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The 144.000 Jews.

nPeace

Veteran Member
IMV, I believe he his talking in generalities here, and then only for a time. We understand that it was the Jews that first started His Church by the thousands upon thousands. So the "lost sheep" were found. Thus, I believe he is talking in generalities. Even today there are many of the Jewish nation that accept the Messiah.

Even Paul said, Romans 11:17 "And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree"

Some points:
1) "some branches be broken off" means that not all branches were broken off. God is not finished with His chosen people.
2) I believe he was talking to the those who were ruling and in charge of disseminating God's word. In that sense, "yes", it was given to the Gentiles (but Jews are still included for they believed) - but even the gentiles can be removed "20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
3) The "root... of the olive tree" is talking about Israel. So, IMV, He delivers back to the Jewish people the charge of disseminating His salvation. So... it was the Jews first, then the Gentiles and ultimately back to the Jews.​

:) BUT, of course, I let God have the ultimate say so as these are just my views.

It makes sense to me that since the new nation is not a fleshly nation, not under obligation to be circumcised by flesh, the people of all nations - whether Jew, or gentile - make up those who come into the fold.
So they are neither Jew nor Gentile, in God's eyes, but they are referred to as Jews in a spiritual sense.
Hence why Jesus, when making the promise to those that stuck with him, he said, "I make a covenant with you, just as my Father has made a covenant with me, for a kingdom, so that you may eat and drink at my table in my Kingdom, and sit on thrones to judge the 12 tribes of Israel." Luke 22:28-30

If they are judging the 12 tribes of Israel (which are obviously spiritual, and not fleshly), then we can appreciate that the 144,000 are spiritual Jews (not fleshly) who will rule (Rev. 7:4), and the twelve tribes of Israel (not fleshly), who are ruled over - the subjects of the kingdom (Rev. 7:9).
As calm pointed out, they are the earthly subjects who are guided to waters of life.

That's how I understand it.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
It makes sense to me that since the new nation is not a fleshly nation, not under obligation to be circumcised by flesh, the people of all nations - whether Jew, or gentile - make up those who come into the fold.
So they are neither Jew nor Gentile, in God's eyes, but they are referred to as Jews in a spiritual sense.
Hence why Jesus, when making the promise to those that stuck with him, he said, "I make a covenant with you, just as my Father has made a covenant with me, for a kingdom, so that you may eat and drink at my table in my Kingdom, and sit on thrones to judge the 12 tribes of Israel." Luke 22:28-30

If they are judging the 12 tribes of Israel (which are obviously spiritual, and not fleshly), then we can appreciate that the 144,000 are spiritual Jews (not fleshly) who will rule (Rev. 7:4), and the twelve tribes of Israel (not fleshly), who are ruled over - the subjects of the kingdom (Rev. 7:9).
As calm pointed out, they are the earthly subjects who are guided to waters of life.

That's how I understand it.
Interesting nPeace.

There is much in what you said that is so good. Indeed, it is a spiritual nation and thus, in Him, "there is neither Jew nor Greek, male or female..."

Have you had the thought that I have had? It seems like there are twelve people judging the 12 tribes of Israel but scripture talks about the 24 elders who sit on thrones. Who are the other 12?

It's one of those things I need to ask when I get to Heaven. :)
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
@KenS
Let's end the discussion. It's pointless, no matter how long we talk, you won't understand it and you will twist everything in the Bible as it suits you.
God's bless.
Come on calm. I think the same can be said of you, and you might say the same of me. So isn't it better to try to reason on it?

Can you show where the Bible irrefutably proves the 144,000 are in heaven.
If after that, he dismisses that, then I say you have every reason to give up. :D
So what do you say?
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Come on calm. I think the same can be said of you, and you might say the same of me. So isn't it better to try to reason on it?

Can you show where the Bible irrefutably proves the 144,000 are in heaven.
If after that, he dismisses that, then I say you have every reason to give up. :D
So what do you say?
Thank you nPeace! I was surprised at the response... I thought we were having a great discussion.

On a side note... I do believe that after being on earth they will be in Heaven. But it does say the "multitude" were already in Heaven, doesn't it?
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
Interesting nPeace.

There is much in what you said that is so good. Indeed, it is a spiritual nation and thus, in Him, "there is neither Jew nor Greek, male or female..."
Good. We agree on that.

Have you had the thought that I have had? It seems like there are twelve people judging the 12 tribes of Israel but scripture talks about the 24 elders who sit on thrones. Who are the other 12?
Why do you say twelve people. On what scriptural grounds?
The question about the 24 elders is a good one.
I have my understanding of that, but I don't believe it will satisfy you. ;)

It's one of those things I need to ask when I get to Heaven. :)
You are not going to heaven Ken? :D Nor I. :)
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Why do you say twelve people. On what scriptural grounds?
The question about the 24 elders is a good one.
I have my understanding of that, but I don't believe it will satisfy you. ;)

I could be wrong... I certainly am NOT the know-it-all for God is too much for my puny mind and the Bible is too big.

So I "assume"... uh oh! :)

29 And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me; 30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

"I appoint you" (speaking to the twelve - Judas being replaced) seem to have the connotation that the twelve will be ruling. "Drink at my table and my kingdom" - seems to denote Heaven. "sit on thrones" - seems to give the understanding that they will be sitting on 12 thrones judging twelve tribes.

But I always can be wrong.

You are not going to heaven Ken? :D Nor I. :)

:) I could be wrong. If I am wrong, I will have a great time on earth.

If I am right, I will be enjoying the worship saying with "a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands 10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb."

Certainly it wasn't 144,000 on that chorus.
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
Thank you nPeace! I was surprised at the response... I thought we were having a great discussion.

On a side note... I do believe that after being on earth they will be in Heaven. But it does say the "multitude" were already in Heaven, doesn't it?
We know the 144,000 are ruling in heaven, because Mount Zion represent heaven, where God resides.... as well as the scriptures that link them to those who rule with Christ for the thousand years.

How do we know the great multitude are not in heaven, but on earth?
Compare Revelation 7:15-17 with Revelation 21:3, 4
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
I could be wrong... I certainly am NOT the know-it-all for God is too much for my puny mind and the Bible is too big.

So I "assume"... uh oh! :)

29 And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me; 30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

"I appoint you" (speaking to the twelve - Judas being replaced) seem to have the connotation that the twelve will be ruling. "Drink at my table and my kingdom" - seems to denote Heaven. "sit on thrones" - seems to give the understanding that they will be sitting on 12 thrones judging twelve tribes.

But I always can be wrong.



:) I could be wrong. If I am wrong, I will have a great time on earth.

If I am right, I will be enjoying the worship saying with "a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands 10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb."

Certainly it wasn't 144,000 on that chorus.
Yup. You're wrong. :D
It's great, you show a humble attitude though.
Yes, you can be of the great multitude, as I hope to be. It would be great to see you among those.
However, even if we are not a part of the great multitude, we can both be part of the millions of resurrected ones. That would be great too. Then we can meet in person. :)
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
We know the 144,000 are ruling in heaven, because Mount Zion represent heaven, where God resides.... as well as the scriptures that link them to those who rule with Christ for the thousand years.

How do we know the great multitude are not in heaven, but on earth?
Compare Revelation 7:15-17 with Revelation 21:3, 4

First. I agree that there will be a rule on earth for a thousand years and He will rule with his rulers. Yes, the 144,000 will be in Heaven, (Rev 14), with a time frame between Rev 7

Honest question. Where do you get that the 144,000 will be ruing in Heaven?

As far as people in Heaven... I just don' see it.

9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; 10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, 12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.

These are with angels about the throne with the elders. Just don't see how that can be on earth at this point

13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Here it is also clear that they came out of the great tribulation (which means they have left earth)

15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. 16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

At one point, they even ask when they will be avenged.

So... at this point... (and I'm always open to learn and certainly have changed positions before when convinced or when I find scripture that says I'm wrong)... I can't see it your way.

CAVEAT!

It doesn't change my respect for you and certainly I don't see it as a dividing line. It will be what it will be.

Blessings,

Ken
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Yup. You're wrong. :D
It's great, you show a humble attitude though.
Yes, you can be of the great multitude, as I hope to be. It would be great to see you among those.
However, even if we are not a part of the great multitude, we can both be part of the millions of resurrected ones. That would be great too. Then we can meet in person. :)
It will be a pleasure to give you a Christ hug!!
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
First. I agree that there will be a rule on earth for a thousand years and He will rule with his rulers. Yes, the 144,000 will be in Heaven, (Rev 14), with a time frame between Rev 7

Honest question. Where do you get that the 144,000 will be ruing in Heaven?
You'll have to connect the scriptures.
Remember, they are ruling the earth. They are taken to heaven and given a heavenly body, for that purpose. They are no longer on earth, but rule along with Jesus, from heaven.

Revelation. 14:4
The 144,000 are bought from among mankind as firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.

1 Corinthians 15:22, 23
22...so also in the Christ all will be made alive,
23 But each one in his own proper order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who belong to the Christ during his presence.
(Romans 8:15-25; 1 Thessalonians 4:16)

Luke 22:28-30
28 “However, you are the ones who have stuck with me in my trials; 29 and I make a covenant with you, just as my Father has made a covenant with me, for a kingdom, 30so that you may eat and drink at my table in my Kingdom, and sit on thrones to judge the 12 tribes of Israel.

Luke 12:32 “Have no fear, little flock, for your Father has approved of giving you the Kingdom.
(2 Corinthians 5:1-5)

2 Timothy 2:12 . . .if we go on enduring, we will also rule together as kings; . . .

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and those who sat on them were given authority to judge. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed for the witness they gave about Jesus and for speaking about God, and those who had not worshiped the wild beast or its image and had not received the mark on their forehead and on their hand. And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for 1,000 years.

Revelation 20:6 Happy and holy is anyone having part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no authority, but they will be priests of God and of the Christ, and they will rule as kings with him for the 1,000 years.
(1 Corinthians 15:50-57)

As far as people in Heaven... I just don' see it.

9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; 10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, 12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.

These are with angels about the throne with the elders. Just don't see how that can be on earth at this point

13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Here it is also clear that they came out of the great tribulation (which means they have left earth)

15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. 16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

At one point, they even ask when they will be avenged.

So... at this point... (and I'm always open to learn and certainly have changed positions before when convinced or when I find scripture that says I'm wrong)... I can't see it your way.
Notice. The scriptures are continuous. They are before the throne, rendering service day and night.
It does not say they are taken from the earth. Nor does it say they are on Mount Zion (in heaven).
Rather it says they came out of the great tribulation, and they are shepherded to waters of life.

Why do you say, "which means they have left earth"? How did you arrive at that? What is the great tribulation?
Where does it say they are with angels about the throne with the elders? I don't read that.
Where do you see "they even ask when they will be avenged"? I don't see that either.

CAVEAT!

It doesn't change my respect for you and certainly I don't see it as a dividing line. It will be what it will be.

Blessings,

Ken
You know you always have the respect of JWs.
 
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InChrist

Free4ever
The 144,000 Jews that the Bible mentions (Revelation 7:4-7) are the only ones who will go to heaven and reign with God. Interestingly, these 144,000 Jews are all virgins. For it is written:

Revelation 14:1
1 Then I looked, and behold, on Mount Zion stood the Lamb, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads.
3 and they were singing a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and before the elders. No one could learn that song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth.
4 It is these who have not defiled themselves with women, for they are virgins. It is these who follow the Lamb wherever he goes. These have been redeemed from mankind as firstfruits for God and the Lamb,
5 and in their mouth no lie was found, for they are blameless.

That would mean that even people like Abraham, Isaac and Jacob do not belong to these 144,000 people. And that surprises me very much, for who are these people and why are they so special that they even stand above these 3 fathers?

Are these maybe the "lost sheep" Jesus once mentioned?

“I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
Matthew 15:24

What do you think?
It seems obvious to me that Abraham, Issac, and Jacob are not part of the 144,000 referred to in Revelation because that number is in reference to Jewish believers alive during the end time tribulation period. It has nothing to do with them being more special than Abraham, Issac, or Jacob.
 

Samantha Rinne

Resident Genderfluid Writer/Artist
This is probably what this means.

144000 is 12 x 12 x 1000, basically supposed to be a representative sampling of all the 12 tribes.

Virgin, as in, they aren't already taken by a woman, their thoughts are on God.

You guys are getting hung up on the virgin thing and not focusing on why it's important.

The key they told us to understanding Revelation is to have at least some Jewish background. Why does the New Heaven and the New Earth have no sea? Why is Jerusalem descending from Heaven? Why are there 30 minutes of utter silence?

When you read OT passages about God saying that he is married to his people, suddenly this makes sense. It's like one big end-times Jewish sacrifice of atonement, followed by a wedding ceremony.

Revelation makes a contrast between false churches and the Church.
It also has both a "synogogue of Satan" and a 144000 righteous Jews. And no, these are not necessarily righteous according to other Jews. But they are Jews that didn't believe their rabbis when the told people Jesus was a heretic, and didn't stand against other religion and for a godless secular state. Jews who believe Jesus could be the Messiah rather than the excuses why he isn't, and who believe in the rebuilding of the Temple and creating a better world. Those who aren't trying to drive a wedge between Christians and Jews, but see each other as brothers.
 

gnostic

The Lost One
The 144,000 Jews that the Bible mentions (Revelation 7:4-7) are the only ones who will go to heaven and reign with God. Interestingly, these 144,000 Jews are all virgins. For it is written:

Revelation 14:1
1 Then I looked, and behold, on Mount Zion stood the Lamb, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads.
3 and they were singing a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and before the elders. No one could learn that song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth.
4 It is these who have not defiled themselves with women, for they are virgins. It is these who follow the Lamb wherever he goes. These have been redeemed from mankind as firstfruits for God and the Lamb,
5 and in their mouth no lie was found, for they are blameless.

That would mean that even people like Abraham, Isaac and Jacob do not belong to these 144,000 people. And that surprises me very much, for who are these people and why are they so special that they even stand above these 3 fathers?

Are these maybe the "lost sheep" Jesus once mentioned?

“I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
Matthew 15:24

What do you think?

I think you have to keep in mind, that people who became Christians during Jesus' ministry, were drawn from people living in Galilee, Samaria and Judaea, in other word, Jesus' route when he was preaching. So largely, his audience were mostly Jews.

But when Christianity spread out during the mid to late 1st century, most Christians were Greek-speaking Syrians, Anatolians (from Asia Minor or Turkey as they called it now), and the Greeks themselves as the churches spread across the Aegean and Mediterranean.

All the NT books were written in Greek originally, so the were intended for Greek-speaking Christians. They are not necessarily Greek, it is just that since after Alexander the Great (322 BCE), Koine Greek was widely spoken, because the language became the lingua franca of the Eastern Mediterranean (which included Egypt, Judaea, Syria, Asia Minor, etc). Even in Rome, most Roman aristocrats, upper and middle classes, could speak Greek, because it was language of diplomacy and trades.

And that include the Book of Revelation. It was written in Greek, and from the 1st chapter, the book was addressed to Greek-speaking churches in Asia Minor.

Revelation speak of 144,000 Jews and book referred to the 12 tribes of Israel with 144,000 Jews (eg 12,000 Jews from each tribe).

But what would these Greek churches know of 12 tribes of Israel? Tribes where most of them don't exist in the 1st century CE, so it is highly doubtful the Christians of the Greek-speaking churches in Asia Minor knew much about Israel's history.

The 12 tribes ceased to have any meaning when Revelation was written, and according to Judges, all men from the tribe of Benjamin were massacred before King Saul's reign.

And strictly speaking, the other tribes weren't Jews, only the people of Judah and Judaea were considered Jews.

In any case, I don't put much stocks on what are written in Revelation. Much of the contents are open to interpretations. If Revelation was a book of prophecies, then so many people have interpreted them, got them wrong.
 

calm

Active Member
It seems obvious to me that Abraham, Issac, and Jacob are not part of the 144,000 referred to in Revelation because that number is in reference to Jewish believers alive during the end time tribulation period. It has nothing to do with them being more special than Abraham, Issac, or Jacob.
Yes exactly, I also believe that the 144,000 will be collected only after the arrival of Jesus. And that is why more than 144,000 will actually go to heaven. So I think that people like Abraham and Isaac will be there too. But neverthless I also believe that the 144,000 have a special position, because according to the Bible these have qualities that others who will receive eternal life will not have.
Heaven is only accessible to the Jews and the earth is meant for the Gentiles. And those who will be present in heaven will reign over the earth. So that the prophecy that God said to Abraham might be fulfilled, for God promised him that his seed would reign over the whole earth.
 
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Faithofchristian

Well-Known Member
The 144,000 Jews that the Bible mentions (Revelation 7:4-7) are the only ones who will go to heaven and reign with God. Interestingly, these 144,000 Jews are all virgins. For it is written:

Revelation 14:1
1 Then I looked, and behold, on Mount Zion stood the Lamb, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads.
3 and they were singing a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and before the elders. No one could learn that song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth.
4 It is these who have not defiled themselves with women, for they are virgins. It is these who follow the Lamb wherever he goes. These have been redeemed from mankind as firstfruits for God and the Lamb,
5 and in their mouth no lie was found, for they are blameless.

That would mean that even people like Abraham, Isaac and Jacob do not belong to these 144,000 people. And that surprises me very much, for who are these people and why are they so special that they even stand above these 3 fathers?

Are these maybe the "lost sheep" Jesus once mentioned?

“I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
Matthew 15:24

What do you think?


Had you read the book of Revelation correctly, You have the Great Multitude which no man could number, that's standing before the Throne of God.

So the 144.000 are not the only one's in heaven.
Revelation 7:9-10.

9--"After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

10--"And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb"
 

Faithofchristian

Well-Known Member
I think you have to keep in mind, that people who became Christians during Jesus' ministry, were drawn from people living in Galilee, Samaria and Judaea, in other word, Jesus' route when he was preaching. So largely, his audience were mostly Jews.

But when Christianity spread out during the mid to late 1st century, most Christians were Greek-speaking Syrians, Anatolians (from Asia Minor or Turkey as they called it now), and the Greeks themselves as the churches spread across the Aegean and Mediterranean.

All the NT books were written in Greek originally, so the were intended for Greek-speaking Christians. They are not necessarily Greek, it is just that since after Alexander the Great (322 BCE), Koine Greek was widely spoken, because the language became the lingua franca of the Eastern Mediterranean (which included Egypt, Judaea, Syria, Asia Minor, etc). Even in Rome, most Roman aristocrats, upper and middle classes, could speak Greek, because it was language of diplomacy and trades.

And that include the Book of Revelation. It was written in Greek, and from the 1st chapter, the book was addressed to Greek-speaking churches in Asia Minor.

Revelation speak of 144,000 Jews and book referred to the 12 tribes of Israel with 144,000 Jews (eg 12,000 Jews from each tribe).

But what would these Greek churches know of 12 tribes of Israel? Tribes where most of them don't exist in the 1st century CE, so it is highly doubtful the Christians of the Greek-speaking churches in Asia Minor knew much about Israel's history.

The 12 tribes ceased to have any meaning when Revelation was written, and according to Judges, all men from the tribe of Benjamin were massacred before King Saul's reign.

And strictly speaking, the other tribes weren't Jews, only the people of Judah and Judaea were considered Jews.

In any case, I don't put much stocks on what are written in Revelation. Much of the contents are open to interpretations. If Revelation was a book of prophecies, then so many people have interpreted them, got them wrong.

Had you done your research. you would have found that the first Christians were Jews of Israel.
 
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Faithofchristian

Well-Known Member
The 144,000 Jews that the Bible mentions (Revelation 7:4-7) are the only ones who will go to heaven and reign with God. Interestingly, these 144,000 Jews are all virgins. For it is written:

Revelation 14:1
1 Then I looked, and behold, on Mount Zion stood the Lamb, and with him 144,000 who had his name and his Father’s name written on their foreheads.
3 and they were singing a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and before the elders. No one could learn that song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth.
4 It is these who have not defiled themselves with women, for they are virgins. It is these who follow the Lamb wherever he goes. These have been redeemed from mankind as firstfruits for God and the Lamb,
5 and in their mouth no lie was found, for they are blameless.

That would mean that even people like Abraham, Isaac and Jacob do not belong to these 144,000 people. And that surprises me very much, for who are these people and why are they so special that they even stand above these 3 fathers?

Are these maybe the "lost sheep" Jesus once mentioned?

“I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
Matthew 15:24

What do you think?

Do you know why the 144.000 are virgins?

Note, that the 144.000 were not defiled by man?
What does this mean?

This all means the 144.000 were all virgins,
they were not defiled by the teachings of a church nor by the teachings of man's,Pastor,Preacher.

As the 144:000 followed the Lamb ( Jesus Christ) wherever he goes. Thereby the 144.000 followed only the teachings of Christ Jesus.
Revelation 14:4
 
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Etritonakin

Well-Known Member
1: They are not all Jews -which refers to the HOUSE of Judah -which is Judah and Benjamin -and likely some Levites which were among all tribes. Some are of the House of Israel -which are the remainder of the tribes (who were prophesied to lose their language and even knowledge of their own identity for the most part). Notice that the tribe of Dan is not mentioned (here explained elsehwere in scripture) -but one of the half-tribes, Manasseh (the other half-tribe Ephraim is also not mentioned -but was technically included in Joseph).
2: The meek shall inherit the Earth -not heaven (though eventually all of the universe -which was "formed to be inhabited").
3: Virgin does not necessarily mean never having/having had sex in proper context.
4: The 144,000 are sealed just before the greatest time of trouble on Earth -and will serve God/minister to people during that time (who did not escape all of these things which will surely come to pass -but who may still be with those in the first resurrection. The servants of God who do not go to a place of safety during that time are not necessarily not worthy to escape, but God will have called them for that specific purpose).
5: Their purpose is actually to help a great multitude of ALL NATIONS to be in the first resurrection....

"Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads."

...Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.
After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb. And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.
And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb
 
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