How much per table should a server make? Same amount of work serving a $50.00 meal as a $10.00 meal.
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Should Tipping be Banned?
- Thread starter Falvlun
- Start date
How much per table should a server make? Same amount of work serving a $50.00 meal as a $10.00 meal.
Ah, well that explains it.
I once drove the beer cart on a golf course as a job and sold drinks to guys out on the course all day. Best. Job. Ever. By round three around the course, these guys were tipping me twice the amount of the drinks they were buying.
Too bad that job was temporary for a month in the summer. But in just a couple hours I made $100, out in the sun, enjoying the weather and the scenery, too. Not a lot of beer cart opportunities around these parts, though. I could make a killing and have fun.
It's too bad not a lot of people look at "beer cart girl" as a career option. I would seriously use it as a back up career.
I don't need any. A worker getting 10 bucks an hour works an hour. Servers aren't working a straight hour at a table.
Draka
Wonder Woman
You haven't got one clue. Not one. Something tells me you couldn't earn enough of a tip to buy one either.
In any service related job, you aren't paying for the physical work as much as the quality of the work.
I work in a completely different industry, but consultants in the industry I work in are generally tiered...so you pay more for a senior than a junior. More for a principal than a senior, etc.
Still doing the same work.
Yes, you do, actually.
You see, waiters are supposed to make it look like an easy, enjoyable job. It helps keep customers comfortable and helps bring in new help from the just-out-of-high-schoolers.
Truth is, I had FAR more stress working at a relatively laid-back place as far as restaurants go than I did watching kids. Yes, watching kids (more specifically, teenagers) is more stressful than waiting tables.
I have a mandatory tip that's 15% minimum when I go out to eat. No matter how "bad" the service might be (and seriously, I can count on two fingers the number of times I've actually had bad service).
If the service is good and friendly, I tip at least 20%.
If it's exceptional, I tip 30-50%. But it's rare to have exceptional service, too. I can count - again - on two fingers the number of times I've actually had exceptional service.
The vast vast majority of servers fall within an acceptable range of adequate to very good, no matter the establishment I've been to.
I mean, I look at it this way - somebody is taking care of my need to eat without preparing any of the food or cleaning up afterward. Going to a restaurant is quite a privilege, I think, since there literally is no work going into sitting down at a table, ordering food, having it served to you, and even having leftovers boxed up for you. I don't go into a restaurant with a sudden sense of higher entitlement (like how dare this server make a mistake with my order!!!), I go and I really appreciate how much work goes into just getting the basics down.
Consider how long it takes to make a meal for four at home, how long it takes to clean up, and how long it takes to re-set the table and put the dishes away after they're washed, and just how that in itself can be a chore. Restaurants can be doing this by the hundreds daily. It's a lot of hard work.
So, honestly? I think it's pretentious to walk into a restaurant, and feel as if the workers there really aren't doing anything much besides writing something on a ticket and then bringing a plate to your table after 10 minutes (yawn).
But you don't answer my questions. You just blow off that I have no clue. Now tell us what should a server make per table service?
Put a dollar amount on the work done, not the price of the meal. Tell us how much a server should make per table work.
Can't know that unless you've actually done it, since how much work is done is hidden from the customers in most places.
Levite
Higher and Higher
To be fair, I was working small restaurants in Northern California-- and not in the Bay Area. So cash didn't torrent into my wallet or anything.
OTOH, one of my good friends waited two years at Spago in LA, back at the turn of the '90s, when Wolfgang Puck totally ruled West Coast cuisine, and he made ridiculous bank. He had crazy waiting experience for a twentysomething, plus he was an actor with amazing improv skills and memory, plus he was suave as all hell (i.e., he was entertaining, remembered names, never got orders wrong, one of those guys who just has the golden touch). Puck ran his staff ragged, but my friend used to walk out of Spago on a bad night with $200-$300. On his best nights he pulled in over a grand. And this was back in like '92 or '93, when that was actual money. Hollywood people were all over Spago, and political types, and rich folks in general, and they either tipped nothing (*cough* Charleton Heston *cough*) or they tipped huge (Michael J. Fox, Kevin Costner, Sean Connery).
But most servers aren't waiting at Spago in the heyday. They're waiting at Joe's Eats in Nowheresburg, and nobody's dropping insane tips on them or inviting them to exclusive parties or whatnot.
In my ideal system:
- the price on the menu would be the full expected price for everything, including service from wait staff.
- wait staff would receive a base salary that was a fair, competitive wage for their job.
- tipping would be allowed, but it would customarily be to acknowledge exceptional service and wouldn't be a routine, expected thing.
- the price on the menu would be the full expected price for everything, including service from wait staff.
- wait staff would receive a base salary that was a fair, competitive wage for their job.
- tipping would be allowed, but it would customarily be to acknowledge exceptional service and wouldn't be a routine, expected thing.
If you cant put a $ price on the work, then any % of the bill is not enough of a tip, is it?
Whether it's enough of a tip is up to the person receiving it. Tipping is not compulsory and anyone who actually asks for one automatically doesn't get one from me... unless it's the pizza delivery guy because I live at the top of roughly a hundred stairs. A tip AND a glass of water for you!
Besides, putting a price on work amount is a waste of time, since corporate CEOs do notoriously less work than the people at the bottom of the corporate ladder, and yet make 10000% more money.
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Yay...you described Australia
gnomon
Well-Known Member
I think the concept is archaic.
It's only because of bizarre wage laws where food industry can pay servers less than minimum wage and force them to rely upon tips for their wage that I still do tip.
However, when was the last time someone tipped a retail employee for picking up a child's feces off the sales floor, for digging through a toilet that someone destroyed, etc. In other words, in my own line of work given the amount of beyond the call of duty service I've provided where tipping is unknown I find it odd that we still tip people for merely writing down my order and refilling my drink. My coworkers work a hell of a lot harder than driving a pizza to a door or asking if my food is good while my mouth is full of food.
Pay servers a reasonable wage and throw the concept to the dogs. And why the hell does Starbucks have a tip jar by the register?! You poured me an overpriced cup of coffee while making over minimum wage. Good for you.
But as I said, restaurants that I rarely visit where the serving staff doesn't receive a standard pay scale will be tipped by me. But I'm still more concerned with the cook than I am with the waiter.
It's only because of bizarre wage laws where food industry can pay servers less than minimum wage and force them to rely upon tips for their wage that I still do tip.
However, when was the last time someone tipped a retail employee for picking up a child's feces off the sales floor, for digging through a toilet that someone destroyed, etc. In other words, in my own line of work given the amount of beyond the call of duty service I've provided where tipping is unknown I find it odd that we still tip people for merely writing down my order and refilling my drink. My coworkers work a hell of a lot harder than driving a pizza to a door or asking if my food is good while my mouth is full of food.
Pay servers a reasonable wage and throw the concept to the dogs. And why the hell does Starbucks have a tip jar by the register?! You poured me an overpriced cup of coffee while making over minimum wage. Good for you.
But as I said, restaurants that I rarely visit where the serving staff doesn't receive a standard pay scale will be tipped by me. But I'm still more concerned with the cook than I am with the waiter.
Caladan
Agnostic Pantheist
Just to get this out of the way I do tip alright. My standard tip is 12-15% (used to be 15% but I told myself I don't earn enough to give that percentage every time I eat outside). I tip well above that for what I consider exceptional and very friendly service, something like 30% for really great service.
But just to take part in the discussion and see what people think, I still have some points to make, some of them are mainly philosophical.
Here's the thing, many people have demanding jobs which are taken for granted and they get no tips for. It's simply bizarre that certain services should get tips. While I don't want to downplay the stress of working as a waiter, there are much much more demanding jobs which get you zero tips.
The whole concept of restaurant owners not taking care of the wage of their workers is the real problem. It's corruption.
I work all day outside in all weather conditions and get home with dirt behind my ears and between my toes... who tips me?
Extra payment for services should be given to a master sword maker for producing the perfect sword, or a lute maker who crafted a flawless instrument, not for bringing me my burger and Pepsi Max from the kitchen (again no disrespect). The service is too inane to be standardized with a tip system. A tip should say that a person has gone above and beyond in producing a masterful product, not for something so standard as working in a restaurant.
When I was traveling China and tried to tip, I was strictly told off by staff and even waiters that they are forbidden to take tips. So some countries do have a different system.
Bottom line is, we all are supposed to get our full wage from our employers, the public is not supposed to fill in the gaps of what employees are entitled for. Waiting tables can be a demanding job, but so are hundreds of others jobs which get no tipping whatsoever.
I used to work as a security officer in one of the biggest hotels in Israel, my job included many extra duties that were taken for granted, who tipped me for that? during the American invasion of Iraq in 2003, our workload was so heavy I used to work 18 hours a day, I don't even think these counted as extra hours. Just food for thought.
BTW for those who don't like tipping there are solutions. There are places like Nando's that you normally don't need to tip staff. All places that you pick up your food by yourself solve this issue. There is an Italian restaurant which works like that not far for where I live, it feels great to pay only 150 NIS for two main courses, a side dish, and two glasses of wine. I love to eat outside, but I'm not rich.
If restaurant owners can't take the burden of paying a full legal salary for their workers, perhaps we will only be left with the properly functioning restaurants that can make it work well.
That being said I am realistic. I tip for a range of services, also because the task is hard, but also because I know that the tips are a lifeline for the employee on the economic level.
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