The Republicans are the Problem

[Magic Man]

I don't need to fact check, this year started out promising but has just about flat lined. Just because there is still a heart beat left is not a great sign. Just wait and see what happens if Obama is reelected, the patient will give up the ghost.

I don't need to wait and see. I can already tell you that whether Obama or Romney is elected, the patient will continue to improve, as it has been for the past few years.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Think of it this way between the 2 candidates. Obama wants to help the middle and lower class by cutting taxes and increasing taxes on the wealthy.
Romney wants to tax the middle and lower class and give the wealthy tax breaks.

When it comes to business, if you don't have customers, you don't make it long. If the middle and lower class doesn't have disposable income on top of living expenses, you won't see customers. Romney wants to take more money out of the customer pocket. So expect your business and customer base to have less money under Romney. Less $ = Less Business.

Would you agree that the middle class creates the jobs in the economy?

My customers are not middle class, so no, you can't make money off a group of people who pinch every penny. This is why I do not have a residential business, it is twice the work for half the money.

The rich write my checks, I have never got a considerable check from a middle class person. Trickle down economics has done well for me in the past.

I realise that the money does not trickle down to the bottom, but it does flow from the rich, not the average consumer.

If you was to start a business model, would you not target someone who is well off?

 

[esmith]

Amen Rev! My bank account looks like the tide on the beach. A bunch of money rushes in and in moments it rushes back out. There is no comfort zone anymore like the good ol days.

Hoarding? None of the boomers I know have anything to hoard.
We're spending it as fast as it comes in.

Try working for a company for over 10 years, have it go bankrupt and you lose all of the matching funds the company put in your 401K. Then work another 6 years and have a good 401K from another company, retire at 55, sell the totally paid off house, convert the 401K to a IRA and invest the house money in various mutual funds, take the RV and travel. Only to have the stock market crash and you lose over 50% of your investments. And some on here wonder why I'm in a bad mood some of the time.....CRAP

 

[tytlyf]

My customers are not middle class, so no, you can't make money off a group of people who pinch every penny. This is why I do not have a residential business, it is twice the work for half the money.

The rich write my checks, I have never got a considerable check from a middle class person. Trickle down economics has done well for me in the past.

I realise that the money does not trickle down to the bottom, but it does flow from the rich, not the average consumer.

If you was to start a business model, would you not target someone who is well off?

If you don't mind me asking, what do you sell? What field?

 

[Reverend Rick]

You can retire. I give you my permission! In fact, it's rather important to upcoming generations that the baby boomers who can afford it retire, so that all those remaining tasty middle class jobs they are occupying are freed up. Somewhere there is a competitor who will take on whatever demand your retirement frees up, and another employer who will take on your staff.

Demand for the services you provide is what creates your job, and the jobs of your employees. Demand will not be affected if all the disgruntled republicans retire after Obama is reelected. Only supply can be affected by the mass retirement of angry republicans. Wherever there is demand, there is someone who is chomping at the bit to become a supplier.

Or do you really think that once you retire, all your clients are going to say "phooey, Rick retired. I guess there's no point building anything any more"?

Oh sure, life will go on, but the profit margins will not sustain any new start ups. If you did not already have equipment paid off and had to purchase everything you need to do what I do, you would be lucky to break even.

When the economy is cranking, demand raises profit margins. When everyone is sitting on the sidelines, people low ball bid just to stay alive. That is part of life, but you can't run a business for very long like that.

If you are trying to raise a family and buy a home and rise to a higher economic level, you need to funnel off some of the capital. Hard to do when the margins are so low.

I have a feeling my customers will be upset when they have to use a contractor that cannot provide the level of service I do. Low ball contractors cannot afford to maintain service after the sale or correct any problems that arise later. They will be working so hard to pay for equipment and make their mortage payment, that they would collapse if they missed a draw because they worked an additional week for no payment making good on things on a past job.

Sure no one monkey stops the show, but things will be different in the future. I wonder how hard my employees will work for less money and benefits. There are only so many dollars to go around and if you are the low bidder with a small profit margin and huge overhead, you will have no choice but to pay your employees less.

The business owner will be making less as well.

So yes, someone will take my place, but it will not be as rewarding as it was for me and they might not stay is business for very long.

 

[Revoltingest]

Try working for a company for over 10 years, have it go bankrupt and you lose all of the matching funds the company put in your 401K. Then work another 6 years and have a good 401K from another company, retire at 55, sell the totally paid off house, convert the 401K to a IRA and invest the house money in various mutual funds, take the RV and travel. Only to have the stock market crash and you lose over 50% of your investments. And some on here wonder why I'm in a bad mood some of the time.....CRAP

I was in a much better mood when I was rich (sort of).

 

[Reverend Rick]

I don't need to wait and see. I can already tell you that whether Obama or Romney is elected, the patient will continue to improve, as it has been for the past few years.

Ever heard of a double dip recession? You don't know if things will continue to improve or not, no one can. Things may get even better or they could tank. Limping along like we have been grows old, many will throw in the towel and their replacements will be of a lower caliber.

 

[esmith]

I was in a much better mood when I was rich (sort of).

If you are referring to me being at one time rich, that's a good one. Our max investments were never over $250,000. So, if $250,000 is rich, we were rich.

 

[Reverend Rick]

If you don't mind me asking, what do you sell? What field?

I'm a commercial and industrial electrical contractor.

 

[Revoltingest]

If you are referring to me being at one time rich, that's a good one. Our max investments were never over $250,000. So, if $250,000 is rich, we were rich.

Rich is a relative thingie.
But $250K can enable a comfortable (but careful) lifestyle.

 

[esmith]

Rich is a relative thingie.
But $250K can enable a comfortable (but careful) lifestyle.

Yeah, until you lose half of it when the market plunges, and was using part of the IRA to meet RV payments. Not complaining (much) though, we got to see a lot of the country in 9 years and didn't have to put up with the nasty winter weather in Oregon. Yes, the weather in the Portland area in the winter does leave a lot to be desired. The web's between my toes have finally disappeared.

 

[Revoltingest]

Yeah, until you lose half of it when the market plunges, and was using part of the IRA to meet RV payments. Not complaining (much) though, we got to see a lot of the country in 9 years and didn't have to put up with the nasty winter weather in Oregon. Yes, the weather in the Portland area in the winter does leave a lot to be desired. The web's between my toes have finally disappeared.

May obscene (or at lease tasteful) wealth afflict you in the recovery.

 

[esmith]

May obscene (or at lease tasteful) wealth afflict you in the recovery.

Sure would be nice, but the only way we are going to see obscene wealth is to win Power Ball. However, someone told me you had to buy a ticket first, but I figure the odds of finding a winning ticket is almost as good as purchasing one.

 

[tytlyf]

I'm a commercial and industrial electrical contractor.

Thanks. I'm assuming you deal mostly with corporations and government contracts? Have you considered expanding into the housing market with your capabilities?
I'm sure competition in the area has grown, which will hurt business. Are you marketing on the web, etc? I would think your credentials would be a good selling point in the housing market.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Have you considered expanding into the housing market with your capabilities?

Residential electrical work is twice the work and hassle for half the money. The average residential electrician makes about 1/3 the wages I pay my people.

 

[Magic Man]

Try working for a company for over 10 years, have it go bankrupt and you lose all of the matching funds the company put in your 401K. Then work another 6 years and have a good 401K from another company, retire at 55, sell the totally paid off house, convert the 401K to a IRA and invest the house money in various mutual funds, take the RV and travel. Only to have the stock market crash and you lose over 50% of your investments. And some on here wonder why I'm in a bad mood some of the time.....CRAP

I don't wonder why you're in a bad mood, but I do wonder why after this you'd be against regulation when the stripping away of regulation is exactly what cause you all these problems.

 

[Magic Man]

Ever heard of a double dip recession? You don't know if things will continue to improve or not, no one can. Things may get even better or they could tank. Limping along like we have been grows old, many will throw in the towel and their replacements will be of a lower caliber.

So, what's the point? Sure, we could go back into a recession. We could also get hit by an asteroid, or California could fall off into the ocean. There is no reason right now to think we'll suddenly tumble back into a recession. The trend is steadily up for 2 years now. And that's under Obama. It's possible that if he's re-elected, things could tank again, but that's not based on anything other than fear-mongering.

 

[Wirey]

Residential electrical work is twice the work and hassle for half the money. The average residential electrician makes about 1/3 the wages I pay my people.

Amen, brother. Residential is a young man's game. Work a 90 hour week and take home $400.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I don't want to be nitpicking; however you did say(my edit)



This is why I thought that there is a confusion about what the deficit is. However, I think I know what you are attempting to say. You say that Bush had 1.1trillion of deficit that had to be made up by borrowing the money to cover it. That the obligation was still there when Obama took office, therefore there would be a deficit at the end of Obama's 1st year. I agree, it was just your wording. However, it was not only Bush but every President that has amassed a "debt" which is caused by a deficit.

Decisions that dictate the deficit do carry over from year to year. It's not like Obama would have been able to say "sorry, troops in Afghanistan: we're laying you off and not supplying you any more. Make your own way home."

 

[Revoltingest]

Decisions that dictate the deficit do carry over from year to year. It's not like Obama would have been able to say "sorry, troops in Afghanistan: we're laying you off and not supplying you any more. Make your own way home."

That's a pretty extreme scenario. Obama could've stopped the war, & paid to
ship the troops home. Had you all made me dictator, that's what I would've done.