The Big Bang Theory is dead.

[gnostic]

This would align with the Big Crunch theory? I suppose my question is as the universe contracts to a singularity, would is still be considered a "universe" as all matter coalesces?

The singularity would be the “universe”.

All that we can observed is the universe in the state of expansion, or the universe at the expanded state.

But contracted to the singularity, the universe would be at its “singularity” state.

just as some matters can have more than one physical state, like water can exist physically as solid (ice), liquid or gas (water vapour) - it is all still H2O.

Does that make sense?

 

[gnostic]

I have already proven this a number of times
Can you meet the challenge I presented?

No, SavedByTheLord, you haven’t.

All you have done is make whole bunch of claims.

claims are just assumptions and assertions. Assumptions and assertions are not evidence.

Your claims are also not even “logical”.

Your claims are based on circular reasoning and confirmation bias.

 

[SavedByTheLord]

No, SavedByTheLord, you haven’t.

All you have done is make whole bunch of claims.

claims are just assumptions and assertions. Assumptions and assertions are not evidence.

Your claims are also not even “logical”.

Your claims are based on circular reasoning and confirmation bias.

Look in the mirror while you read your own post and learn

 

[SalixIncendium]

Look in the mirror while you read your own post and learn

Okay. I just tried this, and unless I hold my computer behind my head, I can't see the words. And when I do, they're all backwards.

 

[Valjean]

After all this the all knowing ones who actually teach their theories as fact, do not have an answer to such a simple question.
What existed a trillion years before the Big Bang?

That's been answered. If you're going to ignore answers, why should we repeat them?
You apparently don't realize what a scientific theory is.

Baloney.
You are only fooling yourselves.
There is no evolution without a first living creature, which is impossible.

Why is that impossible, and why must there have been a first living creature?
Do you really think fully-formed creatures popping into existence is more likely?

I have proved that several times and no one has refuted that.
The rest of evolution is garbage. You have yet to show one created kind changing into another kind or how such would even happen.

You don't even know what proof is. You have proved nothing. You preach, you assert, you reference no relevant facts or evidence. Where's your proof?
Please define "kind."

Observed speciation:
Observed Instances of Speciation

Some More Observed Speciation Events

 

[Valjean]

Evolutionists are always trying to run and hide from that nonsense.
Life cannot exist without the Almighty God the Crestor.

You're preaching again.

I believe what I believe but have already proven them so now they are facts.

what do you believe and what are the facts according to what you believe.

Hasn't that been answered about a thousand times?

No. You are again wrong. I have one assumption which I have already proved as a fact.

You have "proven" nothing. You haven't even evidenced it.

You are always stating your false assumptions as facts but then you do not know any real answer as to the origin of anything.

We produce empirical evidence for our claims. We explain why we believe them. They are not assumptions, unlike faith, they derive from observations and demonstrable facts.
You keep bringing up origins, and we keep explaining that BB cosmology is: 1. not understood, and 2. not relevant to evolution. Please stop being so obtuse.

 

[Valjean]

And that violates cause and effect, the foundation of science and sanity.
I guess the universe is like god to you, always was.

Please stop. Hasn't it been explained to you that cause and effect is an observation peculiar to the material world we observe? In a quantum universe it dissolves into probabilities.

 

[SavedByTheLord]

Please stop. Hasn't it been explained to you that cause and effect is an observation peculiar to the material world we observe? In a quantum universe it dissolves into probabilities.

But there is no quantum world without out a universe.

 

[viole]

God had always existed and always will exist and created all things.

Well, that is probably the sentence with the highest concentration of fallacies in history.

Now, that is easily defeated by a counterexample. Namely, that the Universe has always exists, and as such, never needed to be created.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Polymath257]

But there is no quantum world without out a universe.

And, apparently, vice versa.

But that is irrelevant to this discussion. The quantum realm, and hence the universe at the most fundamental level, is not causal. So to ask for causes is to make assumptions that are known to be false.

 

[SavedByTheLord]

And, apparently, vice versa.

But that is irrelevant to this discussion. The quantum realm, and hence the universe at the most fundamental level, is not causal. So to ask for causes is to make assumptions that are known to be false.

Fiction now runs rampant with the evolution and billions of years crowd.
A finely tuned and ordered universe with orderly physics laws must have popped into existence out of nowhere and no cause and effect needs to be explaindeed.

What is the cause for the Big Bang?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Fiction now runs rampant with the evolution and billions of years crowd.
A finely tuned and ordered universe with orderly physics laws must have popped into existence out of nowhere and no cause and effect needs to be explaindeed.

What is the cause for the Big Bang?

It was Jimmy. He always was a bit clumsy.

 

[Eli G]

Take some time to go out to the garden or visit a botanical park or zoo... Watch some birds on the web, butterflies, fish, flowers, fruits,... Those who say that all those beautiful things originated alone are just blindly delirious.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Take some time to go out to the garden or visit a botanical park or zoo... Watch some birds on the web, butterflies, fish, flowers, fruits,... Those who say that all those beautiful things originated alone are just blindly delirious.

I could point to their endless flaws and make the same claim about a God being involved. You do not get out of providing evidence that easily. Of course when it comes to evidence the evolution side wins. There is no scientific evidence for creationism. At least no one has ever presented any here. Do you have any evidence?

 

[Eli G]

Some people say that God's creation has no merit, and they present for example some horrifying fish from the ocean floor ...
How intelligent and kind my God!!!,.. He hid what would not please my eyes so it won't disturb my peace.

And how sad ... those who only have eyes for the ugly and forget all the beauty of God's creation!

 

[Eli G]

There is not better artist than God.

Some of the things that evolutionists say came to be by themselves.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Believe it or not it is actually the Tenth Commandment.

If you remember Moses broke the first set of tablets because he got so angry. So he was pretty much ad libbing it when he said what was on them. It appears that he got quite a bit wrong. Exodus 34 explains how he went back up into the mountains and God carved him a new set. This is the set that would have been in the Ark of the Covenant, if one reads the Bible literally. God tells him the Commandments to MOses:

Bible Gateway passage: Exodus 34 - New International Version

The New Stone Tablets - The LORD said to Moses, “Chisel out two stone tablets like the first ones, and I will write on them the words that were on the first tablets, which you broke. Be ready in the morning, and then come up on Mount Sinai. Present yourself to me there on top of the mountain. No...

www.biblegateway.com

The last, and Tenth Commandment is:

' “Do not cook a young goat in its mother’s milk.” '

I have posted this in various ways for so long -- you are the very first person on this forum, or any other I've been to, to recognize it. Not only that, but verse 28 is the ONLY place in the Bible that actually says "The Ten Commandments."

I could kiss you (but fear not, I shan't).

 

[gnostic]

But there is no quantum world without out a universe.

And, apparently, vice versa.

But that is irrelevant to this discussion. The quantum realm, and hence the universe at the most fundamental level, is not causal. So to ask for causes is to make assumptions that are known to be false.

Fiction now runs rampant with the evolution and billions of years crowd.

First you bring up universe and quantum physics...

Then you switch to Evolution.

Evolution is biology, and have nothing to do with the rest of the Universe and the Big Bang models.

You're moving the goalpost, back and forth, with...

A finely tuned and ordered universe with orderly physics laws must have popped into existence out of nowhere and no cause and effect needs to be explaindeed.

What is the cause for the Big Bang?

As @Polymath257 have already explained to you, if you going to bring up the quantum world into the Big Bang cosmology, then there are no cause.

If you have studied quantum physics, you would know that the quantum realm are not deterministic, and speaking of causality, have only demonstrated that you don't understand quantum physics.

Beside that, the Big Bang doesn't say anything about the universe popping from nothingness, as there are no such thing as nothingness.

The Big Bang does mention "singularity", and the singularity isn't "nothing". The singularity is the "state" that the Universe is in...the "state" in which physicists don't quite fully understand, yet.

And finally, according to the last measurements by both WMAP and Planck missions, the Observable Universe is about 13.787 billion years old. So the universe took a long time to reach the present state. There are nothing wrong with relying on the best estimates, so far.

"God did it" is even more ridiculously impossible, if you seriously believe that God created the Universe only 6000 years ago.

Plus. You talk of "nothing". Isn't God creating the Universe from nothing? Sun, moon and stars just popping from nothing? The Earth popping into existence from nothing? Talk about straw man and double standard.

 

[cladking]

Beside that, the Big Bang doesn't say anything about the universe popping from nothingness, as there are no such thing as nothingness.

You're splitting hairs.

The big bang has been traced back in time to when it was smaller than a virus. It approaches zero the further back in time you go.

All the matter, all the dark energy, all the energy, and all the dark matter along with every potentiality was within this point that would have no dimensions at all (probably) if it could be traced back even further.

How many of these miracle points could fit within the known universe? Is this where all the infinite uiniverses exist? created from the human mind and our underastyanding of mathematics.

And here some people believe God created only one single universe but somehow others believe we can make an infinite number out of thin air.

 

[shunyadragon]

Big Bang is dead.

Redshift anomalies and other things that invalidate the Big Bang expansion

https://www.researchgate.net/public...ft_Data_and_the_Myth_of_Cosmological_Distance
Click on see the full text.

Anomalies in the count of low red shift quasars.

Anomalies in the Counts of Low Redshift Quasars

https://assa.saao.ac.za/wp-content/...liffe-A-review-of-anomalous-redshift-data.pdf

Redshift Anomalies and the Big Bang – Anthony Beckett

Is a new anomaly affecting the entire Universe?

Galaxies and the Universe - Alternate Approaches and the Redshift Controversy

These two shows that today’s age estimate is a farce. The very exact number may be off by 100%. Of course if 100% is the error, then -100% puts it at about 6000 years.

'Tired light' might make the universe twice as old as we thought

Scientists have revisited the disproven light ageing hypothesis, which suggests the universe has been around for almost 27 billion years

More problems with the Big Bang Theory and the redshift explanation.

Plasma Cosmology .net

Exploring Cosmic Voids and Anomalies: The Mystery of the Cold Spot

Large Scale Cosmological Anomalies and Inhomogeneous Dark Energy

What if the Universe Is NOT Expanding?

The Big Bang Theory-A Scientific Critique [Part I] [Whole] - Apologetics Press

Galaxy Making Stars at the Edge of the Universe and Other “Surprises”

https://act.princeton.edu/sites/g/files/toruqf1171/files/a9r1o5g11h_6viqvc_3u4_0.pdf

The Scientific Evidence Against the Big Bang - LPP Fusion

Quasar with enormous redshift found embedded in nearby spiral galaxy with far lower redshift

The Big Bang Bust-Up

The Big Bang Never Happened: A Conclusive Argument

https://par.nsf.gov/servlets/purl/10338699

Did the big bang really happen?

MOND – The Dark Matter Crisis

Universe is Not Expanding After All, Controversial Study Suggests | Sci.News

Astronomers Get Their Wish, and the Hubble Crisis Gets Worse

https://physicsworld.com/a/are-giant-galaxy-clusters-defying-standard-cosmology/

http://www.cs.unc.edu/~plaisted/ce/redshift.html

Web telescope

Too many spiral galaxies in the early universe.

James Webb telescope spots thousands of Milky Way lookalikes that 'shouldn't exist' swarming across the early universe

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/james-webb-telescope-spots-thousands-173000173.html

Yes, the Big Bang theory whatever that was has changed over time like all science, but your Google shoot gun effort is not meaningful, because in part it refers to many things changing in our knowledge of cosmology not directly related to the Big Bang.

Since you do not really accept science, your arguments are rather mute.