You've misunderstood me. Dogs and children can feel guilty for no other reason than "breaking a rule" established by their caregiver. They don't have to understand the rule. A dog doesn't know why it's wrong to eat his best buddy's birthday cake while the kids are all downstairs watching a magician. All he knows is that mummy is furious and he's in trouble, and he feels awful.
Children are the same. Scribbling on the wall is perfectly moral and righteous for a child until mummy walks into the room, and they don't have to understand why it was wrong to feel ashamed of themselves for making mummy angry.
Thanks for clarifying.
Religious morality reminds me of this. You don't need to understand rules like the absurd sexual prohibitions to feel guilty for making God disappointed in you when you masturbate.
Here's another way to look at it:
When my kids were very small, I told them "Don't touch that stove." Now - they couldn't understand the concept of gas leaks or open flames killing or injuring people, and at a very young age, it would have been a waste of my time to try to explain the nature of natural gas or fire to them. All they needed to know was "Don't touch that stove." Same with playing in the street, or any other number of things. Heck, let's use your example of writing on the walls. They don't have an understanding of interior decorating, housekeeping, or the rights of others to their own personal property when they're 18 months old.
Yes, we can begin to BUILD their understanding of these concepts (along with how natural gas works or the dangers of fire), but before they can fully grasp WHY they shouldn't do something, they still need to understand sometimes that they SHOULD NOT do something because I, their mother, says they shouldn't. Part of their learning process is learning who to trust, who to allow to have authority over their lives, and the differences between good leadership and wholesome authority, and poor leadership and authority. Every time I tell them something, give them some advice, or make a rule I enforce, and there are positive ramifications to my leadership/authority, I am teaching them the difference between good leadership and poor leadership - and who you should obey and who you shouldn't obey. If we are ever to be an integral part of our society, we are going to have to be submissive to some form of authority.
We're much the same way - we're not born with innate respect for the rights of others. We're not born with the wisdom we accumulate over time. And even as adults, we continue to learn and grow in different areas of our lives. Sure, we earn (or SHOULD earn) more autonomy as we mature, and more authority over our own lives and destiny, but we're still on a learning curve. Each of us has strong and weak areas - areas in which we excel emotionally and intellectually, and areas in which we are not as mature, or gifted.
I am not a dog or a child: I govern my own behaviour and establish the rules, all of why, and the only authority figure I am concerned about disappointing is myself.
If you pay taxes, you are under someone else's authority. If you ever work for anyone else, you're under their authority. If you attend a school, you're under someone else's authority. If you register your vehicle, or participate in this forum, or have a drivers license, or own your own business, you're still operating under the authority of other entities, who, by the way, didn't consult you usually when they were establishing their policies and procedures.
As to the groups, I still disagree that people who don't drink tapwater etc. are the equivalent of religious prohibitions. I doubt we'll find any common ground there.
Maybe you haven't had the interactions with radical ecological or "health" groups I've had. I KNOW there is common ground there - I've seen it with my own eyes. Many radical groups have absolutely no "religious affiliation" but they take their own belief systems to the extreme - and expect their adherents and "believers" to do the same.
My gosh, my husband had to put up with people literally chaining themselves to trees and being carted off private property recently. If you can't see the parallel between that mindset and the religious zealot's mindset, I certainly can.
