them and you'll see that the "Law" pertains, not just to the 10, but to all the Commandments: Bible, Revised Standard Version

This will take some times as there are 307 references. Also, don't you think as Jews that we would actually know where the Law comes from? Do you really think that we're that stupid whereas we can't read our own scriptures?

Also you might again to check on my other link to you that shows all 613 Laws.

 

[WALL]

One can read something and not understand it.

Of the 613 Laws, how do you think Moses got them, for example? Did he buy them at Laws-R-Us?

Exodus 16:28 (KJV)
28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?

Pretty obvious where Moses Got the 10 commandments AND its also obvious where Moses got the rest of the law

 

[WALL]

1 COR. 7 [19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Paul separates the law of circumsicion and the law of the 10 commandments

DEUT.4
[13] And he declared unto you HIS COVENANT, which he commanded you to perform, EVEN TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

The 10 are a whole and separate covenant

 

[metis]

1 COR. 7 [19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Paul separates the law of circumsicion and the law of the 10 commandments

DEUT.4
[13] And he declared unto you HIS COVENANT, which he commanded you to perform, EVEN TEN COMMANDMENTS; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

The 10 are a whole and separate covenant

It's obvious that you didn't link up to the sites I posted. Sorry, but if you don't do that, you're just going to continue to wallow around in ignorance on the subject.

Secondly, the Law is not the Covenant, the latter of which goes further back to Abraham, which was hundreds of years prior to Moses and the Law. Later, the Law reinforced the Covenant, so you have cause and effect totally screwed up.

BTW, do you observe the Sabbath as the day of rest, which is a day of the week that runs from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday?

 

[WALL]

BTW, do you observe the Sabbath as the day of rest, which is a day of the week that runs from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday?

Yup

 

[Hawkins]

Christians don't keep Law. Christians keep faith instead. Law (or part of it) can still be seen as guidance from God. We thus are following Christ's teachings.

In reality, Christians 'keep' Sabbath but in the form of Sunday services.

 

[WALL]

NO ONE has to keep the Sabbath.

The commands to observe special days are NO MORE.

Im gonna go out on a limb here and guess you were speaking of whats written in Gal.4

GAL.4 [8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.[9] But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?[10] YE OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS.[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Galatians 4 says nothing about sabbaths or feast days. Its speaking of those who observe times.

DEUT.18 [9] When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.[10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, OR AN OBSERVER OF TIMES, or an enchanter, or a witch,[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.

The same thing goes on to this very day. Its speaking of the occult. Those who observe certain days by use of horoscopes?

2 CHR.33 [3] For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves, and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them.[4] Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever.[5] And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD.[6] And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: ALSO HE OBSERVED TIMES, and used enchantments, and used witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger

Enchantments, witchcraft, familiar spirits, and wizards. Its speaking of the occult. Not following sabbath days.

LEV.19 [26] Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood: neither shall ye use enchantment, NOR OBSERVE TIMES.[27] Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.[28] Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.[29] Do not prostitute thy daughter, to cause her to be a whore; lest the land fall to whoredom, and the land become full of wickedness.[30] YE SHALL KEEP MY SABBATHS, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

I guess this scripture says it all. You shall not observe times BUT you will keep my sabbaths.

 

[WALL]

Christians don't keep Law. Christians keep faith instead. Law (or part of it) can still be seen as guidance from God. We thus are following Christ's teachings.

In reality, Christians 'keep' Sabbath but in the form of Sunday services.

Can you show me any scripture that says men can change His sabbath commandment to another day?

Matthew 15
9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

 

[Hawkins]

Can you show me any scripture that says men can change His sabbath commandment to another day?

Matthew 15
9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

That's not about changing the Sabbath day. Christians doesn't need to keep the Law (including Sabbath), we follow Christ's teaching instead. However by God's will, all mankind are virtually keeping the Sabbath in a form of resting 1 day for every 7 days. Take a look at your Calendar, it is marked red.

Christians do one thing more, that is, to attend Sunday services.


Christ's teaching about the commandments (where's the Sabbath anyway?)

Matthew 22:36-39 (NIV)
Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?
Jesus replied: ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
This is the first and greatest commandment.
And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’

Mark 10:19 (NIV)
You know the commandments: ‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.