The problem of Creationism in Islam rejecting the science of evolution.

[Monty]

The Torah was not written in Oxford English, and the Rabbis know better than you or I concerning how to understand and interpret the Torah.

From their knowledge of the Torah the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood covered the mountains and all the humans and animals perished that were not on the Ark. The Rabbis today agree,

You are the one that needs lessons on the Biblical Hebrew and respect for the Rabbis.

That's completely and utterly irrelevant to me and doesn't change the unequivocal fact that the Rabbis from their knowledge of the Torah and who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible clearly said the flood height was 15 cubits, and same same for the KJV and Young's Literal Translation, and that's good enough for me. And those fake versions which falsely say that Mt Everest and the highest mountains were covered by over 15 cubits are totally irrelevant to me and are complete fantasies with zero credibility.

And you are the one that needs lessons on the English language and respect for the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible and what that verse actually says and means in the OJB & KJV & YLT.

 

[shunyadragon]

That's completely and utterly irrelevant to me and doesn't change the unequivocal fact that the Rabbis from their knowledge of the Torah and who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible clearly said the flood height was 15 cubits, and same same for the KJV and Young's Literal Translation, and that's good enough for me. And those fake versions which falsely say that Mt Everest and the highest mountains were covered by over 15 cubits are totally irrelevant to me and are complete fantasies with zero credibility.

And you are the one that needs lessons on the English language and respect for the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible and what that verse actually says and means in the Orthodox Jewish Bible and the KJV & YLT.

The Torah was not written in Oxford English, and the Rabbis know better than you or I concerning how to understand and interpret the Torah.

From their knowledge of the Torah the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood covered the mountains and all the humans and animals perished that were not on the Ark. The Rabbis today agree,

You are the one that needs lessons on the Biblical Hebrew and respect for the Rabbis.

 

[Monty]

The Torah was not written in Oxford English, and the Rabbis know better than you or I concerning how to understand and interpret the Torah.

That's completely irrelevant since the Orthodox Jewish Bible is written in English and not ancient Hebrew. And if you disagree with the interpretation of the Rabbis who wrote the OJB I suggest you argue with them since I didn't write it.

From their knowledge of the Torah the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood covered the mountains and all the humans and animals perished that were not on the Ark. The Rabbis today agree,

You are the one that needs lessons on the Biblical Hebrew and respect for the Rabbis.

None of that changes the fact that the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood height was 15 cubits and did not say the harim/mountains were covered by 15 cubits, but merely that they were covered.

And if you are a Rabbi whose first language is ancient Hebrew you should respect what the Talmud says and the different interpretations of the other Rabbis who continually argue about the meaning and interpretation of the Torah.

 

[justaguy313]

What mockery??

That giant cut and paste job you posted doesn't address my points or counterarguments to you at all. I've already pointed out to you that abiogenesis and evolution are different things that you are conflating.




Humanity has pondered over the origin of life, and has searched for answers in religion and science.
Both fields have tried to explain the origin of life. From theories such as the Big Bang to Evolution,
for many, science has provided a satisfactory explanation that replaces theistic arguments. Over the
last century, the Theory of Evolution, which began with Charles Darwin, has become a mainstream
belief. In our times, avowed atheists propagate it and anti-theist scientists like Richard Dawkins
have popularized the idea through books like The God Delusion . For the most part, the propagation
has been effective.

Nonsense.

As I already pointed out to you, many Christians and religious-minded folks also accept that evolution is a reality of life on earth.
I gave you Francis Collins, head of the Human Genome Project as an example.

You didn't respond to anything I said.


"Charles Darwin traveled around the world where he would catalog the local plants and animals.
On one of his trips to the Galapagos Islands, he noticed non-identical species of finches with each
species having a slightly different beak. Years later, he would come up with the idea that these
species all must have a common ancestor. These differences must be due to adaptation to new
circumstances over time. As a result, they evolved slightly according to their environment. Thus,
similarities in species and adaptation became the basis for the Theory of Evolution."

He was right. The discovery of genetics, many years later, confirmed and verified his observations. As did the fossil record.


"Darwin concluded through analogy, that living beings that looked similar must have a common
origin that adapted to new conditions."

Through analogy?
Where's the analogy?


"Over a long period, the differences and changes would
become so many that they give rise to a new species.

This has since been confirmed and verified, many times over.


Thus, the reason for the changes would be the
factor that would allow one species to survive and others to become extinct. He called this law the
survival of the fittest . Therefore, according to Darwin, evolution was necessary to adapt and survive.
Through natural selection, the strongest in nature survived and they had similar features. Finally,
their shared features pointed to a common ancestor and origin.

Not quite. Survival of a species doesn't depend on the extinction of another.


"One day someone asked Imam Ahmed Al-Hassan (From Him is Peace), “ Is the theory of
Evolution correct? ”"

Who? What does this guy know about science?


"The Imam (From Him is Peace) said, “ The theory of evolution is one of the dumbest theories out
there. Iblis is the one who taught Darwin the Theory of Evolution. ”

He doesn't sound very well educated on the subject matter. Why are we asking this guy about evolution, again?



"Someone said, “ Can you help me with a small piece of information about the origin of life? There
are a lot of similarities between humans and other species. ”

This question doesn't make any sense.

Origin of life (abiogenesis) and evolution are not the same thing. Evolution requires life to exist and reproduce for it to act upon.


"The Imam (From Him is Peace) said, “ For example, who does the human resemble? ”
The person said, “ Humans and apes for example, and there are other organs or parts in our bodies
that resemble other species. ”

Humans are apes. This guy doesn't seem to know very much about evolution.


"The Imam (From Him is Peace) said, “ There is a resemblance as well between some aquatic species
and some mammals, and there are also plants that resemble mammals. And there are also stones that
were formed to look like human faces and animals and plants by natural events such as wind and
rain. So, are these stones now biologically related to humans? Of course not. The answer is no, there is
no relationship between apes and humans. ”

Oh dear. Stones do not reproduce and do not evolve, as biological organisms do. The analogy doesn't work.

And again, humans are apes, according to cladistics.


"The person said, “ So what about the origin of life? ”
The Imam (From Him is Peace) said, “ It was with Adam (PBUH). He is the first human
creation. ”

That's a claim that requires demonstration. How did he demonstrate it to be true?


We have included here some images of inanimate beings that resemble human or animal
anatomy. If the Theory of Evolution claims that resemblance between species means there is a
biological relationship, then these plants and stones should be biologically related to us as well. In
this argument, the Imam (From Him is Peace) is saying that similarity is not a sucient condition
to prove the basic tenets of the Theory of Evolution. Furthermore, this theory does not even
consider an extraterrestrial source for life on Earth. Thus, the Imam (From Him is Peace) is
categorically rejecting any truth in the Theory of Evolution.

We're still continuing with this terrible watchmaker-type analogy? All this guy is doing is betraying his lack of understand as to what evolution actually is, as well as conflating it with origins.

Plants are related to other organisms, to varying degrees. That's demonstrable.
Rocks do not reproduce and pass on heritable traits to anything. So the analogy is flawed.

Also, scientists don't just say "oh well these things look alike so they must be related."
No. We have genetics, that demonstrates a nested hierarchy of relatedness between all living things on earth. It's basically the same concept we use to demonstrate paternity today. It's the same concept used when you send your DNA sample to 23andMe to find your long lost relatives and trace them back to their origins.



"According to science, modern humans ( Homo sapiens ) evolved from an earlier form known as
Homo habilis or Homo erectus . Scientists discovered their fossils in Africa and identifieed similar
features to modern humans like their body proportion, size, and hands. They believe that these
features are the result of adaptation from living in trees to living on the ground. However, these
assumptions are false.

No, they're demonstrable and verifiable. This Imam guy doesn't know what he's talking about.


" Imam Ahmed Al-Hassan (From Him is Peace) debunks this myth by
revealing the reality of the Haytan. The Haytan are human ape-like species that lived on the planet
and still do to this very day."

I said, “ The creature that the natives call Bigfoot or Yeti, that resembles the Haytan… ”
The Imam (From Him is Peace) said, “ Those are the descendants of the Haytan. ”
I said, “ Glory be to God. ”
The Imam (From Him is Peace) said, “ I told you before, there are still many of them still alive
today. ”

Wait, this guy thinks that bigfoot exists and are the ancestors to humans? LOL


"-Goal of the wise by Aba Sadiq from him is peace, door number 25-Alien life and extraterrestrials"

If he's speaking on behalf of god, you'd think he'd know a lot more than he does.

What mockery? Ask yourself again that question and contemplate about it for a long time

 

[1213]

The KJV and Orthodox Jewish Bible and Young's Literal Translation etc clearly say the flood was only 15 cubits high.

Why you ignore the part that says "and the mountains were covered"?

 

[1213]

...Pangaea broke up about 200 million years ago, and after Gondwana broke up over 50 million years ago.

Why do you believe that?

Do you have any actual scientific evidence to support your hypothesis that kangaroos and echidnas are native to the middle east?

To me it is enough to know it is possible they were also there, but later were extinct in that area, possibly because of were eaten, or didn't otherwise survive in that area..

 

[1213]

Have you ever seen a god and had a face to face conversation like Abraham did when he shared a meal with a god (Gen 18)?
If not, then how do you know that gods exist?

I believe God exists because Bible exists and things go as told in the Bible.

 

[1213]

How is any of this evidence of a "great flood." Please explain.

If the flood happened as told in the Bible, we should find all of those. And if we find them, they are evidence for the flood, because:

1) vast sediment formations like for example orogenic mountains, the area of Grand Canyon.
-> Flooding water from the "fountains of great deep" flushed material from where the water came. The material was carried in thick layers and consisted of all kind of lose material, obviously first that what was on top of everything.
2) modern continents
-> Originally there was single continent, and below that there was vast amount of water. the flood came when the continent was broken. And eventually the pieces of the continent sunk and formed the modern continents.
3) Oil, gas and coal fields
-> All living things died from surface of the earth. Lot of it was flushed and mixed in with the sediments. And in time they were formed into oil gas and coal.
4) Marine fossils on high mountain areas
-> If water covered all mountains, as the Bible tells, we can expect marine animals appearing to the higher areas.
5) Mid Atlantic ridge
-> When the original continent was broken, there was obviously lines where it was cracked. Mid Atlantic ridge is evidence of such fault line.
6) Old coast lines
-> If water covered everything and later went down, it would have left cost lines in many phases of decreasing water level. That we can see such lines is evidence for the flood.

I hope these images could help to understand how the flood happened. In the image 3 (sphere and section view) is the situation before the flood, one continent on top of water. Image 4 shows how cracks appeared and from there vast amount of water vapor and flooding water also that carried all kind of stuff towards those lines where nowadays is great mountains. This also cleaned the area next to the fault line (for example the ocean floor of Atlantic), making it look like a new continental surface.

 

[Monty]

Why you ignore the part that says "and the mountains were covered"?

Doesn't change the fact that the Orthodox Jewish Bible clearly says the flood which drowned Noah's mother and grandparents was only 15 cubits high, and therefore the harim/mountains in the flooded area were less than 15 cubits higher than the normal river height since the Orthodox Jewish Bible says they were covered.

OJB
Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise;
and the harim were covered.

 

[Monty]

I believe God exists because Bible exists and things go as told in the Bible.

Just words in a book written by men for men about men and their patriarchal society.
And unless you have actually seen a god and had a face to face discussion as described in Gen 18 then you have no evidence that gods actually exist.

 

[Monty]

Why do you believe that?

Because Australia is still moving northwards at the rate of ~70 mm per year after it split from Antarctica over 50 million years ago, and why we have to recalibrate our satellite-navigation systems, and why the Himalayas are still moving upward after the Indo-Australian plate collided with the Eurasian Plate about 40 million years ago, and why there are marine fossils on Mt Everest which are millions of years old. Australian Plate - Wikipedia

To me it is enough to know it is possible they were also there, but later were extinct in that area, possibly because of were eaten, or didn't otherwise survive in that area..

IOW you have no scientific evidence to support your claim that kangaroos and echidnas are native to the middle east, since they evolved in isolation on Australia after it split from Antartica over 50 million years ago.

 

[shunyadragon]

That's completely and utterly irrelevant to me and doesn't change the unequivocal fact that the Rabbis from their knowledge of the Torah and who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible clearly said the flood height was 15 cubits, and same same for the KJV and Young's Literal Translation, and that's good enough for me. And those fake versions which falsely say that Mt Everest and the highest mountains were covered by over 15 cubits are totally irrelevant to me and are complete fantasies with zero credibility.

And you are the one that needs lessons on the English language and respect for the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible and what that verse actually says and means in the OJB & KJV & YLT.

False, the Torah was not written in Oxford English, and the Rabbis know better than you or I concerning how to understand and interpret the Torah written in Hebrew. The Rabbis read and recite the Tanakh in traditional Hebrew, and understand, teach and interpret it based on Hebrew text.The text is variously translated for layman, but not for Rabbis. When the tanakh is researched and studied it is in Hebrew,

What Language Do Orthodox Jews Speak?

Dear Jew in the City-What language do Orthodox Jews speak? Sincerely, Madison / Dear Madison-Thanks for your question but it’s a little like asking what language Catholics speak. (I doubt very much you’d expect all Catholics to speak Latin!) Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish...

jewinthecity.com

Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish people – that’s the language in which Tanach (the Jewish Bible) and most of our prayers are written. However, we were exiled for the umpteenth time when the second Temple was destroyed and ultimately dispersed all over the world. The center of Jewish life moved to Babylonia and Aramaic became the common language. (The Talmud is written in Aramaic.) But Jews in other lands spoke whatever was spoken in their countries of residence – German, Spanish, French, Dutch – whatever. (I’m an Orthodox Jew and I speak English!)a


From their knowledge of the Torah the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood covered the mountains and all the humans and animals perished that were not on the Ark. The Rabbis today agree,

You are the one that needs lessons on the Biblical Hebrew and respect for the Rabbis.

 

[shunyadragon]

What mockery? Ask yourself again that question and contemplate about it for a long time

You face many problems in your posts. It is like you are in a glass house throwing stones.

You mock science and misrepresent it.

 

[Subduction Zone]

If the flood happened as told in the Bible, we should find all of those. And if we find them, they are evidence for the flood, because:

1) vast sediment formations like for example orogenic mountains, the area of Grand Canyon.
-> Flooding water from the "fountains of great deep" flushed material from where the water came. The material was carried in thick layers and consisted of all kind of lose material, obviously first that what was on top of everything.
2) modern continents
-> Originally there was single continent, and below that there was vast amount of water. the flood came when the continent was broken. And eventually the pieces of the continent sunk and formed the modern continents.
3) Oil, gas and coal fields
-> All living things died from surface of the earth. Lot of it was flushed and mixed in with the sediments. And in time they were formed into oil gas and coal.
4) Marine fossils on high mountain areas
-> If water covered all mountains, as the Bible tells, we can expect marine animals appearing to the higher areas.
5) Mid Atlantic ridge
-> When the original continent was broken, there was obviously lines where it was cracked. Mid Atlantic ridge is evidence of such fault line.
6) Old coast lines
-> If water covered everything and later went down, it would have left cost lines in many phases of decreasing water level. That we can see such lines is evidence for the flood.

I hope these images could help to understand how the flood happened. In the image 3 (sphere and section view) is the situation before the flood, one continent on top of water. Image 4 shows how cracks appeared and from there vast amount of water vapor and flooding water also that carried all kind of stuff towards those lines where nowadays is great mountains. This also cleaned the area next to the fault line (for example the ocean floor of Atlantic), making it look like a new continental surface.
View attachment 86015

Let's go over why the Grand Canyon could not have been formed by your mythical flood..

 

[Monty]

False, the Torah was not written in Oxford English, and the Rabbis know better than you or I concerning how to understand and interpret the Torah written in Hebrew. The Rabbis read and recite the Tanakh in traditional Hebrew, and understand, teach and interpret it based on Hebrew text.The text is variously translated for layman, but not for Rabbis. When the tanakh is researched and studied it is in Hebrew,

What Language Do Orthodox Jews Speak?

Dear Jew in the City-What language do Orthodox Jews speak? Sincerely, Madison / Dear Madison-Thanks for your question but it’s a little like asking what language Catholics speak. (I doubt very much you’d expect all Catholics to speak Latin!) Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish...

jewinthecity.com

Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish people – that’s the language in which Tanach (the Jewish Bible) and most of our prayers are written. However, we were exiled for the umpteenth time when the second Temple was destroyed and ultimately dispersed all over the world. The center of Jewish life moved to Babylonia and Aramaic became the common language. (The Talmud is written in Aramaic.) But Jews in other lands spoke whatever was spoken in their countries of residence – German, Spanish, French, Dutch – whatever. (I’m an Orthodox Jew and I speak English!)a


From their knowledge of the Torah the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood covered the mountains and all the humans and animals perished that were not on the Ark. The Rabbis today agree,

You are the one that needs lessons on the Biblical Hebrew and respect for the Rabbis.

Whoosh Whoosh!!!

None of those continual irrelevancies changes the unequivocal fact that the rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible clearly said the flood was only 15 cubits high, and that the harim in the flooded area were covered and were therefore less than 15 cubits higher than the normal river water height.

OJB
Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise;
and the harim were covered.

And since you don't understand the English language, I suggest you ask someone who does to explain what that verse in the OJB actually says and means, and what the meaning and purpose of a semi-colon is.

Since you are a Rabbi whose first language is ancient Hebrew not English, if you believe that the interpretation by the other Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible is wrong, I suggest you discuss that with them and write it into the Talmud, since I didn't write the OJB even though, unlike you, I understand what it actually says and means.

 

[shunyadragon]

Whoosh Whoosh!!!

None of those continual irrelevancies changes the unequivocal fact that the rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible clearly said the flood was only 15 cubits high, and that the harim in the flooded area were covered and were therefore less than 15 cubits higher than the normal river water height.

OJB
Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise;
and the harim were covered.

And since you don't understand the English language, I suggest you ask someone who does to explain what that verse in the OJB actually says and means, and what the meaning and purpose of a semi-colon is.

Since you are a Rabbi whose first language is ancient Hebrew not English, if you believe that the interpretation by the other Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible is wrong, I suggest you discuss that with them and write it into the Talmud, since I didn't write the OJB even though, unlike you, I understand what it actually says and means.

Woosh!!! Wooosh!!!

False, the Torah was not written in Oxford English, and the Rabbis know better than you or I concerning how to understand and interpret the Torah written in Hebrew. The Rabbis read and recite the Tanakh in traditional Hebrew, and understand, teach and interpret it as based on the original compilation of the Pentateuch in the Hebrew text.The text is variously translated for layman, but not for Rabbis. When the tanakh is researched and studied it is in Hebrew,

Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise and the harim were covered.
No punctuation nor semi-colons in Biblical Hebrew

What Language Do Orthodox Jews Speak?
Dear Jew in the City-What language do Orthodox Jews speak? Sincerely, Madison / Dear Madison-Thanks for your question but it’s a little like asking what language Catholics speak. (I doubt very much you’d expect all Catholics to speak Latin!) Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish...

jewinthecity.com
Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish people – that’s the language in which Tanach (the Jewish Bible) and most of our prayers are written. However, we were exiled for the umpteenth time when the second Temple was destroyed and ultimately dispersed all over the world. The center of Jewish life moved to Babylonia and Aramaic became the common language. (The Talmud is written in Aramaic.) But Jews in other lands spoke whatever was spoken in their countries of residence – German, Spanish, French, Dutch – whatever. (I’m an Orthodox Jew and I speak English!)a


From their knowledge of the Torah the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood covered the mountains and all the humans and animals perished that were not on the Ark. The Rabbis today agree,

You are the one that needs lessons on the Biblical Hebrew and respect for the Rabbis.

 

[Monty]

Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise and the harim were covered.
No punctuation nor semi-colons in Biblical Hebrew

Whoosh Whoosh!!! Seems there are a few roos short in the top paddock, eh!!!
IOW the OJB says the flood height was 15 cubits and the harim were covered, and does not say the harim were covered by 15 cubits.

But if you disagree with the interpretation of the Rabbis who wrote the OJB I suggest you argue with them and write it in the Talmud since I didn't write the OJB which is written in English using alphanumeric symbols and not using Hebrew symbols

 

[shunyadragon]

Whoosh Whoosh!!! Seems there are a few roos short in the top paddock, eh!!!

That is completely and totally irrelevant since the Orthodox Jewish Bible is written in English not Hebrew if you haven't bothered to notice. And the Rabbis who wrote it clearly say that the flood height was 15 cubits and that the harim were covered, and DO NOT SAY that the harim were covered by 15 cubits.
And since you do not understand English I suggest you ask someone who does understand English to explain that verse in the OJB to you.

OJB
Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;(SEMI COLON)

and the harim were covered.

And if you disagree with the interpretation of the Rabbis who wrote the OJB I suggest you argue with them and write it in the Talmud since I didn't write the OJB which is written in English not Hebrew

Woosh!!! Wooosh!!!

False, the Torah was not written in Oxford English, and the Rabbis know better than you or I concerning how to understand and interpret the Torah written in Hebrew. The Rabbis read and recite the Tanakh in traditional Hebrew, and understand, teach and interpret it as based on the original compilation of the Pentateuch in the Hebrew text.The text is variously translated for layman, but not for Rabbis. When the tanakh is researched and studied it is in Hebrew,

Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise and the harim were covered.
No punctuation nor semi-colons in Biblical Hebrew

What Language Do Orthodox Jews Speak?
Dear Jew in the City-What language do Orthodox Jews speak? Sincerely, Madison / Dear Madison-Thanks for your question but it’s a little like asking what language Catholics speak. (I doubt very much you’d expect all Catholics to speak Latin!) Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish...

jewinthecity.com
Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish people – that’s the language in which Tanach (the Jewish Bible) and most of our prayers are written. However, we were exiled for the umpteenth time when the second Temple was destroyed and ultimately dispersed all over the world. The center of Jewish life moved to Babylonia and Aramaic became the common language. (The Talmud is written in Aramaic.) But Jews in other lands spoke whatever was spoken in their countries of residence – German, Spanish, French, Dutch – whatever. (I’m an Orthodox Jew and I speak English!)a


From their knowledge of the Torah the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood covered the mountains and all the humans and animals perished that were not on the Ark. The Rabbis today agree, By the way the consistent unchangeable understanding and interpretation of the Tanakh is one of the hallmarks of Orthodoc Judaism.

You are the one that needs lessons on the Biblical Hebrew and respect for the Rabbis.

 

[Monty]

Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise and the harim were covered.
No punctuation nor semi-colons in Biblical Hebrew

Whoosh Whoosh!!!
IOW the OJB says that the Flood height was 15 cubits and the harim were covered, and does not say that the harim were covered by 15 cubits.
And that verse is written in English using alphanumeric symbols and not Hebrew symbols if you haven't bothered to notice.

You are the one who needs to develop some comprehension skills and knowledge of the English language, given the OJB is written in English not Hebrew.

If you believe otherwise, then what is your evidence that this OJB verse is written in Hebrew using Hebrew symbols and not in English using alphanumeric symbols?

"Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise; and the harim were covered".

 

[shunyadragon]

Whoosh Whoosh!!!
IOW the OJB says that the Flood height was 15 cubits and the harim were covered, and does not say that the harim were covered by 15 cubits.
And that verse is written in English using alphanumeric symbols and not Hebrew symbols if you haven't bothered to notice.

You are the one who needs to develop some comprehension skills and knowledge of the English language, given the OJB is written in English not Hebrew.

If you believe otherwise, then what is your evidence that this OJB verse is written in Hebrew using Hebrew symbols and not in English using alphanumeric symbols?

"Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise; and the harim were covered".

Woosh!!! Wooosh!!!

False, the Torah was not written in Oxford English, and the Rabbis know better than you or I concerning how to understand and interpret the Torah written in Hebrew. The Rabbis read and recite the Tanakh in traditional Hebrew, and understand, teach and interpret it as based on the original compilation of the Pentateuch in the Hebrew text.The text is variously translated for layman, but not for Rabbis. When the tanakh is researched and studied it is in Hebrew,

Fifteen cubits upward did the waters rise and the harim were covered.
No punctuation nor semi-colons in Biblical Hebrew

What Language Do Orthodox Jews Speak?
Dear Jew in the City-What language do Orthodox Jews speak? Sincerely, Madison / Dear Madison-Thanks for your question but it’s a little like asking what language Catholics speak. (I doubt very much you’d expect all Catholics to speak Latin!) Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish...

jewinthecity.com
Hebrew is the traditional language of the Jewish people – that’s the language in which Tanach (the Jewish Bible) and most of our prayers are written. However, we were exiled for the umpteenth time when the second Temple was destroyed and ultimately dispersed all over the world. The center of Jewish life moved to Babylonia and Aramaic became the common language. (The Talmud is written in Aramaic.) But Jews in other lands spoke whatever was spoken in their countries of residence – German, Spanish, French, Dutch – whatever. (I’m an Orthodox Jew and I speak English!)a


From their knowledge of the Torah the Rabbis who wrote the Orthodox Jewish Bible said the flood covered the mountains and all the humans and animals perished that were not on the Ark.

The Rabbis today agree, By the way the consistent unchangeable understanding and interpretation of the Tanakh is one of the hallmarks of Orthodox Judaism. You are the one that needs lessons on the Biblical Hebrew and respect for the Rabbis.

What you have not referenced is any Rabbi that supports your unfounded assertions. You asked me to consult Rabbis and I did, and found none that support your assertions.