The entire ME is headed towards being 100% Muslim

[FearGod]

Sorry to say that, but some people are disgusting indeed.

 

[LuisDantas]

Do you regard Christianity and Judaism as religions or you think they aren't as well?

Much of Christianity suffers from the same impediments as Islaam, generally to a lesser degree. Much of it has learned to overcome those flaws. So it really depends on which Christians we are talking about. Quakers, for instance, are very much religious.

In many respects, the Bahai Faith is Islaam-in-rehab. It is a full religion, or about to become one once it overcomes its over-reliance on scriptures and theism.

Judaism seems to have largely overgrown its own scriptures, though, and I consider it a full religion as well.

 

[LuisDantas]

Sorry to say that, but some people are disgusting indeed.

It is a difficult challenge to deal with the often maddening variety of goals and opinions. But we do not have any real choice.

 

[Godobeyer]

I'm sorry, you're simply wrong about that. You can find many threads on this forum in which I'm quite critical of Christianity. I believe what my signature lines says, I'm an anti-theist. Now some religions are worse offenders when it comes to human rights, and I'm most critical of those.

Godobeyer, please take a look here.

List of political parties in Israel - Wikipedia

There are dozens of political parties in Israel, including a few that have seats and defend Arab interests in Israel, and even Islamism.

Meanwhile, the Palestinians of today have raised Hamas to power. Hamas, a party that officially pursues the destruction of Israel and sponsors frequent rocket attacks towards it.

How can you know of that and still claim that Israel is not as fair to Muslims as Muslims are to Israelis or Jewish People?

So, do you not find a problem with non-muslims being treated as 2nd class citizens in majority muslim countries, discrimination of non-muslims in majority muslim countries, etc.?

I get what you are saying, btw, but any child can tell you that 2 wrongs don't make a right. Just because Muslims are being discriminated against doesn't make their discrimination of non-Muslims any more acceptable.

Hello all .

As a resume to my points.
Where we disagree on this ?

-generalizing is evil. OP is accuse/adress to "all Muslims" instead of "some Muslims"

-The world is in war with terrorism now,exactly as before was a war with Nazis,

-The Muslims are fighting terrorists on ground,which the consquence of Western involve since Afghanistan/Soviet war.

-Israel commit unhumanity crimes in their last wars in Gaza and Lebanon, Israel treat unequal the Muslims/Arabs inside Israel and treated badly Palestinians in West band and Gaza and Lebanon.


@LuisDantas reportes from ground with made us know that Israel treat badly,I am not acussing that very knowning,I do believe that you know that too,but it's seems you are pro-Israel too ?

This one made by Israeli Jews ,remember ?

 

[leibowde84]

What if one day a maniacal dictator ruled Russa, What if one day a Muslim ruled Russia?
Predicting a Majority-Muslim Russia

What if? I'm not sure what you are asking, but Putin is already pretty close.

 

[FearGod]

What if? I'm not sure what you are asking, but Putin is already pretty close.

My point is that a maniacal dictator isn't a reason to fight a country trying to develop
its own nuclear weapons, as some other countries having it and we can't predict if one
day they'll have a dictator ruling their state.

 

[leibowde84]

My point is that a maniacal dictator isn't a reason to fight a country trying to develop
its own nuclear weapons, as some other countries having it and we can't predict if one
day they'll have a dictator ruling their state.

Sure it is. North Korea is a successive dictatorship. Kim Jung Un's dad was the dictator before him, and his grandfather before that. The North Korean people treat their "supreme leader" as a god. So, theirs is a specifically dangerous situation when it comes to nuclear weapons.

But, that being said, most nations are against any nations developing nuclear weapons. There is absolutely no reason for them in this day and age. It would be a lot better if no one had any. But, unfortunately, that is not in the cards.

 

[Kirran]

@Godobeyer and @icehorse - you seem to have had a misunderstanding. Icehorse, you're not talking about terrorists, are you? You're talking about social attitudes among the general populace of Middle Eastern societies, I think?

 

[icehorse]

@Godobeyer and @icehorse - you seem to have had a misunderstanding. Icehorse, you're not talking about terrorists, are you? You're talking about social attitudes among the general populace of Middle Eastern societies, I think?

Thanks Kirran. My post was somewhat independent of terrorism. The general claim is that - for whatever reasons, and by whatever means - Muslims are pushing non-Muslims out of the ME. While we do sometimes see terrorist attacks, there are other ways of pushing people out.

 

[Kirran]

Thanks Kirran. My post was somewhat independent of terrorism. The general claim is that - for whatever reasons, and by whatever means - Muslims are pushing non-Muslims out of the ME. While we do sometimes see terrorist attacks, there are other ways of pushing people out.

That's what I thought. That didn't seem to have been communicated well.

 

[LuisDantas]

Hello all .

As a resume to my points.
Where we disagree on this ?

-generalizing is evil. OP is accuse/adress to "all Muslims" instead of "some Muslims"

I think you misunderstood that part.

-The world is in war with terrorism now,exactly as before was a war with Nazis,

There are significant differences. Nazis had unified goals and well-established authorities. After a while they had officially declared hostilities as well.

The situation regarding Muslims, violence and terrorism is considerably more complicated, as perhaps best illustrated today in Syria.

-The Muslims are fighting terrorists on ground,which the consquence of Western involve since Afghanistan/Soviet war.

Half true. Terrorism is fueled to an extent by irresponsible foreign policies, but also and IMO mainly by irresponsible monotheistic doctrine as well.

-Israel commit unhumanity crimes in their last wars in Gaza and Lebanon, Israel treat unequal the Muslims/Arabs inside Israel and treated badly Palestinians in West band and Gaza and Lebanon.

Sorry, but taking such a biased view of the conflict will not earn any attention from me. What do you have to say about the choices and attitudes of the Palestinians? What is your opinion of Hamas and its leadership? What do you think of the 1972 Munich killing? Of the frequent bombing over Israel?

Answer that, as well as my previous question about the Muslims and Arabs living in Israel, and then we can come back to how Israel ought to improve its act.

Which it does. But I can't very well expect it to make miracles alone (although that, too, has happened on occasion).

@LuisDantas reportes from ground with made us know that Israel treat badly,I am not acussing that very knowning,I do believe that you know that too,but it's seems you are pro-Israel too ?

I have come to adopt that stance, yes. Israel is very far from perfect. But seeing what its enemies do and aim for, I can't help but take its side.

This one made by Israeli Jews ,remember ?

Interestingly, there is no comparable Muslim video. That may be one reason why I am very much sympathising with Israel these days.

 

[icehorse]

Interestingly, there is no comparable Muslim video. That may be one reason why I am very much sympathising with Israel these days.

Luis, What I'm taking away from your posting of this video is that it's an example of self-criticism? If so, then I couldn't agree more.

@Godobeyer @FearGod

Yes it's true I'm a critic of Islam. I'm also a critic of Christianity. I'm also a critic of my own government.

 

[LuisDantas]

Actually, the video was posted by @Godobeyer, @icehorse

I just quoted it with Godobeyer's text.

 

[Godobeyer]

Interestingly, there is no comparable Muslim video. That may be one reason why I am very much sympathising with Israel these days.

Luis, What I'm taking away from your posting of this video is that it's an example of self-criticism? If so, then I couldn't agree more.

@Godobeyer @FearGod

Yes it's true I'm a critic of Islam. I'm also a critic of Christianity. I'm also a critic of my own government.

So Hey, don't forget that I feel no shame to post many times beforem videos made by Jews whom defending for Palestinians, or pro-peace


I watched many videos about how the Muslims treat well the Jews in Muslim world (Tunisia or Moroco,Iran ...etc), so it's not big deal/problem to be justice with others because all we are humans,soI think it's required.

Also in every place there is good people and bad people, I was mention to Israeli goverment on unjustice and occupation ...etc .

 

[Kirran]

A particular subset of Youtube videos are about the poorest source of understanding of a situation I can think of.

- Kirran, on RF while recovering from jet lag in Tel Aviv!

 

[icehorse]

Lots of interesting conversations got started here and at the same time I want to bring it back to the OP. What I see is a very lopsided situation when it comes to Islam. When Muslims are a small minority in a country they seek to be tolerated and treated fairly, which is fine so far. But when Muslims become a majority in a country they typically treat their minorities as well.

The result of this is that in Turkey and much of the ME (and perhaps other areas as well), non-Muslims get treated poorly and they leave.

 

[LuisDantas]

That sure seems to be that case. I am not sure it can not be the case.

 

[icehorse]

But when Muslims become a majority in a country they typically treat their minorities as well.

Typo from above: they typically "DON'T" treat their minorities as well.

Here's an interesting video from the UN that supports the claim that Muslim majority countries tend to be intolerant of non-Muslims:

 

[icehorse]

And where are the Christians in the ME safe?