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some questions for muslims on this board

beerisit

Active Member
Law[2] is a system of rules and guidelines which are enforced through social institutions to govern behavior, wherever possible.[3] Laws are made by governments, and nowadays more specifically, by parliaments....Read more.

You are the one who agree that you dont want anyone to force you not to do this not
to do that,and i am saying,yes you are free to do whatever you want,but if against
the law,then you should be punished,and if you escaped this law,then you can't escape
god's law,so do you like the law who is forcing you not to kill,steal..etc.,otherwise punished.
Show me where I've stated that. I'm one of those strange creatures who does right by his fellow man without expectation of reward from a skydaddy, unlike you and other believers.. I also don't do wrong to my fellow man without fear of punishment by the same skydaddy, unlike you and other believers.
Who has a better moral base? Someone seeking reward? Someone attempting to avoid punishment? Or someone like me who behaves in a manner beneficial, as much as possible, to his fellow man, simply because it is the right thing to do?
 
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FearGod

Freedom Of Mind
Show me where I've stated that. I'm one of those strange creatures who does right by his fellow man without expectation of reward from a skydaddy, unlike you and other believers.. I also don't do wrong to my fellow man without fear of punishment by the same skydaddy, unlike you and other believers.
Who has a better moral base? Someone seeking reward? Someone attempting to avoid punishment? Or someone like me who behaves in a manner beneficial, as much as possible, to his fellow man, simply because it is the right thing to do?

as i said to you not all the people are as good as you,so there should be a law to fear them
from harming the others,if all the people are good by themselves similar to you,then we dont
need for any law to protect woman from rape and others from killing,stealing..etc

Yes you are right that there is no need to fear from punishment,and that because you are a good
person and you know yourself will not cause harm to any body,but how can we be assure that
all the people are similar to you.that is why there is police with guns,to fear bad people and not you.

Hope you understand the point.

God also have the record of each one of us,that is why it is called the judgement day.

Then also how can we know how god will judge you and me,if you are good and dont do any harm to
anybody,still god is still the most merciful.

Allah's Apostle (Sallallahu 'Alaihi Wa Sallam) said, "A prostitute was
forgiven by Allah, because, passing by a panting dog near a well and seeing
that the dog was about to die of thirst, she took off her shoe, and tying
it with her head-cover she drew out some water for it. So, Allah forgave
her because of that."

So god forgave all her deeds just because she show mercy towards a dog.

god is merciful,but according to my belief that your method,is like saying to god,
i dont need your mercy ,i am good myself and i will let everybody hate you.

God bless you mate.
 

beerisit

Active Member
Well then the question is. Are all believers so bad (intrinsically)that they need the threat of their God's wrath in order that they behave well? Why is it do you think that believers need that threat in order that they behave as well as non-believers?
 

FearGod

Freedom Of Mind
Well then the question is. Are all believers so bad (intrinsically)that they need the threat of their God's wrath in order that they behave well? Why is it do you think that believers need that threat in order that they behave as well as non-believers?

God made such threats so there will be no excuses,such as how could we know,
no body told us....etc

And so, on that Day their excuse will be of no avail to those who were bent on evildoing, nor will they be allowed to make amends. (30:57)

[Hence,] O you who are bent on denying the truth, make no [empty] excuses today: [in the life to come] you shall be but recompensed for what you were doing [in this world]. (66:7)

[We sent all these] apostles as heralds of glad tidings and as warners, so that men might have no excuse before God after [the coming of] these apostles: and God is indeed almighty, wise. (4:165)
 

beerisit

Active Member
Why do you think that posting passages allegedly from your god, that prove his followers are incapable of good behaviour without the threat of punishment should impress anyone? When non-believers are quite capable of good behaviour without such threats. Are believers just naturally worse people than non-believers? Is this what you are trying to prove? Because you have done it well.
 

FearGod

Freedom Of Mind
Why do you think that posting passages allegedly from your god, that prove his followers are incapable of good behaviour without the threat of punishment should impress anyone? When non-believers are quite capable of good behaviour without such threats. Are believers just naturally worse people than non-believers? Is this what you are trying to prove? Because you have done it well.

That passages are for the disbelievers,because the believers will not do such things.

Again to the 100 time,earth example,if we put laws on earth for crimes,that will not mean
that all people in the world are criminals,but it is a warning for the criminal not to harm the others.

i am sorry that this is my last reply to you,that is your opinion about god and i can do
nothing to change it,and you have nothing to change my opinion about god.

So that kind of discussion will be pointless for both of us,because you have a faith on your own path
and i have a faith on mine.
 

beerisit

Active Member
That passages are for the disbelievers,because the believers will not do such things.

Again to the 100 time,earth example,if we put laws on earth for crimes,that will not mean
that all people in the world are criminals,but it is a warning for the criminal not to harm the others.

i am sorry that this is my last reply to you,that is your opinion about god and i can do
nothing to change it,and you have nothing to change my opinion about god.

So that kind of discussion will be pointless for both of us,because you have a faith on your own path
and i have a faith on mine.
Oh dear, I'm sorry that you fail to see the obvious failures of religion but thanks for your ineffectual attempts to support the particular god you believe in. It's just a shame he doesn't exist.
 

A Troubled Man

Active Member
That passages are for the disbelievers,because the believers will not do such things.

Again to the 100 time,earth example,if we put laws on earth for crimes,that will not mean that all people in the world are criminals,but it is a warning for the criminal not to harm the others.

Funny how prisons are full of believers who you say will not do such things. Further to that, it's quite obvious criminals don't heed warnings.
 

A-ManESL

Well-Known Member
I don't think beerisit you understand Islam. You are literally interpreting external forms of Islam without bothering to understand the context they were delivered in and their real import. What you understand by the terms "Allah", "hell", "heaven" may not be so. Allah is just a symbol for the Everlasting Reality; it can be known more concretely by a specific way, hell and heaven are relative terms for closeness and nearness of the self with the Reality.
 

A Troubled Man

Active Member
I don't think beerisit you understand Islam. You are literally interpreting external forms of Islam without bothering to understand the context they were delivered in and their real import. What you understand by the terms "Allah", "hell", "heaven" may not be so. Allah is just a symbol for the Everlasting Reality; it can be known more concretely by a specific way, hell and heaven are relative terms for closeness and nearness of the self with the Reality.

Placing your own personal perceptions or spins on words we are all able to read for ourselves and then accusing others of misunderstanding due to context and delivery is a fallacy.
 

A-ManESL

Well-Known Member
Placing your own personal perceptions or spins on words we are all able to read for ourselves and then accusing others of misunderstanding due to context and delivery is a fallacy.

These aren't my perceptions. See the books Islam by W.C. Smith and Discourses of Rumi (translation by Arberry). Specifically what did I say that you think is my own perception?
 

sumaidi

ashabul yamin
I have some questions for muslims. Some of these can be generally applied to theists as well, some are more specific to islam.

i suggest you to study islam for whole. find a right teacher. then you will know completely. god promise us that god will make it easy to study koran and haditt.
 

beerisit

Active Member
I don't think beerisit you understand Islam. You are literally interpreting external forms of Islam without bothering to understand the context they were delivered in and their real import. What you understand by the terms "Allah", "hell", "heaven" may not be so. Allah is just a symbol for the Everlasting Reality; it can be known more concretely by a specific way, hell and heaven are relative terms for closeness and nearness of the self with the Reality.
Are you kidding me? My posts are in response to the posts posted by Muslims in this very thread. Why would you think that I have misrepresented Islam, when I have only represented it as Muslims have?
 

A-ManESL

Well-Known Member
Are you kidding me? My posts are in response to the posts posted by Muslims in this very thread. Why would you think that I have misrepresented Islam, when I have only represented it as Muslims have?

I never said you were misrepresenting Islam. I said I don't think you understand Islam. You framed your posts in such a way that gave me this impression.

It's just a shame he doesn't exist.

This is your opinion based on lack of understanding.
 

beenie

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
eselam said:
Women outnumber men, read upon statistics. A woman, when pregnant or when having her periods, is not to have sex so both husband and wife refrain from having sex. If she had 4 husbands and was pregnant they'd all have to wait for her. Women can wait longer than men I'll just mention the word 'logic' here and I'm sure you can join the dots.

Pregnant women aren't allowed to have intercourse in Islam? Brother, where did you get that? If that's the case, I broke A LOT of rules. :eek:
 

FearGod

Freedom Of Mind
Pregnant women aren't allowed to have intercourse in Islam? Brother, where did you get that? If that's the case, I broke A LOT of rules. :eek:

No i dont think you are broking the rules,but i guess eslam made a mistake.:)

Regarding that funny question by LeftishBritInPA about why woman arent allowed to marry 4 while men can do.

if the woman slept each night with one husband then if she got pregnant,then who is the real father.

i dont know if there is an answer by LeftishBritInPA :shrug:
 

beerisit

Active Member
No i dont think you are broking the rules,but i guess eslam made a mistake.:)

Regarding that funny question by LeftishBritInPA about why woman arent allowed to marry 4 while men can do.

if the woman slept each night with one husband then if she got pregnant,then who is the real father.

i dont know if there is an answer by LeftishBritInPA :shrug:
And who the father is in such a patriarchal society is the most important thing in the world. LOL
 

A Troubled Man

Active Member
These aren't my perceptions. See the books Islam by W.C. Smith and Discourses of Rumi (translation by Arberry). Specifically what did I say that you think is my own perception?

The simple fact that you are telling others they don't understand Islam, it's just a lame fallacious excuse.
 
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