Signs of the Times - What’s happening to our world?

[Spirit of Light]

I would be glad now for people in these forums to think that I am not a Baha’i. You can quote me saying that. If anyone asks me, I will say honestly that I am a member of the Baha’i Faith community whose membership is defined by the Universal House of Justice, and that I have no doubt that it’s right for me to be a member of that community.

So you are an independent Baha`i?

 

[Jim]

Our world is fast changing. Now this virus is closing down the world.

Does your religion say anything about these times? My religion says plenty.

So what does this virus mean to religionists? Is it a prophecy of your Faith? Or do you think it is preparing the world for something?

Please share your views as I have many passages in my Faith referring to these times but want to know what you all think, believe and feel.

Those without a Faith may like to comment on the financial and social implications of the world shutting down, how long it might last and what long term effect it could have.

Will this cause permanent changes to humanity?

What I care about most, in discussions about current events, is what people reading and posting in those discussions are doing and could be doing to help improve the lives of all people everywhere, and to improve the world for future generations. Does your religion say anything to you about what you should be doing in Internet discussions, or what anyone reading these posts might be able to do, online or offline, about what’s happening to our world? That is not a rhetorical question. I really would like to know, and I’m hoping for you to tell me.

 

[Jim]

So you are an independent Baha`i?

No. I’m not a Baha’i at all, by any definition of “Baha’i” that I’ve seen anyone else besides me using in these forums.

 

[Spirit of Light]

No. I’m not a Baha’i at all, by any definition of “Baha’i” that I’ve seen anyone else besides me using in these forums.

But do you read and follow the Baha'i teaching from Bahá`u`ullah? or is there another you follow the teaching of? You spoke earlier about your spiritual teacher

 

[Jim]

But du you read and follow the Baha'i teaching from Bahá`u`ullah? or is there another you follow the teaching of? You spoke earlier about your spiritual teacher

I call Bahá’u’lláh “my spiritual teacher,” because that might help people sometimes to understand what kind of path I’m following.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I call Bahá’u’lláh “my spiritual teacher,” because that might help people sometimes to understand what kind of path I’m following.

In my understanding, your path would be Baha`i because you following the teaching of the founder of Baha`i. You just have your own way of understanding his teaching

 

[Jim]

In my understanding, your path would be Baha`i because you following the teaching of the founder of Baha`i. You just have your own way of understanding his teaching

That looks right to me.

(edited to add the following)
Any time anyone says “Baha’is believe ...” they are excluding me from their definition of •Baha’i.”

 

[Jim]

Our world is fast changing. Now this virus is closing down the world.

Does your religion say anything about these times? My religion says plenty.

So what does this virus mean to religionists? Is it a prophecy of your Faith? Or do you think it is preparing the world for something?

Please share your views as I have many passages in my Faith referring to these times but want to know what you all think, believe and feel.

Those without a Faith may like to comment on the financial and social implications of the world shutting down, how long it might last and what long term effect it could have.

Will this cause permanent changes to humanity?

I see people reading and posting in these forums as part of our world. In these forums I see signs and symptoms of the worst things that are happening to our world. I see some things happening in these forums that I think are helping to perpetuate the worst things that are happening to our world. I also see wonderful possibilities for using Internet discussions as ways of responding to what is happening to our world. I sometimes see people using the forums in those ways. Does your religion say anything about any of that?

 

[Jim]

Does your religion say anything about these times? My religion says plenty.

I’m sorry for the hostility in my posts to you.

I’ve thought about this question some more, and I have some more thoughts about it. My interest in this topic is in how anyone who wants to can help reduce and counteract the damage from civilization disintegrating all around us, and help with the growth and spread of a new, worldwide civilization where there will be more peace, justice and prosperity for all people everywhere.

I think that people following Bahá’u’lláh, and practicing His laws and prescriptions for living, will be part of that. Another part of that will be people voluntary working together on some common goals and plans, much more than they are now, for helping to improve the lives of all people everywhere and to help improve the world for future generations. That is already happening in some communities where people are practicing what the House of Justice is promoting for Baha’i communities.

Another part of it, the part that I think is most consequential and the foundation for all the rest, is people valuing all people everywhere and all of nature, and caring what happens to them, much more than they do now, without drawing any belief lines between themselves and others.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Another one of my disagreements with people promoting Baha’i beliefs in Internet discussions is about how ro use Baha’i writings. I disagree with people mining them for quotes to use in promoting their beliefs in opposition to the views of others, and continually pushing them into the faces of people who don’t want to see them.

What is your opinion on the Baha'i Writings quoting certain passages or traditions from previous religions? Mostly that is only small snippets from past Writings.

Can that, in reflection of your reply, be mining a quote to support a view?

Personally I see that every word, every sentence, every passage can have unlimited potential meanings, as such, instead I see it not as mining quotes, because any one can offer another quote, that may shed a different light upon the original quote offered.

Is that not how we learn?

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

In my understanding, your path would be Baha`i because you following the teaching of the founder of Baha`i. You just have your own way of understanding his teaching

If you do not mind my interjecting, a Baha'i does not only "follow" Baha'u'llah as a spiritual teacher. A Baha'i believes that Baha'u'llah was a Manifestation of God. I had to declare that before I signed my card back in 1970.

 

[Spirit of Light]

If you do not mind my interjecting, a Baha'i does not only "follow" Baha'u'llah as a spiritual teacher. A Baha'i believes that Baha'u'llah was a Manifestation of God. I had to declare that before I signed my card back in 1970.

Thank you I did not know this view you explained now. But then i learned something new and interesting today too

 

[Trailblazer]

Thank you I did not know this view you explained now. But then i learned something new and interesting today too

Here are some other important things you probably don't know...

Baha'u'llah sacrificed Himself for God. Baha'u'llah claimed to speak only at God's bidding, and never glorified Himself. He only ever claimed to be a Manifestation of God, although He also claimed to be a Messenger of God and a Servant of God. As Baha'is, we worship only God, not Baha'u'llah. That is how we are different from Christians, who worship Jesus, because they believe He was God.

“Know ye that I am afraid of none except God. In none but Him have I placed My trust; to none will I cleave but Him, and wish for naught except the thing He hath wished for Me. This, indeed, is My heart’s desire, did ye but know it. I have offered up My soul and My body as a sacrifice for God, the Lord of all worlds. Whoso hath known God shall know none but Him, and he that feareth God shall be afraid of no one except Him, though the powers of the whole earth rise up and be arrayed against him. I speak naught except at His bidding, and follow not, through the power of God and His might, except His truth. He, verily, shall recompense the truthful.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 126

 

[Spirit of Light]

Here are some other important things you probably don't know...

Baha'u'llah sacrificed Himself for God. Baha'u'llah claimed to speak only at God's bidding, and never glorified Himself. He only ever claimed to be a Manifestation of God, although He also claimed to be a Messenger of God and a Servant of God. As Bahais, we worship only God, not Baha'u'llah. That is how we are different from Christians, who worship Jesus, because they believe He was God.

“Know ye that I am afraid of none except God. In none but Him have I placed My trust; to none will I cleave but Him, and wish for naught except the thing He hath wished for Me. This, indeed, is My heart’s desire, did ye but know it. I have offered up My soul and My body as a sacrifice for God, the Lord of all worlds. Whoso hath known God shall know none but Him, and he that feareth God shall be afraid of no one except Him, though the powers of the whole earth rise up and be arrayed against him. I speak naught except at His bidding, and follow not, through the power of God and His might, except His truth. He, verily, shall recompense the truthful.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 126

Sound like Baha`u`llah was a wise man

 

[loverofhumanity]

What are Baha’is and the Baha’i Faith doing for humanity under the guidance of the Universal House of Justice who’s Seat is in Haifa, Israel.

This letter on behalf of the Guardian of the Faith explains the nature of Baha’i work.


“If the Bahá’ís could evaluate their work properly they would see that whereas other forms of relief work are superficial in character, alleviating the sufferings and ills of men for a short time at best, the work they are doing is to lay the foundation of a new spiritual Order in the world founded on the Word of God, operating according to the laws He has laid down for this age. No one else can do this work except those who have fully realized the meaning of the Message of Bahá’u’lláh, whereas almost any courageous, sincere person can engage in relief work, etc.

“The believers are building a refuge for mankind. This is their supreme sacred task and they should devote every moment they can to this task.”

(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to an individual believer: Principles of Bahá’í Administration, p. 24)”

We are in a true sense I believe, building an Ark for humanity like in the days of Noah to offer as a refuge as the floods of despair, hopelessness and fear take hold.

 

[Trailblazer]

Sound like Baha`u`llah was a wise man

More things you probably don't know about what Baha'is believe.....

We believe that as a Manifestation of God, Baha'u'llah was not just a wise man. He was more than a man because He had two stations, a divine station and a human station. In His divine station, He spoke as the voice of God but in his human station He was just a man like you.

“And since there can be no tie of direct intercourse to bind the one true God with His creation, and no resemblance whatever can exist between the transient and the Eternal, the contingent and the Absolute, He hath ordained that in every age and dispensation a pure and stainless Soul be made manifest in the kingdoms of earth and heaven.Unto this subtle, this mysterious and ethereal Being He hath assigned a twofold nature; the physical, pertaining to the world of matter, and the spiritual, which is born of the substance of God Himself. He hath, moreover, conferred upon Him a double station. The first station, which is related to His innermost reality, representeth Him as One Whose voice is the voice of God Himself.....The second station is the human station, exemplified by the following verses: “I am but a man like you.”” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 66-67

We believe the above passage not only pertained to Baha'u'llah, but to all the Manifestations of God.

 

[Spirit of Light]

More things you probably don't know about what Baha'is believe.....

We believe that as a Manifestation of God, Baha'u'llah was not just a wise man. He was more than a man because He had two stations, a divine station and a human station. In His divine station, He spoke as the voice of God but in his human station He was just a man like you.

“And since there can be no tie of direct intercourse to bind the one true God with His creation, and no resemblance whatever can exist between the transient and the Eternal, the contingent and the Absolute, He hath ordained that in every age and dispensation a pure and stainless Soul be made manifest in the kingdoms of earth and heaven.Unto this subtle, this mysterious and ethereal Being He hath assigned a twofold nature; the physical, pertaining to the world of matter, and the spiritual, which is born of the substance of God Himself. He hath, moreover, conferred upon Him a double station. The first station, which is related to His innermost reality, representeth Him as One Whose voice is the voice of God Himself.....The second station is the human station, exemplified by the following verses: “I am but a man like you.”” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 66-67

We believe the above passage not only pertained to Baha'u'llah, but to all the Manifestations of God.

Even not being a Baha`i my self i can say that i agree to what is written in this quote you added
No matter if it was Buddha, Jesus, Baha`u`llah they become a part of God (or as you say the representation of) when they reached enlightenment, They then saw and understood the wisdom of truth. God in my understanding is Truth, But if we look at each representation of Truth that has been a spiritual teacher on earth, they all have their own wisdom, their own teaching, but they are all speaking the truth.

So for us who not yet have realized a form of enlightenment will be able to do so by following one of the spiritual teachers, and doing our own cultivation until we realize the truth too

 

[Trailblazer]

Even not being a Baha`i my self i can say that i agree to what is written in this quote you added
No matter if it was Buddha, Jesus, Baha`u`llah they become a part of God (or as you say the representation of) when they reached enlightenment, They then saw and understood the wisdom of truth. God in my understanding is Truth, But if we look at each representation of Truth that has been a spiritual teacher on earth, they all have their own wisdom, their own teaching, but they are all speaking the truth.

So for us who not yet have realized a form of enlightenment will be able to do so by following one of the spiritual teachers, and doing our own cultivation until we realize the truth too

Very well stated. They are all spiritual teachers because they educate all men.

“The Prophets and Messengers of God have been sent down for the sole purpose of guiding mankind to the straight Path of Truth. The purpose underlying Their revelation hath been to educate all men, that they may, at the hour of death, ascend, in the utmost purity and sanctity and with absolute detachment, to the throne of the Most High. The light which these souls radiate is responsible for the progress of the world and the advancement of its peoples. They are like unto leaven which leaveneth the world of being, and constitute the animating force through which the arts and wonders of the world are made manifest. Through them the clouds rain their bounty upon men, and the earth bringeth forth its fruits. All things must needs have a cause, a motive power, an animating principle. These souls and symbols of detachment have provided, and will continue to provide, the supreme moving impulse in the world of being.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 156-157

Baha'is believe that the Buddha was a Manifestation of God. Many of the Buddha's teachings are similar to Baha'u'llah's teachings since the spiritual teachings of all the great religions are the same and they are eternal.

Buddhism and the Bahá'í Faith

 

[Jim]

I’ve posted some possible agreements and some possible disagreements that I see between me and people promoting and defending Baha’i beliefs. Now I’m looking for more possible agreements between us. For example, sometimes what looks like a disagreement to me might be me misunderstanding what they’re saying and doing. As another example, there might be agreements on other topics besides the ones I’ve mentioned.

Possible agreements that I see.

- We might agree that Bahá’u’lláh’s laws and prescriptions for living are part of what is needed for the best possibilities to happen for all people everywhere.
- We might agree that part of what is needed is something that is called “unity” in Baha’i scriptures.
- We might agree about the importance and urgency of spreading Bahá’u’lláh’s message.
- They might be practicing some virtues that I think are good for people and for society.
problems.
- We might agree in what we say about some Baha’i teachings, for example “equality of men and women” and “elimination of prejudices.”

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Even not being a Baha`i my self i can say that i agree to what is written in this quote you added
No matter if it was Buddha, Jesus, Baha`u`llah they become a part of God (or as you say the representation of) when they reached enlightenment, They then saw and understood the wisdom of truth. God in my understanding is Truth, But if we look at each representation of Truth that has been a spiritual teacher on earth, they all have their own wisdom, their own teaching, but they are all speaking the truth.

So for us who not yet have realized a form of enlightenment will be able to do so by following one of the spiritual teachers, and doing our own cultivation until we realize the truth too

I see that is another thing happening in the world, hearts that are open to the Love of all people of all races and all religions, hearts that are embracing a oneness.

Love your heart Amanaki.

Regards Tony