The Qur'an allows sex-slaves...!?

[Nefelie]

except

Give me a break, will ya? I'm Greek!

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[Godobeyer]

Because at the same time it tells you that it’s OK to have slaves.
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it's said it's ok but enourage to free slaves.

btw which religions in world ban slavery ?

 

[Rival]

Give me a break, will ya? I'm Greek!

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I'm a follower of a Persian religion, I can't help it...

 

[firedragon]

Alright, I'll bite.

What do you think it means?

Sunshine and rainbows?

Not really. Sunshine and rainbow are Shuruk Shamsi and Kazah in simple terms.

 

[Rival]

it's said it's ok but enourage to free slaves.

btw which religions in world ban slavery ?

Well, probably none, which is why it shouldn't be too hard for Muslims to admit their religion is no different. It's just another shrug.

 

[Godobeyer]

Well, probably none, which is why it shouldn't be too hard for Muslims to admit their religion is no different. It's just another shrug.

"probably none" for what ?
Islam is may the only religion which enourage free slaves in world!

last word for "prostitues by order" or "strip clubs" plz ?

 

[Rival]

"probably none" for what ?
Islam is may the only religion which enourage free slaves in world!

last word for "prostitues by order" or "strip clubs" plz ?

There are no religions that I know of that openly ban slavery, including Islam.

 

[Godobeyer]

There are no religions that I know of that openly ban slavery, including Islam.

I know,so include yours
I was talking about encourage free the slaves

 

[Rival]

I know,so include yours
I was talking about encourage free the slaves

The Gathas don't mention slavery at all, so it's sort of an open question. In other words, Zoroastrians decide for themselves whether slave-owning is good or not. And we decided not. It was abolished in the Achaemenid Empire by Cyrus, a Persian:

He considered all nations equal in terms of their rights. Cyrus was relatively liberal and he was the first king who put an end to slavery and dictatorial oppression. While he himself ruled according to Zoroastrian beliefs, he made no attempt to impose Zoroastrianism on the people of his subject territories. He was a very down to earth person. The Persians called him “father”, the Greeks saw him as “A worthy ruler and lawgiver” and the Jews regarded him as “The Lord’s anointed”. His ideals were high, as he laid down that no man was fit to rule unless, he was more capable than all of his subjects. As an administrator Cyrus’ insight was great, and he showed himself both intelligent and reasonable. His humanity was equalled by his freedom from pride, which induced him to meet people on the same level, instead of affecting the remoteness and aloofness, which characterized the great monarchs who preceded and followed him.

http://www.persepolis.nu/persepolis-cyrus.htm

 

[FearGod]

True. But according to Qur’an, sex with your slaves is OK:

Who abstain from sex, except with those joined to them in the marriage bond or (the captives) whom their right hands possess, for (in their case) they are free from blame.
Qur'an 23:5-6​

Both are marriage, one is to seek a wife from her parents and such kind of wives are محصنات (out of reach), the other option​

is to marry the one who are working to the person such as domestic helper and such kind of people are in need and no parents
to have their permission, please read verse 4:25 carefully to understand the difference between both.

It would be much easier if the Qur’an forbade slavery, to start with.

That means a disaster at that period of time, no place to sleep and no food to eat.

 

[firedragon]

http://quran.com/

For this specific verse: http://quran.com/23/5-6

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This is what your source says

"And they who guard their private parts Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed"

You quoted

Who abstain from sex, except with those joined to them in the marriage bond or (the captives) whom their right hands possess, for (in their case) they are free from blame.
Qur'an 23:5-6

Whats your source Nefelie? And why would you give me a different source after you quoting from another?

 

[Godobeyer]

The Gathas don't mention slavery at all, so it's sort of an open question. In other words, Zoroastrians decide for themselves whether slave-owning is good or not. And we decided not. It was abolished in the Achaemenid Empire by Cyrus, a Persian:

He considered all nations equal in terms of their rights. Cyrus was relatively liberal and he was the first king who put an end to slavery and dictatorial oppression. While he himself ruled according to Zoroastrian beliefs, he made no attempt to impose Zoroastrianism on the people of his subject territories. He was a very down to earth person. The Persians called him “father”, the Greeks saw him as “A worthy ruler and lawgiver” and the Jews regarded him as “The Lord’s anointed”. His ideals were high, as he laid down that no man was fit to rule unless, he was more capable than all of his subjects. As an administrator Cyrus’ insight was great, and he showed himself both intelligent and reasonable. His humanity was equalled by his freedom from pride, which induced him to meet people on the same level, instead of affecting the remoteness and aloofness, which characterized the great monarchs who preceded and followed him.

http://www.persepolis.nu/persepolis-cyrus.htm

You just said there is no religion ban slavery !

I don't know about "Zoroastrians" , but for my opinion Persians in past had slavery.

 

[Rival]

You just said there is no religion ban slavery !

I don't know about "Zoroastrians" , but for my opinion Persians in past had slavery.

The religion. i.e, the texts (the Gathas) don't mention slavery.

Therefore, the followers get to make the decision to ban it or not.

The followers banned slavery (at least in this particular Empire)

Yes, I believe it existed in the other Persian Empires.

 

[Rival]

This is what your source says

"And they who guard their private parts Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed"

You quoted

Who abstain from sex, except with those joined to them in the marriage bond or (the captives) whom their right hands possess, for (in their case) they are free from blame.
Qur'an 23:5-6

Whats your source Nefelie? And why would you give me a different source after you quoting from another?

What does 'What right hands possess' mean to you?

 

[Sabour]

I love strip clubs tbh.

Also yes, slavery did exist in the past, but it is backed up by Allah in the Qur'an for Muslims. So that's different. It means it can never be abolished as it's from Allah.

Slavery is not backed by Islam.

If a book talks about a problem and provides solution for it, it doesn't mean that the book support it. If I came with a long term plan to gradually stop slavery without any damages, it doesn't mean I am supporting it.

 

[firedragon]

What does 'What right hands possess' mean to you?

Theres no point Rival.

The aim is to slander and insult. Thats why you cant explain how Right hand possess became slaves and then it became sex slaves. You said sex slaves.

And verses and random quotes are cut and pasted off the internet. Thats because you do not intend to understand further if someone provides an analysis that you can understand logically. You will not.

 

[Rival]

Slavery is not backed by Islam.

If a book talks about a problem and provides solution for it, it doesn't mean that the book support it. If I came with a long term plan to gradually stop slavery without any damages, it doesn't mean I am supporting it.

Look, we've provided the verses. This discussion is basically over until you can at least admit those verses exist, Muhammad owned slaves and slaves are captured in wars.

 

[firedragon]

Look, we've provided the verses. This discussion is basically over until you can at least admit those verses exist, Muhammad owned slaves and slaves are captured in wars.

Where were those verses taken from?

And just look at Nefelie mate, cuts and pastes a verse that suits an agenda, but provides a different source when asked. Due to what? Due to a bias cut and paste act, nothing else.

When your intentions are to drag a face down a gutter no matter what, nothing will register.

Peace.

 

[Rival]

Theres no point Rival.

The aim is to slander and insult. Thats why you cant explain how Right hand possess became slaves and then it became sex slaves. You said sex slaves.

And verses and random quotes are cut and pasted off the internet. Thats because you do not intend to understand further if someone provides an analysis that you can understand logically. You will not.

Look, if a man buys a girl slave what do you think he's going to do with her? Buy teddy bears?

Seriously, what does it mean to you?

Are you a Muslim or not? Do you disagree with Quran? With hadith? With what Muhammad did? With Muslim Scholars? What more do you seriously want?


*Rival has hissy fit*

 

[Sabour]

Look, we've provided the verses. This discussion is basically over until you can at least admit those verses exist, Muhammad owned slaves and slaves are captured in wars.

Would you be willing to read an explanation on the subject? I have already drafted one long time ago because that is a common question that is asked. I was asked about the topic like 5-6 times on this forums but that was a long time ago.