Supporting Trump, now a religion?

[omega2xx]

So you agree: Constantine invented christianity, by fabricating the first Official Christian Bible™.

Christianity was developed long before Constantine was born and he never played a part in determining the canon of Scripture. are you getting all f these weird ideas?

And then he went on to murder anyone who refused to join his newly-minted cult.

What he did is irrelevant. Some scholar doubt if he was a Christian.

Without that program of mass murder and forced conversion? The silly death-cult that was "christianity" would have died off like last years harvest.

You need a new source of information.

 

[omega2xx]

Re-written to fit the narrative. Duuuhhhh... show me a NON-BIBLICAL source.

What? You can't?

Interesting....

I don't need to unless you can show the Bible is wrong, and you can't.

 

[omega2xx]

"
The word "Creator" in the founding documents has nothing to do with god(s). Deists view nature as their creator. Which is the secular/atheistic position. The constitution in America is a secular document, governing a secular society.
The founding fathers weren't christian, they were escaping religious persecution from christians. No where in school was anyone taught that christians founded America. The only people who play that card is RW media. And they're not an honest/moral bunch anyways.

You need a better source. None of what you say is true.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

There is such a thing as righteous anger. A loving God should get angry over how some people are treated. If God doe snot get angry about Isis, He is not a loving God.

Cool. What has he done about it? But then there were multiple incidents in Genesis where your god was angry that people weren't using free will (that he gave them) for what he wanted them to use it for (which defeats the purpose of free will,) so he angrily destroys the whole world. Oh, but he's a good god because he's just so mad about ISIS. Right.

Same thing with jealously. If God loves me and i am worshiping another god, jealously would be an indication of His love for me,

Jealousy is never a good thing. Ever. If your god is jealous of another god, then that indicates weakness on his part. Yet, why would the "only perfect god" need to be jealous, anyways? Doesn't quite track.

I have no idea what "lack of forethought" refers to.

Your god supposedly knows everything. Yet he still saw fit to put the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, as well as the Tree of Life, in Eden, and allow for temptation to take root. Then blames Adam and Eve for what he knew would happen, and could have avoided. The claims of perfection fall flat, and no amount of "god works in mysterious ways" can justify the inconsistencies.

Only 1 person in the Bible does it say God hated, Esau.

And Enchanters, Witches, Charmers, Wizards, Necromancers (Deuteronomy 18:10-11), The wicked and those who love violence (despite him advocating violence himself) (Psalm 11:5), Workers of iniquity (Psalm 5:5), and then there are also the Egyptians, the Samaritans, the people of Sodom and Gomorrah, the Hittites, the Girga****es, the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites whom your god counted as enemies of him. Probably more, at that.

You need a better source. None of what you say is true.

Everything he said was true.

 

[omega2xx]

Cool. What has he done about it?

Are you suggesting God should eliminate our free will?

But then there were multiple incidents in Genesis where your god was angry that people weren't using free will (that he gave them) for what he wanted them to use it for (which defeats the purpose of free will,) so he angrily destroys the whole world. Oh, but he's a good god because he's just so mad about ISIS. Right.

Give me the references so I can tell if you understand what is being said.

Jealousy is never a good thing. Ever.

Your OPINION is noted and rejected.

If your god is jealous of another god, then that indicates weakness on his part. Yet, why would the "only perfect god" need to be jealous, anyways? Doesn't quite track.

Since there are no other gods, He can't' be jealous of them.

Your god supposedly knows everything. Yet he still saw fit to put the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, as well as the Tree of Life, in Eden, and allow for temptation to take root. Then blames Adam and Eve for what he knew would happen, and could have avoided. The claims of perfection fall flat, and no amount of "god works in mysterious ways" can justify the inconsistencies.

One thing people need to learn is obedience and the consequences of disobedience. Would you prefer God made us all robots? Does your god not have rules? Is that tempting you to break them?

And Enchanters, Witches, Charmers, Wizards, Necromancers (Deuteronomy 18:10-11), The wicked and those who love violence (despite him advocating violence himself) (Psalm 11:5), Workers of iniquity (Psalm 5:5), and then there are also the Egyptians, the Samaritans, the people of Sodom and Gomorrah, the Hittites, the Girga****es, the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites whom your god counted as enemies of him. Probably more, at that.

Your usual rant is not based on reality.

Everything he said was true.

Then why don't you beiieve it

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

The left is just as guilty



Some are, some are not. Most are not, and every year it seems to get worse.

In this, we are in agreement: Politics -- on all sides-- has taken a nasty turn for the worse.

I wonder of some of the original Founding types were not correct, in that Revolution is the only solution to fixing things?

I certainly hope *not*... but trumpnazi is so very much like Hitler: the Early Years.

We shall see-- if the trump'en'furer gets impeached? Then there may be hope for the Republic after all...

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

IMO, America was never a Christian nation, but it was a lot closer to being one when the constitution was written, than it is now.

I don't understand why non-believers cant' see the connection that as America has gotten farther away from God, the worse we have become.

The "worse"? Seriously? Back when God was the Law of the Nation? We had slavery. And women were forbidden to vote-- and in may states? Forbidden to own forking property!

But it was "better" back then?

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Are you suggesting God should eliminate our free will?

If your bible is accurate? There is no free will-- the bible's words do not support it.

Indeed, not even the NT supports free will-- the fine verse wherein "No man comes to the Father, except the spirit draws him" (John 6:44)

That right there seems to wreck any notions of "free will".

But there is a stronger argument against: The bible describes god as all-powerful.

An all-powerful being eliminates all free will automatically.

Because free will is an exercise in power--even if slight.

All Powerful means: All The Power Belongs To It.

So if god grants free will? (in spite of there being NO biblical reference) That means god is no longer "All Powerful" -- but is powerless to force people against their will.

Except poor old Pharaoh-- you remember? God hardens his heart, preventing his free will...

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

I don't need to unless you can show the Bible is wrong, and you can't.

Show me NON-BIBLE sources: you keep forgetting your bible is your CLAIM.

You cannot point to your CLAIM to "support" your ... claim...

That is circular argument or Boot-Strapping. A logical fallacy.

 

[Underhill]

To all the colder wearers? I say a hearty R'Amen.

I have a little sticker on the back of my car-- it's white. It has a pair of meatballs, and some noodly appendages.

(I had Darwin fish, but those keep getting vandalized by Genuine Christians™. I know it's them, because they always leave me a very nasty note to go with the scratched paint and damaged emblem... Just as Jesus would have done... right? )

Similar to this:

Yeah, I had the shark on the back of my car. Occasionally I would get an irate christian flipping me the bird. Always struck me as more than a little ironic.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Are you suggesting God should eliminate our free will?

How about you try answering the question first, then we can shift gears; you claim your god is angry about ISIS, as a loving god, but what has he done about them? How do you even know he's angry about them?

Give me the references so I can tell if you understand what is being said.

1) Shouldn't you know your own holy book well enough?
2) Unless you can factually disprove it, you don't get to tell me what I do and do not understand.

Since there are no other gods, He can't' be jealous of them.

And yet, by his own words, he is a jealous god. If there aren't any other gods (your opinion is noted and rejected,) then how can he be a jealous god?

Your usual rant is not based on reality.

Of course it is, and I even provided you the verses from your own holy book that back them up. Those are people that your god hates. Nations that he considers enemies. Your opinion is flatly and factually wrong.

Then why don't you beiieve it

It should be very clear to you that I am in agreement with what was said; no belief is required as it is known, recorded, and historical fact.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Yeah, I had the shark on the back of my car. Occasionally I would get an irate christian flipping me the bird. Always struck me as more than a little ironic.

Indeed.

 

[tytlyf]

You need a better source. None of what you say is true.

America is a secular country governed by a secular constitution - fact
The founding fathers were deists who view nature as their 'creator' - fact
RW media lies about the founding of the country to keep you entertained - fact

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

How about you try answering the question first, then we can shift gears; you claim your god is angry about ISIS, as a loving god, but what has he done about them? How do you even know he's angry about them?


1) Shouldn't you know your own holy book well enough?
2) Unless you can factually disprove it, you don't get to tell me what I do and do not understand.


And yet, by his own words, he is a jealous god. If there aren't any other gods (your opinion is noted and rejected,) then how can he be a jealous god?


Of course it is, and I even provided you the verses from your own holy book that back them up. Those are people that your god hates. Nations that he considers enemies. Your opinion is flatly and factually wrong.


It should be very clear to you that I am in agreement with what was said; no belief is required as it is known, recorded, and historical fact.

A very succinct post. Omega will ignore you, as is his habit. Likely he will call you names too. It seems to be his style.

 

[Kapalika]

Ya, I'm not reading past page 5 or 10 since most of the posts are exchanges I have no interest in.

I suspect that many of these people might not know the difference between religion and politics. Nor, in fact, anything substantive about either. Their religion and politics are no more considered or meaningful than being a hard-core fan of a sport's team.

That's an actually interesting take I hadn't ever thought of before, it makes you realize how stupid they are, to put it simply. What I mean is, it actually explains how non-nonchalant I've seen many people be in my life, as if their religious beliefs or political beliefs have no real world impact on the people around them that they mistreat. As if it's all some game.

It actually explains the mindset of a lot of people in general, actually. Okay, like, I get the tribalism at play... but I honestly never considered that people see it as shallow/deep as say having a sportsteam they feel they are a part of. I've seen how people approach sports, acting like it's 'their' team and that there is kinship with fellow fans... even seen it with fandoms... but to consider religion or politics like that? Just baffles me. I can get feeling fellowship with people of the same religion, but to treat either religion or politics as equal to other tribal like things is just, fills me with disgust and anger, actually. People ****ing die and suffer over this **** it isn't a ****ing game.

 

[omega2xx]

In this, we are in agreement: Politics -- on all sides-- has taken a nasty turn for the worse.

Why do you think that is?

I wonder of some of the original Founding types were not correct, in that Revolution is the only solution to fixing things?

Revolution will not solve our problems. No matter which side wins, the rights of other side will be suppressed. We have already seen this in the Obama administration, where the IRS made it harder for conservative organizations to get certain benefits the lefties got much quicker.

Would you like to see Black Lives Matter, be in power?

I certainly hope *not*... but trumpnazi is so very much like Hitler: the Early Years.

We shall see-- if the trump'en'furer gets impeached? Then there may be hope for the Republic after all...

You lefties are pathetic in your characterization of Trump.

You are like little children eating sour grapes.

 

[omega2xx]

You are like little children eating sour grapes.

The "worse"? Seriously? Back when God was the Law of the Nation? We had slavery. And women were forbidden to vote-- and in may states? Forbidden to own forking property!

But it was "better" back then?

Even with those bad things, America was still better overall. Also Americans saw the injustice of these things and corrected them. Since then America has become more violent, more dishonest, more lawless, more disrespect for authority, including parents, and many ON THE LEFT BLAME AMERICA FIRST for all the evil in the world.

 

[omega2xx]

If your bible is accurate? There is no free will-- the bible's words do not support it.

Indeed, not even the NT supports free will-- the fine verse wherein "No man comes to the Father, except the spirit draws him" (John 6:44)

That right there seems to wreck any notions of "free will".

That is part of Presbyterian theology, which I am wedded to. The Bible speaks of both---God's sovereignty and man's free will. That is a theological knot man has unsuccessfully being trying to untie since they started studying the Bible.

I am not going to untie it, but I am going to loosen it a bit. "God's sovereignty and man's responsibility is an antinomy---2 apparent truths that seem to contradict each other and you cant play one against the other without destroying them both---Wen you were born did you start living or dying---is cleaving separating or joining?

Instead of saying they are contradictory, I say they SEEM contradictory because my understanding is lacking.

But there is a stronger argument against: The bible describes god as all-powerful.

An all-powerful being eliminates all free will automatically.

Because free will is an exercise in power--even if slight.

All Powerful means: All The Power Belongs To It.

So if god grants free will? (in spite of there being NO biblical reference) That means god is no longer "All Powerful" -- but is powerless to force people against their will.

All powerful means "can", not "does." It is obvious that Ada, and Eve had free will in the Garden or God would not have said to them, "you can freely eat for any tree, but not from the Tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

Except poor old Pharaoh-- you remember? God hardens his heart, preventing his free will...

Only for the first 3 of the plagues to show His power over the Egyptian gods to the Egyptians and to the Jews. After that Pharaoh hardened his own heart---But when Pharaoh saw there was relief, HE HARDENED HIS HEART and did not listen to them as the Lord had said. If he had obeyed at that time, the plagues would have been over.

 

[omega2xx]

How about you try answering the question first, then we can shift gears; you claim your god is angry about ISIS, as a loving god, but what has he done about them? How do you even know he's angry about them?

God haters sin. What isis does is sin.

Psa 11:5b - ...and the one who loves violence, His soul hates.

Prove 6:16 list 7 things God hates. One is hands that shed innocent blood. Another is a heart that devises wicked plans.

Do those not descdribe isis?


1) Shouldn't you know your own holy book well enough?

I have just shown that I do, not it is your turn.

2) Unless you can factually disprove it, you don't get to tell me what I do and do not understand.

I can't disdprove what you are unwilling to posgt.

And yet, by his own words, he is a jealous god. If there aren't any other gods (your opinion is noted and rejected,) then how can he be a jealous god?,,

There are many gods including the one(s) you worship. They are real in the minds of men and they are worshiped. A loving God would be jealous for His people to put man-made god before Him, because it is not good for them That is His first commandment. There is nothing to indicate jealously keep one from being a God.

Of course it is, and I even provided you the verses from your own holy book that back them up. Those are people that your god hates. Nations that he considers enemies. Your opinion is flatly and factually wrong.

What is flatly and factually wrong is you understanding of the "Bible---For God so loved the WORLD. God doe snot hate people, He hates what they do because sin is not good for anyone.

It should be very clear to you that I am in agreement with what was said; no belief is required as it is known, recorded, and historical fact.

Belief(faith) is required in Christianity. It is the only way we can pleas God(Heb 11:6.

Now it is your turn, What does you god require?

 

[omega2xx]

America is a secular country governed by a secular constitution - fact

Agreed.

The founding fathers were deists who view nature as their 'creator' - fact

Wrong:


Religious Affiliation
of U.S. Founding Fathers # of
Founding
Fathers % of
Founding
Fathers
Episcopalian/Anglican 88 54.7%
Presbyterian 30 18.6%
Congregationalist 27 16.8%
Quaker 7 4.3%
Dutch Reformed/German Reformed 6 3.7%
Lutheran 5 3.1%
Catholic 3 1.9%
Huguenot 3 1.9%
Unitarian 3 1.9%
Methodist 2 1.2%
Calvinist 1 0.6%
TOTAL 204

RW media lies about the founding of the country to keep you entertained - fact[

Silly. Truth is interesting, but not entertaining. FACT

The LW media, lies about all history that incLudes religion of any kind, especially conservative Christianity: FACT