The Paedophile Hunter

[freethinker44]

You're correct, & anyone who would disagree is utterly & embarrassingly wrong. To add some justice to this baseline, I've proposed reduced criminality when ages are closer, eg, 18 year old boinks a 17 year old.

In Michigan age of consent is 16 and I think a five year age difference if between 13 and 16 is allowed.

 

[Koldo]

This just shows how out of touch you are. I can honestly tell you that a lot of young girls are vulnerable to older men. By basic compliments I mean, you're pretty you're smart etc. It doesn't take much to get a child to hang on to your every word. Some are more vulnerable than others. But you don't even agree that seeking out young teens and children is about power. So this is probably a waste of time.

I have already asked you to prove that. If you can't, then we are indeed probably wasting time talking to each other on this topic.

 

[Revoltingest]

How does that work on USA? Who gets sent to jail? Both?

I'm not expert enuf to say what happens here, especially with variation among the states. But in general, I'd like to see jail avoided as much as possible. Certainly, a consensual relationship between 2 individuals very close in age is very different from a much older adult & a juvenile. The former strikes me as unworthy of prosecution at all.

 

[Revoltingest]

In Michigan age of consent is 16 and I think a five year age difference if between 13 and 16 is allowed.

I had no action in that age range!

 

[George-ananda]

Why do you believe real kids would behave any differently?

From my observation of the world over my lifetime. The guy might have to go through a lot of kids to get one to act as agreeable as the setup person.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

From my observation of the world over my lifetime. The guy might have to go through a lot of kids to get one to act as agreeable as the setup person.

Is this how you would describe the epidemic of some priests in the Catholic church to had been able to sexually assault dozens upon dozens of kids and teens during their tenure(s)?

FWIW, you and I have had very different life experiences of the world around us. I say this as a mother of four grown kids, a teacher who has worked with kids and teens for over 25 years, and have been active with the local rape crisis center and as an advocate for sexual assault survivors.

I also knew personally two different adults in their 30s - adults who were trusted with children - who were discovered to have either repeatedly raped kids as young as 6, or had created a "secret life" with teen girls who were 15 years old. They are both in jail now, but only after it was discovered that these events had been occuring for years with other survivors they had created.

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

From my observation of the world over my lifetime. The guy might have to go through a lot of kids to get one to act as agreeable as the setup person.

Does not matter. Because in the UK if you send at least 2 messages for the purposes of grooming you are breaking the law. Even if a child doesn't meet up with you you can still be convicted For grooming

 

[George-ananda]

Is this how you would describe the epidemic of some priests in the Catholic church to had been able to sexually assault dozens upon dozens of kids and teens during their tenure(s)?

FWIW, you and I have had very different life experiences of the world around us. I say this as a mother of four grown kids, a teacher who has worked with kids and teens for over 25 years, and have been active with the local rape crisis center and as an advocate for sexual assault survivors.

I also knew personally two different adults in their 30s - adults who were trusted with children - who were discovered to have either repeatedly raped kids as young as 6, or had created a "secret life" with teen girls who were 15 years old. They are both in jail now, but only after it was discovered that these events had been occuring for years with other survivors they had created.

Nice vent but it didn't address my post.

 

[Midnight Rain]

I don't think of a teenager as a child, but rather as a transition between childhood and adulthood.
But to answer your question: Yes, I want to allow adults and teenagers to have sex together if they wish to do so. And that's not ( necessarily ) abuse in my book..

Then we will disagree. I don't think its abuse for an 18 year old. I have mixed feelings about 16 but 15 and under I can't really imagine it being anything but abusive.

 

[George-ananda]

Does not matter. Because in the UK if you send at least 2 messages for the purposes of grooming you are breaking the law. Even if a child doesn't meet up with you you can still be convicted For grooming

I think I'm OK with that law. BUT the line between conversation and grooming can be a fine and blurry line. A setup person may more easily coax someone to cross the line by being more open than the normal kid. You must see my point too. I'm for kid's safety of course and I also hate to see a guy artificially coaxed to cross the line.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Nice vent but it didn't address my post.

Not a vent. And it addressed your post by countering that i have had different experiences than you have had.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I think I'm OK with that law. BUT the line between conversation and grooming can be a fine and blurry line. A setup person may more easily coax someone to cross the line by being more open than the normal kid. You must see my point too. I'm for kid's safety of course and I also hate to see a guy artificially coaxed to cross the line.

I dunno about Britian yet there is legal protection in the US from entrapment by authorities in cases where cohersion is used to entise someone to commit a crime where otherwise that person wouldn't have done so.

 

[freethinker44]

I dunno about Britian yet there is legal protection in the US from entrapment by authorities in cases where cohersion is used to entise someone to commit a crime where otherwise that person wouldn't have done so.

This is the problem I have with this. These types of stings are borderline entrapment already and they need to be really careful they don't cross that line and arrest an innocent person or worse let a dangerous predator back on the streets because they fumbled the investigation. At least with To Catch A Predator here in the US, law enforcement conducted the stings and the TV crew just followed them. I think he should leave it up to professional investigators and law enforcement.

 

[Twilight Hue]

This is the problem I have with this. These types of stings are borderline entrapment already and they need to be really careful they don't cross that line and arrest an innocent person or worse let a dangerous predatory back on the streets because they fumbled the investigation. At least with To Catch A Predator here in the US, law enforcement conducted the stings and the TV crew just followed them. I think he should leave it up to professional investigators and law enforcement.

Yea. I saw the show where they use an adult that posed as an underage teen in chat rooms and such. I think the criteria was for the girl to acknowelede that she was a minor and make no solitations herself that would constitute entrapment.

I'm sure the shows legal team carefully studied that before assisting law enforcement in the sting.

While I have no problem in legal arrests that removes threats from society, the thing that really bothers me is usage of media and law enforcement as the harbringers of entertainment. Offering cookies before the reveal on camara imo has nothing to do with enforcing law and ensuring safety for public. It's purely entertainment and in bad taste that sets the legal system as a modicum of entertainment and less a legal tool that such stings are intended to be.

 

[suncowiam]

I have always had a problem with 'set-ups'. The person might have resisted his lower urge if he didn't get such an easy opportunity placed in his lap.

There's an ethical line that one nevers crosses regardless of the situation. Unless if there is coercion involved which then can be considered entrapment.

What other ethical lines are you suggesting?

Here's a reference with some legal notes.

Sting operation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[psychoslice]

The problem is that when people take matters into their own hands they end up harming someone who is innocent, they became a law unto themselves, just as vigilantes do.

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

I think I'm OK with that law. BUT the line between conversation and grooming can be a fine and blurry line. A setup person may more easily coax someone to cross the line by being more open than the normal kid. You must see my point too. I'm for kid's safety of course and I also hate to see a guy artificially coaxed to cross the line.

If it's led to over 17 convictions they aren't being coaxed. It's the men who start the sexual conversations hunters crew just go a long with whatever THEY say. Some even send the "child" explicit photos. They know what they are doing.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

The kind of rhetoric that suggests that the predators are the "real" victims here? Those poor adults who wouldn't have done anything unless those bad people posing as slutty kids were seducing them by practically crawling in their laps and begging to have sex with them?

It's telling.

Predictable, but telling nonetheless.

 

[Revoltingest]

There's an ethical line that one nevers crosses regardless of the situation. Unless if there is coercion involved which then can be considered entrapment.
What other ethical lines are you suggesting?
Here's a reference with some legal notes.
Sting operation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Coercion is certainly wrong, but another potential problem is when the sting operation would entice someone to commit a crime they otherwise wouldn't commit, eg, establishing a personal relationship with the target & urging the commission of a crime.

 

[Revoltingest]

The problem is that when people take matters into their own hands they end up harming someone who is innocent, they became a law unto themselves, just as vigilantes do.

While problematic, this will happen when law enforcement creates a massive vacuum by failing to address problems.