The Reality of Evil

[dawny0826]

The problem is not that 'bad people do bad things,' but that good people do bad things.

Why?

I think there is goodness or at least the potential for goodness and wholesomeness in every human being. I wouldn't blanket label everyone as being "good" but I don't exactly disagree with the statement that "good people do bad things" OR disagree with the statement "bad people do bad things".

Is knowledge the answer? If we know right from wrong can we be good? Will overcoming ignorance make us good and lead us to peace and harmony?

I believe that knowledge is only going to take you so far in deciphering right from wrong. Overcoming ignorance is a good start but I do think that morality and spirituality are very important in deciphering right from wrong.

I believe that peace and harmony is found only in Jesus Christ and even when one places their faith in Christ...the road is still bumpy.

What do you think of this summation:

1. Evil is real
2. The good are not as smart as they think they are.
3. The good need all the help they can get; one cannot be good on one's own.

1. I totally believe that evil is real.

2. I don't know about using "good" as a blanket label. In my opinion, no one is truly good while here on this earth. We have the potential to be "good" and "good" can be realized but no one is purely good. Not many truly deserve the label "good", in my opinion. I don't really like the statement "The good are not as smart as they think they are" because it's vague...it's stereotypical.

3. I think we ALL need all the help we can get. I don't believe that anyone was meant to "make it" on their own, good or bad.

By not recognizing that we have our own capacity for evil we are ripe to be overtaken by it.

I totally agree.

What do you think? Is evil real? If so, how is it overcome?

I believe wholeheartedly that evil is overcome by Christ and that the believer, when in Christ THEN and ONLY then has the authority to tell evil to get behind them in the name of Christ.

 

[lunamoth]

I want to thank everyone for their answers so far, gnomon and Dawny. I can't keep up with detailed replies right now but I wanted you all to know that I appreciate the input. The OP was provocative. As I said I paraphrased it from The Good Book by Peter Gomes, a (liberl) Baptist minister and theologian at Harvard. But, the three statements that most of you dislike or disagree with either slightly or strongly is verbatim from his chapter on the Bible and evil. They had me puzzled as well, which is why I thought they would make an interesting thread.

I hope for more input and I also hope to come back with some of my own thoughts on the matter.

luna

 

[Ðanisty]

.... okay, so maybe I didn't think that statement all the way through. Ideally, I like to think that there's good in all people, and time after time I'm proven wrong. But I also know when I'm backed into a corner, and when to cease and desist. I appologize, I don't know what else to say without sounding overly flakey...

I'm sorry. I forget that some people don't want to be exposed to things in such a forthright and brutal manner. :sorry1:

 

[Willamena]

The problem is not that 'bad people do bad things,' but that good people do bad things.

Why?

Is knowledge the answer? If we know right from wrong can we be good? Will overcoming ignorance make us good and lead us to peace and harmony?

OR...is the opposite true?

Stop me if you've heard this one before: there are no 'good people' or 'bad people', there are only people who do good and bad things. Nothing outside of us can "make us good"; we create ourselves, and that self will either act in accordance with what is best for it --including all it identifies with --and its environment (good), or it will wither (bad) and eventually perish. There is no 'evil', only failure to be true to oneself.

What do you think of this summation:

1. Evil is real
2. The good are not as smart as they think they are.
3. The good need all the help they can get; one cannot be good on one's own.

This suggests that we are 'morally weak,' and is illustrated by the lynch mob. They see themselves and each other as good; they do not contemplate evil acts. They may feel they are driven by a sense of offended righteousness. They would argue that is was a sense of justice that motivated them to join with their neighbors in dispensing rough justice. Where others see that what they are doing is evil, they themselves see no evil in their actions.

By not recognizing that we have our own capacity for evil we are ripe to be overtaken by it.

What do you think? Is evil real? If so, how is it overcome?

I don't believe in evil.

Appearances can be deceiving --which is why they should not be miss-taken for actuality. That is the "miss": thinking that how we see ourselves is how we are. The argument that we cannot "be good" falls apart on that fulcrum. The apparently objective "good and evil" that we can or cannot "be" on our own is argued faslely as the appearance of good or evil.

The appearance of evil is not evil; it is a separate beast with its own virtues and uses. One use for appearances is to set up two complementary aspects of what "real" is, because when we include the agent of appearances in the equation, whether directly or implied, we introduce the objective and the subjective viewpoints. Appearances are only real from the subjective viewpoint.

Similarly, the appearance of "being good" is not what good, itself, is. Appearances are relative; they are how we, as individuals, view things in the world (not-me). We must separate what "appears to be good or bad" from actuality, which makes no value judgements, or we fall into the fallacy of saying that appearances define how things really are, or to phrase it another way, that we create reality in our minds --not that it's not a valid philosophical viewpoint, but in my opinion there are reasonable arguments against it being of any practical use. We create the appearance (the image) of the objectively real reality.

 

[adthelad]

Evil is real if you define it as something that is calculated to harm.

All of the trouble in society stems from about the 2% of people who's goal in life is to create as much harm as possible. What people generally don't realise is that you can't tell an evil person by looking at them. There are people that seem very friendly, live normal lives and yet go around doing as much evil as possbile whilst remaining undiscovered.

So there are evil people, but that doesn't mean they are basically evil.

 

[gnomon]

There is no such thing as evil beyond the defintion of bad. The majority of the world's problems come from cultural pride and the unwillingness to understand anything beyond that which satisfies our ego.

 

[adthelad]

It's evil people who are the cause of that! en:

 

[Ulver]

again.... there is no Evil as there is no Good. It's all created in our heads.

 

[adthelad]

That's the line psychiatrists take.

Everything is created in our ""heads"". Does that mean nothing is real?

Before we can have a meaningful discussion we need to agree on the definitions of the words we're using.

 

[Hema]

When light is introduced into darkness, the darkness goes away. Similarly to overcome evil, we must invoke God. God is the light that removes the darkness of evil. People become evil because they do not live in the awareness of God, they do not live in God consciousness. Both good people and bad people can be smart but wisdom - knowledge of the higher self- can really be developed in good people.

 

[adthelad]

I think I agree with that - though you need to tell people what "invoke God" means to make that a practical solution.

 

[Pardus]

"No candle burns so bright that it does not cast a shadow."

 

[Ulver]

That's the line psychiatrists take.

Everything is created in our ""heads"". Does that mean nothing is real?

Before we can have a meaningful discussion we need to agree on the definitions of the words we're using.

What is it with Scientologist's vs. Psychiatrists?

I think people will never give Freud enough credit for hitting a number of thigns right on the mark. Though many of his ideas were used by earlier people, yet, that is usually how great things happen. They don't come out of nothing.

"No candle burns so bright that it does not cast a shadow."

Brilliant quote there.

 

[doppelganger]

What is it with Scientologist's vs. Psychiatrists?

The former views itself as selling a competing product to that of the latter. Disparagement is a nifty marketing tool.

 

[Pardus]

The reality of evil, evil is just a word used to prejudice.

 

[Mr. Hair]

Evil is real if you define it as something that is calculated to harm.

Indeed, just as unicorns are real if one defines them as four-legged creatures with manes. Does this entail that unicorns exist?

 

[Hema]

I think I agree with that - though you need to tell people what "invoke God" means to make that a practical solution.

Just to believe in God and if we are scared we can say a prayer, talk to God like a friend/mother/father. I have heard that evil can only harm us if we are scared of it. To not be afraid we have to firmly believe that we have the greatest and most powerful protector with us - God.

 

[doppelganger]

I have heard that evil can only harm us if we are scared of it. To not be afraid we have to firmly believe that we have the greatest and most powerful protector with us - God.

What do you do if and when the "evil" harms you anyway?

 

[Pardus]

Just to believe in God and if we are scared we can say a prayer, talk to God like a friend/mother/father. I have heard that evil can only harm us if we are scared of it. To not be afraid we have to firmly believe that we have the greatest and most powerful protector with us - God.

I like that sentiment, mostly because logically that would mean that things that can harm you are not evil unless they scare you.

 

[Hema]

What do you do if and when the "evil" harms you anyway?

I don't think any evil has harmed me but my best friend was being harassed by an evil spirit once and she went to a Baptist woman who told her that she saw Lord Shiva (a Hindu deity) behind her. She gave my friend a necklace with a pendant of Lord Shiva and she blessed it (I suppose she said prayers etc. to provide a shield of protection). A short while after this, my friend actually saw the spirit in her room and it was coming near her but before it reached her it disappeared. When she told me about it she held her necklace and said "It was all because of this guy." The spirit never bothered her again. It doesn't matter what religion you are, get help from a spiritual person, someone in authority - a priest, Imam etc. They can bless items of jewellry to act as a "guard" to protect against evil. I have seen on the Discovery Channel that when people use Ouija boards it invites evil spirits into their homes. I hope I didn't scare anyone. I believe that there is no power greater than God.