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The Best Country in the Universe

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
I will never understand the desire to be the best...

In my humble opinion the US is a great nation because of its great people; this what makes it a beacon, a model of civilization. The people setting an example.
But people are not the same thing as the élites.

It's a thing I experience in Europe too. I love the British, the French, the Spanish, the German, the Polish, the Ukrainians, everyone...
but I feel distrust towards the European élites. Who are not the same thing as European commoners.
Maybe because the French Revolution is carved into our DNA so we make this distinction, a priori.

So...I really can't understand why Americans may fail to realize that what makes America the best is the commoners.
Whereas some élites may hinder equality and justice.

There was a surge in U.S. patriotism following the Civil War. Prior to that, it appears that people were more patriotic towards their individual states than to America as a whole. But after the Civil War, patriotism and loyalty to the entire nation was strongly pushed. I don't know if very many people genuinely believed that America was the "best" at that point, as we were still playing second fiddle to the (mainly) Anglo-French hegemony over the world. It wasn't until WW1 that we started to overtake them as a world power. WW2 seems to be another turning point, at least as far Americans' perceptions of being the "best."

Some of it, I believe, was probably spread on a bit too thick, perhaps to placate the egos of Americans whose worldview tended to be more provincial, insular, and isolationist. If Americans are led to believe that America is the "greatest" and absolutely "indispensable" to safeguarding the "free world," then they will be far more pliable and supportive of U.S. global militarism and interventionism. Because, "If not us, then who?"

If we were just an ordinary, run-of-the-mill country, then attitudes would probably change. Like, say if we were Paraguay. Do you think the people of Paraguay sit around fretting about what might happen if China invades Taiwan? I doubt it. But Americans feel compelled to take on the worries of the world on their shoulders because they believe we are the "greatest," and therefore, that's a great responsibility we must uphold.
 

We Never Know

No Slack
Actually I hear this a lot in all kinds of circumstances, particularly political speeches. (Thinks: Maybe I should avoid those).
Yep. Politicians and even the president refer to the US as the best country.
Being they are so honest it must be true lol

But I imagine its like people looking at their kid, to them its the best/smartest/prettiest kid in the world.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Maybe other countries wouldn't dislike the US so much if we actually took a look at ourselves and realized we have some opportunity for improvement?
We're the "shining city on the hill
John Winthrop, the one who originally said "city on a hill" also warned his listeners that it was up to us to make it so

For we must consider that we shall be as a city upon a hill. The eyes of all people are upon us. So that if we shall deal falsely with our God in this work we have undertaken, and so cause Him to withdraw His present help from us, we shall be made a story and a by-word through the world. We shall open the mouths of enemies to speak evil of the ways of God, and all professors for God’s sake. We shall shame the faces of many of God’s worthy servants, and cause their prayers to be turned into curses upon us till we be consumed out of the good land whither we are going...
...
But if our hearts shall turn away, so that we will not obey, but shall be seduced, and worship other Gods, our pleasure and profits, and serve them; it is propounded unto us this day, we shall surely perish out of the good land whither we pass over this vast sea to possess it.


John Winthrop back then and all of us today should understand that we're not exceptional as long as we fail to live up to our ideals. We worship "our pleasure and profits" and we fail to do what he said in that sermon:

For this end, we must be knit together, in this work, as one man. We must entertain each other in brotherly affection. We must be willing to abridge ourselves of our superfluities, for the supply of others’ necessities. We must uphold a familiar commerce together in all meekness, gentleness, patience and liberality. We must delight in each other; make others’ conditions our own; rejoice together, mourn together, labor and suffer together, always having before our eyes our commission and community in the work, as members of the same body. So shall we keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace.


 

JustGeorge

Imperfect
Staff member
Premium Member
I guess its perspective, and personal fit.

For some, the US has been a wonderful place, and they feel good and relate to the culture(of their area, because in reality, the US has a pretty wide cultural variance from region to region).

For others, its a nightmare, and they can't access what they need to stay afloat. They may not fit in well, and may feel isolated.

I suspect most fall in between.

I think its like that for any place.
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
For whatever reason, I took exception to a comment by the MC, who announced after the national anthem, "We are the best country in the UNIVERSE!!" to which the grandstands went wild. While they cheered, I couldn't help but think, "I'm not even sure we're the best country in North America right now."
Agreed. I'm living in Mexico and have no interest in even visiting the States again. Last time was 2014 when my mother passed.
I rather like this Newsroom sketch from 2012.
An excellent selection.

@Stevicus

1693685510911.png


And many of the plastic surgeries in Mexico are due to Americans and medical tourism. This is a place to stay for those coming where I live for plastic surgery. Stay a week until much of that swelling and bruising goes down and maybe your friends back home will believe that you just fell rather than had "work" done:

Casita Montana Medical Center – We Can Help You Change Your Life
 
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Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
It's called "American Exceptionalism". The only thing I'd agree with is that (some) Americans are exceptionally conceited. ;)
The United States was, I think, founded on some of the best Enlightenment thinking possible. Other revolutions (France, Russia, etc.) turned so ugly because they were begun in such hatred and haste -- but the Declaration of Independence, the Federalist Papers, the Constitution (including the Bill of Rights) are some of the best philosophical efforts on how to build a polity that the world has ever seen (though granted it borrowed a lot from English and French thinkers like Locke and Montesquieu at al).

Of course, having failed to live up to those ideals from the outset (by retaining the institution of slavery), it required a civil war to actually get the job done, and the left-over hatreds (of the north against the south and everybody against the blacks) is an unhealed scar that shows how badly wounded the nation was as a result.

A couple of things, for me, make the nation not one that I long to visit, although I'm mindful of the need to be at peace with it for the good of my own country: the iron grip that religion still seems to have on so many of its people, and a very decided right-wing leaning in comparison with most of the western world. Many Democrats compare quite well with Canadian Conservatives, and for us, a lot of Republicans are extreme hard right. You can see the results of this in many things: the number and length of prison sentences, which in the U.S. is 3.66 and 6.82 times higher than its nearest rival, Hungary.

I am really just skimming the surface, here, and the analysis is much lighter than merely light-weight, but I think, for me, that the combination of religiousity and illiberality (however much Americans shout about "freedom," that is not the liberation that the European Enlightenment had in mind) has caused the US to veer from the trajectority at least charted by the Founding Fathers. That is why some very sound political thinkers today are able to write about encroaching fascistic thought. Sinclair Lewis, in his 1935 novel It Can’t Happen Here, wrote: “When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.” Madeleine Albright wrote an excellent warning book, "Fascism: A Warning" in 2018. Other books on the subject are newly on the market.
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
A couple of things, for me, make the nation not one that I long to visit, although I'm mindful of the need to be at peace with it for the good of my own country: the iron grip that religion still seems to have on so many of its people, and a very decided right-wing leaning in comparison with most of the western world.
Agreed, and that makes America undesirable to live in for this American who lived there his first 55 years. The rampant bigotry and white nationalism and the continual strife, people voting for thugs, the loss of respect for basic American values like democracy, church-state separation, the rule of law and egalitarianism makes the nation a place I also don't want to visit beginning with landing in one of those airports.

In Mexico, we have found a happy people, good weather, and natural beauty at a good price. America simply can't compete with that.

Of course, we're in the third stage of life, the resting stage, with the first being characterized mostly by learning (acquiring language and motor skills, testing the world by trial and error, formal education) and the second by productivity (work, raising a family). America might still be a better place to go to school or earn a living than Mexico, but for a retiree, it has little to offer.

We've had two friends from here return to the States in the last two years. First was Martha, who returned to South Carolina and her daughter because of increasing frailty and insecurity about living alone. She misses everything about this life, but what she specified was the loss of the freedom to get her medications over the counter that are by prescription only in the States and require a doctor's visit when the last refill is consumed, which she considers expensive and inconvenient.

Jill returned to Chicago for reasons of nostalgia but didn't last one winter because of the cold and prices and returned to Mexico.
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
A great scene but I think it should be followed up by a later scene:
@SalixIncendium

Apart from the message in the OP i hope you enjoyed your evening.

Regarding the OP, i rather like this Newsroom sketch from 2012.
It's 5 minutes so make a coffee before you watch.

Well, the good news is I have yet to receive any death threats for the OP.

And the not so good news, I'm probably going to binge watch The Newsroom to satiate my curiosity.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Or so I was told at a demolition derby I treated myself to last night at the county fair. I know I'll probably take some heat from some of our US members over this, but...

For whatever reason, I took exception to a comment by the MC, who announced after the national anthem, "We are the best country in the UNIVERSE!!" to which the grandstands went wild. While they cheered, I couldn't help but think, "I'm not even sure we're the best country in North America right now."

I suppose I understand national pride thing to an extent, when it comes to cultural things, but I find it a bit arrogant to say "we're #1."

Maybe other countries wouldn't dislike the US so much if we actually took a look at ourselves and realized we have some opportunity for improvement? :shrug:

What say you?
USA is indeed the best country.
But only cuz the others are worse in various ways.
It's a low bar.

Now, before any panties get bunched up, realize
that "best" is a personal judgement. You're all
welcome to prefer some other country.
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
Gun rights.
Czech Republic, Guatemala, Ukraine, Mexico, the Philippines, Yemen, and Switzerland all have similar rights.

Speech rights.
I can name about 30 other countries that have freedom of speech. There are probably more.

Additionally, there are countries with a higher expression score than the US.


Engine shows.
Okay, since I don't have any knowledge of data that measures this, I'll give you that one.

Language.
Out of 195 sovereign states, I would say pretty close to 195 have language.

Constitution.

Entertainment.
Entertainment value is subjective.

Again subjective. And American food doesn't even rank in my top 10.

Ever been to Fiji?
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
They forgot military spending and wars and regime change started.

Yeah, although those are things that some might argue make America great. The whole "leader of the free world" and "making the world safe for democracy" shtick. If not for that, then there'd be no reason to have all this jingoism in the first place.
 

anna.

colors your eyes with what's not there
Or so I was told at a demolition derby I treated myself to last night at the county fair. I know I'll probably take some heat from some of our US members over this, but...

For whatever reason, I took exception to a comment by the MC, who announced after the national anthem, "We are the best country in the UNIVERSE!!" to which the grandstands went wild. While they cheered, I couldn't help but think, "I'm not even sure we're the best country in North America right now."

I suppose I understand national pride thing to an extent, when it comes to cultural things, but I find it a bit arrogant to say "we're #1."

Maybe other countries wouldn't dislike the US so much if we actually took a look at ourselves and realized we have some opportunity for improvement? :shrug:

What say you?


We definitely have room for improvement. We're not perfect, and never have been, nor can any country be perfect.

Having said that: It's home, so it's the best place in the universe to me. I feel it in my bones when I've been away and I come back home.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Czech Republic, Guatemala, Ukraine, Mexico, the Philippines, Yemen, and Switzerland all have similar rights.


I can name about 30 other countries that have freedom of speech. There are probably more.

Additionally, there are countries with a higher expression score than the US.



Okay, since I don't have any knowledge of data that measures this, I'll give you that one.


Out of 195 sovereign states, I would say pretty close to 195 have language.




Entertainment value is subjective.


Again subjective. And American food doesn't even rank in my top 10.


Ever been to Fiji?
I don't claim that things I enjoy here don't exist anywhere else.
Other countries have many great features.
I prefer the mix that we have here.

BTW, Fiji is too isolated.
And Ukraine is currently invaded.
 
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