The Death Penalty

[Engyo]

Buddhism does not sanction the death penalty. Karma applies to societies and groups of people just as it does to individuals. For society to make the cause of sanctioning murder brings karmic effects. I am not yet enlightened enough to understand exactly what those effects are; however, I do not see that the application of the death penalty has in any way reduced the occurence of the number of crimes for which it has been prescribed as some sort of *preventative* or *cure*.

Texas leads the US, and possibly the world, in the application of the death penalty; and yet we see more and more crimes of the same types taking place, as well as wives running over their cheating husbands; mothers bashing their sons' skulls in "because God told them to" and so on and so on. The death toll continues to increase, and I feel we have lost sight of the original purpose of the whole thing and are just caught in a downward spiral.

Off-topic, but how come Buddha never appears to psychotics and tells them to commit heinous crimes? Just curious.......

 

[painted wolf]

I certenly disagree with the way the deth penalty is used here in the US....

something like 30% of those on death row are/will be found innocent. The majority of those on death row are minorities....
Those a terriblely high numbers...

as for how my faith looks at it... they used it on occasion... but usually banishment was enough for realy bad crimes. (often close enough to a death penalty)


wa:-do

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Bastet said: >>I don't think anyone has the right to take another person's life<<

But I thought you said you do have the right to take another person's life if it's in self defense-so the right to take another's life depends on the situation, then?

 

[OctoberTheHottie]

I think the death penalty has lost it's direction. I also don't really think it is right to take lives, but I do think if it were happening out in the town square with criminals hanging from trees that people would probably think twice about it. But since that would never happen again I guess we will never know?? That is my non-spiritual opinion. But religiously I don't think it is right, you can't think of yourself being one with God and being here on earth trying to play him....

 

[Ceridwen018]

I am particularly undecided here as well.

On one hand, if, say, someone you loved was murdered, I can guarentee that you'd probably be pretty for the death penalty, at least for awhile. Of course you would, you'd be angry. but after all was said and done, how would you feel? We've all read books and the like of people seeking revenge and then feeling the same if not worse after that revenge was achieved. I'm sure its the same for those emotionally involved with executions.

As far as penalty goes, I think a life sentence in prison would be worse than lethal injection, but perhaps I am wrong-- those on death row still do feel their flailing instincts for survival.

Are the prisons getting too crowded or expensive? I have heard this, and if true it could certainly be an argument for the death penalty, but that's really as bad as Dr. Kavorkian killing his patients to make more beds available (now that's ironic, lol).

Has anyone ever thought of letting the criminal decide? Decide between life in prison or execution? And then if they do choose life inn prison, they can apply for execution at any time? Wow, thats pretty morbid, but who knows?

 

[SnakePegan]

As far as i am concerened I think that the death penalty is alright and all wrong. I think that the us does not have a firm enough stance on it, I think that it is unfair to the tax payers to have to put a murderer up for 15 or 20 years or more before they are executed. especially when it comes to people who maliciously kill inocent children. I balieve that they should not live to see the trial. Kill an adult though and i am not as carring abought that. because frankly i balieve that the world is so screwed up now because of the adults of 30 or mor that most of them deserve what they get.

 

[teapot_tall_and_yummy]

How is it that anything is gained in the loss of life? Why is it that we get to decide who has the right the live? In no way am I above anyone else that I should live and they should die. killing in self defense is awful tough though... but i suppose if you truly value yourlife and want to protect it and someone does otherwise.... im just not sure. but i know i could never set out to kill anyone. and it would be hard for me to kill in self defense. but if it comes down to the death of someone who respects life, or the death of someone who will only take more lives, save more lives.

 

[painted wolf]

did you know that its cheaper to keep a prisoner locked up for life than to exicute him?

Its far more expencive to go through the hassle of all the appeals and reserch and so on and so forth...

The fact that we as a nation were willing to exicute a mentaly handicapped man (IQ of 63) and eaven put children as young as 13 on death row is sick.

our system is broken... it must be fixed.

wa:-do

 

[Runt]

I believe in the death penalty in principle, but not in practice. I just wrote a response to this very idea for my government class:

"In a perfect world there would be a perfect justice system where the guilty would be found guilty, the innocent found innocent, and the death penalty would only be given to those truly deserving of it. In this perfect world, individuals dangerous to society would be eliminated because of a very clean, clear-cut law: if you kill another human being intentionally for any reason other than self defense, you die. Justice would be swift: no months of living at the expense of society, no appeals, not chance of propation and opportunity to harm other people, no mistakes. Bam! You're dead, sent to your own private afterlife and unable to commit another murder ever again.

"Unfortunatly, we do not live in a perfect world. Our justice system is subject to human error, and mistakes can and have been made. Therefore, the death penalty should be abolished in all states, for innocent lives are being destroyed.

" 'But what about our loved ones?' " the families of the victims may ask. " 'Their innocent lives have been destroyed as well! If the courts can bring us justice by using the death penalty, then they should!'

"As much as I hate to say it, their loved ones are dead, and killing their killers will not bring them back. Nor will it end the bitterness of having had them torn so cruelly from this life. Instead of ending it, revenge only continues the cycle of violence plaguing our society. As Gandhi said, 'An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.' The only purpose to the death penalty should be to remove dangerous criminals from the world at minimal expense to society, but this purpose is defeated when we become as corrupt as the criminals by trying to get revenge. Killing someone for revenge is the same as killing someone because they cheated on us, called us a bad name, or otherwise 'wronged' us. It is still murder, though we may incorrectly call it 'justice'. Murder is only justice when its sole purpose is to remove a threat from the world... but this is not what the death penalty is about today.

"Therefore, once again, the death penalty should be abolished in all states and, furthermore, a constitutional amendment should be made against it, because in our present day society it does not serve its purpose, nor will it likely be used correctly in the future."

 

[Ceridwen018]

Those are some good points, painted wolf. I agree with what you said entirely.

 

[OctoberTheHottie]

Runt, that was very well said... :clap:

 

[Runt]

Grazie. My teacher thought so too... but gave me only a B+ because it was a little... off topic (I was supposed to respond with my opinions about the effectiveness of the American judicial system as a whole... not to one little ASPECT of that judicial system... oops!)

 

[nonbeliever_92]

I'm definitely against it. Once read a pin that said "How does killing people who have killed people exemplify a point" or something similar to that (pretty sure that exemplify wasn't in there...)

 

[Poisonshady313]

Since this is in the religious debates section, I figure I ought to at least offer this to the thread.

Genesis 9:6

Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed.

Disagree with it if you will... but it's there.

 

[kai]

i dont like the idea of the state killing people, There have been too many miscarriages of justice for my liking all those people would have been wrongfully killed by the state. Once done it cant be undone.

 

[Sunstone]

i dont like the idea of the state killing people, There have been too many miscarriages of justice for my liking all those people would have been wrongfully killed by the state. Once done it cant be undone.

Well said.

Since this is in the religious debates section, I figure I ought to at least offer this to the thread.

Genesis 9:6

Whoever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed.

Disagree with it if you will... but it's there.

Sometimes scriptures don't take into account how the real world works.

 

[linwood]

Whoa, talk about thread resurrection.

I`m against the death penalty.

If anywhere in this thread I might have said I supported the death penalty forgive my inconsistency.

I`ve changed my mind since then.

 

[Nepenthe]

Whoa, talk about thread resurrection.

I`m against the death penalty.

If anywhere in this thread I might have said I supported the death penalty forgive my inconsistency.

I`ve changed my mind since then.

Hey Linwood, I'm curious, was there anything specific that changed your mind?

It's best to err in favor of allowing the accused to live as the opportunities for error are just catastrophic and irreversible. It's in society's best interest to protect innocent people from being killed by their government.

The death penalty is not an effective deterrent. In fact, states without capital punishment have lower murder rates.

The death penalty cost 63.3 million last year in California, in contrast to maximum security life-time sentences. Since 1973, 135 innocent people in the U.S. have been exonerated and released from death row due to new information, some of it related to better forensic technologies that showed the accused could not have committed the crime. The death penalty is disproportionately applied to minorities as well. Black defendants are much more likely to be executed, and black on white murder is more likely to result in the death penalty.

I'm emphatically opposed to capital punishment.

 

[linwood]

It's best to err in favor of allowing the accused to live as the opportunities for error are just catastrophic and irreversible. It's in society's best interest to protect innocent people from being killed by their government.

That`s it exactly.

There will never be an error free method of determining guilt and our judicial system works in a manner that rewards prosecutors for being unjust especially in death penalty cases.

I still believe there are people in my society who have forfeited their right to walk among us, people who deserve to die for acts they`ve committed.

I figure if the only way to assure no innocent is killed by an unjust system is to allow these monsters to live then I will accept that compromise.

 

[nonbeliever_92]

That's always been my argument with the death penalty, it's better to let someone suffer in jail for their crime forever than killing them. It does not send across the right message. "You killed so to show that killing is wrong, I'll kill you?" Just doesn't make much sense.