Soaring Gas Prices

[Mister_T]

The numbers I have put together can be found in Exxon's Annual Statement. I was clear on that.

You have not presented that reference for everybody to see. I got my information from what I read and hear on the news, but apparently it wasn't "good enough." Provide a link for your clams instead of "this is where I got it from." I'm not going to back up your statements for you.

 

[Mister_T]

See, the thing you need to prove is the bolded part. Show me evidence that nobody is working on fixing the problems. Then look a little deeper and find the actual reason they are not fixing them, if, in fact, they are not working on fixing them.

After 3 years (maybe more) the state of oil refineries has not changed since the jump in gas prices. I don't know what more evidence you need.

 

[SoyLeche]

After 3 years (maybe more) the state of oil refineries has not changed since the jump in gas prices. I don't know what more evidence you need.

For example - how much money has been spent to fix the problem? Are the problem refineries today the same that were problem refineries yesterday, or are they fixing some, but more start falling apart? Are there attempts to expand production that are being blocked by NIMBY and environmental groups, taking the solution to the problem out of the hands of the companies? Etc.

 

[Mister_T]

And there would be a much greater market for alternate forms of transportation, which would be a very good thing

You are going to have to supply proof of price gouging too.

Not having SUV's I think would be a great start of alternate transportation.

And congress is "probing" oil companies for price gouging as we speak.

 

[Mister_T]

You and soyleche seem to be in agreement that it's the government causing price gouging.



Vote libertarian.

Could have fooled me.

 

[SoyLeche]

You have not presented that reference for everybody to see. I got my information from what I read and hear on the news, but apparently it wasn't "good enough." Provide a link for your clams instead of "this is where I got it from." I'm not going to back up your statements for you.

The main differences in our approaches to this is that I have used data and you have used hearsay. But, here you go:

http://exxonmobil.com/Corporate/Files/Corporate/fo_2006.pdf

The data on sales for the US is on page 78.

http://exxonmobil.com/corporate/files/corporate/xom_2006_SAR.pdf

The data on the net income for the United States is on page 43.

Google told me how many gallons are in a barrel.

 

[SoyLeche]

And congress is "probing" oil companies for price gouging as we speak.

And if they find evidence of it, we'll talk about it then. Just because the are "probing" doesn't mean that it is actually there.

I don't see any evidence of it at the moment.

BTW - were you among those who were condemning the Duke Lacross players for raping that lady before the investigation was over? Just curious to see if you only go for "guilty until proven innocent" for corporate america.

 

[Mister_T]

For example - how much money has been spent to fix the problem? Are the problem refineries today the same that were problem refineries yesterday, or are they fixing some, but more start falling apart? Are there attempts to expand production that are being blocked by NIMBY and environmental groups, taking the solution to the problem out of the hands of the companies? Etc.

In one of those articles I posted, it stated that building new refineries would be more costly then simply upgrading the old ones. The solution is to fix up the old ones. It also stated that it appears little if anything was being done to fix this and that an investigation would take place.

 

[SoyLeche]

In one of those articles I posted, it stated that building new refineries would be more costly then simply upgrading the old ones. It also stated that it appears little if anything was being done to fix this and that an investigation would take place.

Again, hearsay. Let's see some data.

 

[SoyLeche]

I mean, cummon - there's got to be a Department of Energy or Commerce study on this online somewhere. Dig through it and see what you can find.

 

[Mister_T]

And if they find evidence of it, we'll talk about it then. Just because the are "probing" doesn't mean that it is actually there.

I don't see any evidence of it at the moment.

BTW - were you among those who were condemning the Duke Lacross players for raping that lady before the investigation was over? Just curious to see if you only go for "guilty until proven innocent" for corporate america.

I see there being evidence for it. That is were you and I disagree, which does not constitute lack of proof.

And as ignorant and off topic as your Duke Lacross comment is, I found them to be innocent long before the investigation was over due to something called "weighing the evidence."

But I guess that's a foreign concept to people who don't align with your thinking.

 

[Reverend Rick]

When I was young, electric bills were cheap. Later on in life, electric bills were killing me. I was upset like many of you are right now about gasoline prices. Instead of crying about it, I put my income tax refund in the stock market with the utility company that was gouging me. I bought 100 shares. The Dow was below 2000 then.

I rolled my dividend back into more shares of stock. I get a dividend check now and it pays my electric bill. Because I did not take a vacation with the tax refund and let the stock ride for 20 years, I can retire not worrying about paying my utility bill now.

I did not rest on my investment. I added insulation and bought a more energy efficient heating system. There are ways to fight back. If you can't beat them, join them. For me it was turn down the thermostat and install a solar water heater. I hang clothes on a line.

I'm thinking that we all should figure out a way to use less gasoline right now and I am looking at oil stocks seriously.

 

[SoyLeche]

I see there being evidence for it. That is were you and I disagree, which does not constitute lack of proof.

No, it doesn't. I don't require proof for your opinion, just for your accusations.

And as ignorant and off topic as your Duke Lacross comment is, I found them to be innocent long before the investigation was over due to something called "weighing the evidence."

Good. So it's just corporate America. Although, I'm still curious what you thought before there was enough evidence to "weigh".

But I guess that's a foreign concept to people who don't align with your thinking.

I'm not entirly sure what you are saying here. Weigh the evidence, by all means. You need to have evidence to weigh though.

 

[Mister_T]

Again, hearsay. Let's see some data.

I suppose they were just bored one day and decided to make something up.

I would hardly call news articles hersay

 

[Mister_T]

No, it doesn't. I don't require proof for your opinion, just for your accusations

And I have provided the facts that have formed my accusations. Your refusal to accept them as such is your problem.

Good. So it's just corporate America. Although, I'm still curious what you thought before there was enough evidence to "weigh".

Whatever sterotype you wish to give me. I have no problems with corporate America as a whole despite what label you're trying to stick on me.

I'm not entirly sure what you are saying here.

It's probably better if you didn't

 

[Mister_T]

When I was young, electric bills were cheap. Later on in life, electric bills were killing me. I was upset like many of you are right now about gasoline prices. Instead of crying about it, I put my income tax refund in the stock market with the utility company that was gouging me. I bought 100 shares. The Dow was below 2000 then.

I rolled my dividend back into more shares of stock. I get a dividend check now and it pays my electric bill. Because I did not take a vacation with the tax refund and let the stock ride for 20 years, I can retire not worrying about paying my utility bill now.

I did not rest on my investment. I added insulation and bought a more energy efficient heating system. There are ways to fight back. If you can't beat them, join them. For me it was turn down the thermostat and install a solar water heater. I hang clothes on a line.

I'm thinking that we all should figure out a way to use less gasoline right now and I am looking at oil stocks seriously.

Interesting solution. Although, I don't think it is feasable for everyone who owns a car.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Let's all talk about ways to save gasoline!

 

[The Seeker]

Let's all talk about ways to save gasoline!

1. buy a fuel efficient car if possible.
2. drive the speed limit. I did this and I get an extra 4-5 miles per gallon.
3. limit trips whenever possible
4. regularly maintain your car.
5. get a programmable thermostat.
6. make your home energy efficient.

You get the point...there are many ways to cut back on gas. Gas prices are going to keep rising as long as we keep driving and wasting energy as much as we currently do. IMO drastic change will only come once gas gets to $4 - $5 per gallon.

 

[Comet]

Greetings from Spokane! Where gas prices stay as high as the HIGHEST prices in California! I don't remember when gas was under $3 for the cheap stuff here.... most of us drive 30 miles to Idaho and get it for 20-50cents cheaper!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Reverend Rick]

1. buy a fuel efficient car if possible.
2. drive the speed limit. I did this and I get an extra 4-5 miles per gallon.
3. limit trips whenever possible
4. regularly maintain your car.
5. get a programmable thermostat.
6. make your home energy efficient.

You get the point...there are many ways to cut back on gas. Gas prices are going to keep rising as long as we keep driving and wasting energy as much as we currently do. IMO drastic change will only come once gas gets to $4 - $5 per gallon.

Great ideas. I was going to stop smoking when cigerettes reached a dollar a pack. :sad4:

I'm not so sure 4 dollar gas will slow folks down. Americans have a love affair with their car. We say we need to make all these trips, but I have but one question.

Why don't very many people commute to work in other cities by plane?