Teacher threesome scandal

[columbus]

I must have been at the only school in the entire universe where some students wanted to get intimate with good looking teachers, male or female.

But perhaps the US is just different.

Oh no. I had the hots for some young priests, back when I thought 25 was old. I've slept with some. (We actually slept).
But I never ran into one sufficiently immoral to use me in any way. I must have been a really ugly 14.

Tom

 

[Apple Sugar]

I must have been at the only school in the entire universe where some students wanted to get intimate with good looking teachers, male or female.

But perhaps the US is just different.

It isn't odd that kids feeling their hormones surge want to get busy with good looking people.
What is odd is when an adult wants to sleep with a child. That's why the law insures that doesn't happen until there is an age of consent accord reached by law. If that only happens in America, good for us.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

It isn't odd that kids feeling their hormones surge want to get busy with good looking people.
What is odd is when an adult wants to sleep with a child. That's why the law insures that doesn't happen until there is an age of consent accord reached by law. If that only happens in America, good for us.

... or not good for us when we're locking away otherwise qualified people who provide professional services that improve our society.

It's obscenely stupid for us to be looking for stupid reasons to lock people away so we can pat ourselves on the back looking like the idiots that we are for enforcing inane laws.

We are only hurting ourselves while laying blame on someone who could actually do us good, placing them in the same hole with people who do society harm.

Morons! Thieves! Self-loathing pseudo-moralists!

 

[Flankerl]

It isn't odd that kids feeling their hormones surge want to get busy with good looking people.
What is odd is when an adult wants to sleep with a child. That's why the law insures that doesn't happen until there is an age of consent accord reached by law. If that only happens in America, good for us.

The Problem seems to be that you consider 16 year olds as kids.
They might be a lot of things but being kids is not among them. Its not even Pedophilia anymore which usually ends when a kid enters puberty.
After which Hebephilia takes over and later gets booted out by Ephebophilia. Which is where a 16 year old would be.

And as far as age of consent is concerned its 14 here, with some asterisks.

 

[Apple Sugar]

... or not good for us when we're locking away otherwise qualified people who provide professional services that improve our society.

It's obscenely stupid for us to be looking for stupid reasons to lock people away so we can pat ourselves on the back looking like the idiots that we are for enforcing inane laws.

We are only hurting ourselves while laying blame on someone who could actually do us good, placing them in the same hole with people who do society harm.

Morons! Thieves! Self-loathing pseudo-moralists!

Good thing none of that obscenely stupid stuff you mention applies here. Pedophiles nor Ephebophiles improve the American society. That's why we don't tolerate them raping our children.

 

[columbus]

Yeah, I'm not at all in favour of incarceration in any circumstances other than when the offender poses a serious risk to the safety of others. Otherwise, I just don't see the point of it. I believe the consequence of any wrongdoing should have some logical connection to the wrongful act, like being fired because you have abused your authority. I don't think making a 16 year old's wildest sexual fantasy come true is wrong, unless you have a duty of care (as teachers do) or you are the initiator and use pressure or coercion to overcome their misgivings.

Maybe incarceration isn't the best punishment, I'd agree with you on that. What do you suggest? Cut off their noses? Public flogging?

Let's take gender and sex out of this.
Suppose Bob and Jack were bank employees who used their position to embezzle Adam's life savings to buy heroin. Adam complains and Bob and Jack are arrested and convicted.

Of course B and J lose their jobs and won't ever get hired by another bank. That isn't
punishment, that is just employers protecting themselves and their customers. They have to pay Adam back, even if it leaves them broke and homeless. That isn't punishment either. Then the government imposes the penalty for embezzlement. Whatever it is the penalty was already determined when they chose to risk getting it.

But there is also another crime. While you and I agree that drug laws are stupid they are on the books. The consequences of getting caught embezzling have nothing to do with buying heroin. Similarly, these two women are also on the hook for another crime. Related, but separate and with additional penalties.

They knew all this when they decided that some teen dick was worth the risk.

When I was 15, I was wildly infatuated with a 23 year old. He had the conscience and willpower to fend me off for a couple years, but if he hadn't, he certainly wouldn't have deserved to get in trouble with the law.

Like my story, your anecdote isn't all that relevant. You were smart enough to pick someone smart enough to wait until you were at least legal. Not all stupid teens are so lucky.

Tom

 

[Apple Sugar]

The Problem seems to be that you consider 16 year olds as kids.
They might be a lot of things but being kids is not among them. Its not even Pedophilia anymore which usually ends when a kid enters puberty.
After which Hebephilia takes over and later gets booted out by Ephebophilia. Which is where a 16 year old would be.

And as far as age of consent is concerned its 14 here, with some asterisks.

I guess you didn't read me earlier wherein I recognized these teachers as Ephebophiles.
And 16 year old's are minors. They can rightly be called a kid. "Child" , would be the misnomer.

 

[Alceste]

I must have been at the only school in the entire universe where some students wanted to get intimate with good looking teachers, male or female.

But perhaps the US is just different.

I had a hot social studies teacher. Vavoom.

 

[Alceste]

No... Theres at least one other one... mine. And, you know, as much as I hate the male vs. female double standard, were I in his position, I would have probably went along with the threesome as well... Regardless of the gender combination.

Again, this is not a double standard. The teachers are being prosecuted as aggressively as they would have been if male, and nobody here has defended their behaviour.

Boy, do I ever get sick of people comparing actual news stories and public reactions to hypothetical news stories and public reactions that never happened, then complaining about some imagined injustice between the two. Can we all stop doing that? Please? As a personal favour to me?

 

[Alceste]

Maybe incarceration isn't the best punishment, I'd agree with you on that. What do you suggest? Cut off their noses? Public flogging?

Let's take gender and sex out of this.
Suppose Bob and Jack were bank employees who used their position to embezzle Adam's life savings to buy heroin. Adam complains and Bob and Jack are arrested and convicted.

Of course B and J lose their jobs and won't ever get hired by another bank. That isn't
punishment, that is just employers protecting themselves and their customers. They have to pay Adam back, even if it leaves them broke and homeless. That isn't punishment either. Then the government imposes the penalty for embezzlement. Whatever it is the penalty was already determined when they chose to risk getting it.

But there is also another crime. While you and I agree that drug laws are stupid they are on the books. The consequences of getting caught embezzling have nothing to do with buying heroin. Similarly, these two women are also on the hook for another crime. Related, but separate and with additional penalties.

They knew all this when they decided that some teen dick was worth the risk.


Like my story, your anecdote isn't all that relevant. You were smart enough to pick someone smart enough to wait until you were at least legal. Not all stupid teens are so lucky.

Tom

I was legal at the time. The age of consent used to be 14. I expect he just preferred more mature and experienced women, so he fended me off until I was one.

I think cause and consequence is a more effective rehabilitation tool than punishment. You have to admit, being sacked from one's teaching job for abuse of authority would totally suck, and the worst sucky part of it would be knowing you brought it on yourself. The younger teacher, at 24, will still be tens of thousands of dollars in debt from her degree, and only qualified for one job, which she will be prohibited from ever having again. Try digging yourself out of that by slinging lattes at Starbucks. I don't feel the need to punish people. Mostly, people punish themselves more than enough to satisfy my thirst for justice.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Good thing none of that obscenely stupid stuff you mention applies here. Pedophiles nor Ephebophiles improve the American society. That's why we don't tolerate them raping our children.

You might be talking about pedophiles. That's off topic, and illustrative of the stupidity that characterizes this discussion.

 

[columbus]

@Alceste...

Well, once again we mostly agree. I personally think the age of consent needs to be much older than 14. This isn't the 19th century any more. But I am not in charge or a lot of stuff would be very different. Donald Rumsfeld would be waterboarded until I was satisfied.

I don't feel the need to punish people. Mostly, people punish themselves more than enough to satisfy my thirst for justice.

I also oppose punishment as vengeance. But rape is different from most crimes, especially statutory rape. It causes so much damage and is so rarely detected. And even when it is the perps usually don't think that they did anything wrong because it was consensual. The motivations are often extremely murky and the circumstances hard to ascertain. We just can't make exceptions for circumstances that seem less destructive than the worst case scenarios. Too many children's health is at stake. I've seen the long term damage done by child sex abuse. You can't fix it, you can't compensate, all that can be done once it's happened is come down hard.
Of course it would be better if we could teach children how and why to avoid it. But they are kids, they haven't learned yet. That's why we have to protect them with the poor tools we have.

I'm not big on incarceration. But I don't have a better way to protect kids.

Tom

 

[Apple Sugar]

You might be talking about pedophiles. That's off topic, and illustrative of the stupidity that characterizes this discussion.

I would think dysfunctional illiteracy would be illustrative of the stupidity that characterizes this discussion since I've never identified these predator teachers as pedophiles. Nor are they to be construed as pedophiles when their victim was a late post-pubescent teen. Rather, as I've said repeatedly, they are (allegedly) Ephebophiles.

E P H E B O P H I l E S

 

[Apple Sugar]

I wonder if these type attitudes would arrive if these teachers, if any teacher, had raped the child of those who dismiss this rape when it is someone elses child?

Well, once again we mostly agree. I personally think the age of consent needs to be much older than 14. This isn't the 19th century any more. But I am not in charge or a lot of stuff would be very different. Donald Rumsfeld would be waterboarded until I was satisfied.


I also oppose punishment as vengeance. But rape is different from most crimes, especially statutory rape. It causes so much damage and is so rarely detected. And even when it is the perps usually don't think that they did anything wrong because it was consensual. The motivations are often extremely murky and the circumstances hard to ascertain. We just can't make exceptions for circumstances that seem less destructive than the worst case scenarios. Too many children's health is at stake. I've seen the long term damage done by child sex abuse. You can't fix it, you can't compensate, all that can be done once it's happened is come down hard.
Of course it would be better if we could teach children how and why to avoid it. But they are kids, they haven't learned yet. That's why we have to protect them with the poor tools we have.

I'm not big on incarceration. But I don't have a better way to protect kids.

Tom

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I would think functional illiteracy would be illustrative of the stupidity that characterizes this discussion since I've never identified these predator teachers as pedophiles. Nor are they to be construed as pedophiles when their victim was a late post-pubescent teen. Rather, as I've said repeatedly, they are (allegedly) Ephebophiles.

E P H E B O P H I l E S

Stupid people use dictionaries, too.

Need proof?

 

[Apple Sugar]

Stupid people use dictionaries, too.

Need proof?

God be with you. :shout

 

[angellous_evangellous]

God be with you. :shout

And also with you.

No need making this discussion more painful than it already is by taking it off topic.

 

[Apple Sugar]

I have never taken this off topic. Save to be distracted by someone who engages in personal attacks and goading.

Thanks. Have a good night.

This should keep things square and educate the ignorant as to the OP itself.



Ephebophilia
Sexual preference by an older person—usually understood to be an older man—for a girl in mid-to-late adolescence—the consummation of which is illegal in most jurisdictions

 

[Triumphant_Loser]

Again, this is not a double standard. The teachers are being prosecuted as aggressively as they would have been if male, and nobody here has defended their behaviour.

Boy, do I ever get sick of people comparing actual news stories and public reactions to hypothetical news stories and public reactions that never happened, then complaining about some imagined injustice between the two. Can we all stop doing that? Please? As a personal favour to me?

Except for the fact that I wasn't talking about their prosecution, I was talking about society's double standard views as a whole. Go to any article covering this story and read the comments and you'll see something along the lines of "lucky bas****" or "where were these teachers when I was in school?" Whereas if it were pertaining to two men you'd get something like "let them rot in jail," or "chop their d*** off."

Chill.

 

[Apple Sugar]

Except for the fact that I wasn't talking about their prosecution, I was talking about society's double standard views as a whole. Go to any article covering this story and read the comments and you'll see something along the lines of "lucky bas****" or "where were these teachers when I was in school?" Whereas if it were pertaining to two men you'd get something like "let them rot in jail," or "chop their d*** off."

Chill.

Very true. I've seen that happen with every news story like this when comments open on a discussion forum.
Seems people think a woman can't take advantage of a teen boy. But men are always the grimy predator no matter the age of the young woman and as long as she's under 18. It's disgusting.

These attitudes don't accompany those stories about teen boys being molested or raped by priests. There's no remarks like, "lucky b......! Where was that priest when I was in church?"
It's just the women predators that are tolerated, dismissed. Even defended as unworthy of being held responsible and incarcerated for their trespasses against a kid.
Most of those who are of that mind set probably don't have children. That's the only guess I have for their attitudes.