Earthling
David Henson
I'll ask this again, did a human change into a human from an ape or is a human an ape? Show the fossils.
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The Atheist Delusion
- Thread starter Earthling
- Start date
I'll ask this again, did a human change into a human from an ape or is a human an ape? Show the fossils.
It's easy to suspect. They are idiots. No one could possibly be that stupid.
Human is an ape. We share that category with gorillas, chimpanzees, orangutans, and others. It doesn't require fossils to categorize. DNA is sufficient.
Gallowglass
Member
I'm a theist and I thought this was stupid.
We can actively see evolution, like the lizards who are now giving birth instead of laying eggs, after laying eggs for as long as we have record. Did the intelligent designer suddenly change his mind?
We can actively see evolution, like the lizards who are now giving birth instead of laying eggs, after laying eggs for as long as we have record. Did the intelligent designer suddenly change his mind?
Earthling
David Henson
So there was no change. We are just apes. What about DNA?
Earthling
David Henson
That's not an answer that's a deflection. Where is the so called evidence the atheists so frequently insist upon?
Gallowglass
Member
Here's skinks evolving to give live birth in one area of Australia.
https://news.nationalgeographic.com...ution-australia-lizard-skink-live-birth-eggs/
You can actually see the embryos along her body, unlike when they lay eggs, here's what their underbodies normally look like.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5488/14384449963_8e3b90cd76_m.jpg
Earthling
David Henson
You see, this is part of the problem. It's like pepper moths. It's called evolution but it isn't. What you've shown me is evidence of the yellow-bellied three-toed skink laying eggs to reproduce. But individuals of the same species living in the state's higher, colder mountains are almost all giving birth to live young.
When I say evolution I'm talking about something changing into something else. And not a Caterpillar changing into a butterfly, or a puppy changing into a dog, or a variety of finch that has a bigger beak than another. I'm talking about an ape changing into a human, or a bird changing into a lizard or a fish monkey having sex with a squirrel or something to make a retard fish frog . . . you see it coming, don't you?
Gallowglass
Member
No, not really. The changes are small and incremental. They sneak up on you. They happen over generations. A group changes slowly, and before long, there are enough differences that they can’t even recognise each other as related. Stuff like lizards completely rewriting their digestive tracts in thirty years. That’s all soft tissue change. A very very small amount of things that have lived have left fossils, and even when they do, we can see no changes in soft tissue from fossils.
Ape into human happened slowly, with small changes, like bigger skulls. Going back to the Pod lizards, having bigger heads. We have “human” skulls with notably different skull construction. Why? Because it isn’t soft tissue.
Look at wolves and dogs. We know for a fact domestication occurred, but most of the differences between wolves and dogs are in the soft tissue. You get a fossil of a dog skeleton next to a wolf skeleton and even experts in canine physiognomy have issues, but they are very, very different species and while interbreeding can still occur, it is now fraught with danger for the mother, where fifty years ago it wasn’t. We don’t know how much longer, as humans continue to breed dogs, that wolf-dog hybrids will even be possible.
Let me put it this way. The flu from 1956 and the flu from today are so different if they were sentient and saw each other, they wouldn’t recognise each other as the flu. The flu from today is so different from the flu in 1956 it would think it was looking at some other disease entirely. Like we look at Koko the gorilla. The same amount of difference between us and gorillas is between the flu from 1956 and today.
DNA is sufficient to classify us. We don't need fossils.
Edit: At no time did an ape change into a human. The chart on Mr. Garrison's board that depicts a series of steps from ape to human is an exaggeration of evolution--it could even be called a criticism of evolution, along the lines of the same complaint that you express: that an ape could not turn into a human. Its value lies in suggesting the changing species rather than depicting it. Both humans and apes evolved from a parent primate species.
Edit: Sadly, it seems they no longer teach this in schools.
Edit: Amusingly, I called up the Scopes trial to refresh my memory. I like the quote one student made: "I believe in part of evolution, but I don't believe in the monkey business!" (No doubt where the phrase originated, eh?)
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Apes did not turn into humans. Humans and apes are of the same grouping (family), Great Ape, a part of the primate order.
Gallowglass
Member
You're correct. I should stick with the proper order. In my defense, it was 5:30 in the morning and I haven't slept and because of stupid muscle tremors in my legs. Thanks for the correction.
Earthling
David Henson
Yeah, that's substantially changed since I was in school, hasn't it? I know DNA was thought to be significant as the lie detector test when it first 'came out,' but now, like the lie detector, not so much. Overconfidence always leads to a fairly large portion of the population being put in prisons, but that's something we tend to overlook. Like amateur eugenics.
Are you aware of the Biblical kinds?
Oh, no! What will become of us?! Does that mean people will have to learn about it themselves, or will it be lost in the annals of science?
I'm aware of the Bible, and I'm aware of what kind and kin are.
No, there was a change between different types of ape.
Humans are a type of ape. In our evolution, we changed from a smaller ape with a small brain into one that is larger with a large brain. I'm sure you have seen the fossil skulls presented a number of times showing the steps.
DNA is part of the evidence showing the types of changes and also showing our relationship to the other apes.
And you expect such a change to happen in less than a thousand generations? Why would you suspect that?
Earthling
David Henson
I don't expect it to happen ever.
Earthling
David Henson
What animal or plant DNA is most similar to the human DNA?