The Return of Christ

[Trailblazer]

Combining the two it's clear he is returning to me. Also, he is to believed in at the end times where not a people of the book will remain, but will believe in him. Every soul tastes death on earth "in it you die", and Isa (a) is not dead yet per these verses. He will be potent of the hour means he will come near the end times.

People are free to believe anything they want to believe, and they will, but it is clear to me from what Jesus said that Jesus was never planning to return to this world, and Jesus said he was not going to return.

This is a sore subject for me and one I don't want to argue about, because people can take any verses and interpret them to mean what they want to believe, but wanting Jesus to return to this world is not going to make Jesus return.

 

[Link]

People are free to believe anything they want to believe, and they will, but it is clear to me from what Jesus said that Jesus was never planning to return to this world, and Jesus said he was not going to return.

This is a sore subject for me and one I don't want to argue about, because people can take any verses and interpret them to mean what they want to believe, but wanting Jesus to return to this world is not going to make Jesus return.

It's sore subject because you are invested in your religion. This is understandable, every human is emotional when it comes to being vested in their religion or philosophy.

The hadiths of family of Mohammad (a) verify this interpretation as well. Sunni hadiths also verify this interpretation.

I think you are right, people can make words to mean anything. But it doesn't mean here it's not clear in saying Jesus (a) will return.

 

[Trailblazer]

It's sore subject because you are invested in your religion. This is understandable, every human is emotional when it comes to being vested in their religion or philosophy.

The hadiths of family of Mohammad (a) verify this interpretation as well. Sunni hadiths also verify this interpretation.

I think you are right, people can make words to mean anything. But it doesn't mean here it's not clear in saying Jesus (a) will return.

No, that is not why it is a sore subject. I would not even have to be a Baha'i to know that Jesus is not going to return. I only need to read the Bible.
Even if Baha'u'llah was not the return of Christ, the same man Jesus is not returning, according to the Bible.

It's sore subject for Muslims and Christians to have to face the fact that Jesus is not going to return because both of you are invested in your religion.
This is understandable, every human is emotional when it comes to being vested in their religion or philosophy.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

They've been brainwashed into a belief that is designed to give hope to believers and spread doom to non believer's.

It may give believes hope but it doesn't bother not believers.

Well said, in my opinion.

That's all I've experienced so don't knock it

Me too.

Why is it that you ask a question of non Christians then attemp to dis the answers?

This is my sentiment, too.

 

[Spice]

They've been brainwashed into a belief that is designed to give hope to believers and spread doom to non believer's.

It may give believes hope but it doesn't bother not believers.

I think it may very well harm believers and non-believers alike. Believers may see that they can not meet the requirements and turn to a life of decadence. I had a friend who once said, "I can't get sanctified so I might as well get satisfied."

Non-believers can be hurt in the long run as believers "assist" on the end times becoming reality. This wish for Armageddon was scary enough to make me see that Hell is right here and now! IMV, someone's soul is messed up if they spend their lives wishing for the destruction of this world thinking they get to live in Utopia and don't care about the ones who aren't ready yet.

 

[ChristineM]

I think it may very well harm believers and non-believers alike. Believers may see that they can not meet the requirements and turn to a life of decadence. I had a friend who once said, "I can't get sanctified so I might as well get satisfied."

Non-believers can be hurt in the long run as believers "assist" on the end times becoming reality. This wish for Armageddon was scary enough to make me see that Hell is right here and now! IMV, someone's soul is messed up if they spend their lives wishing for the destruction of this world thinking they get to live in Utopia and don't care about the ones who aren't ready yet.

Certainly the non believers i know don't even think like that.

 

[Spice]

Certainly the non believers i know don't even think like that.

I can respect that, but think of the effects the religious extremists have on all. We may well have an Armageddon type catastrophe, a WWIII in some future generation, with a religious roots. It would have nothing to do with reality but everything to do with belief.

 

[ChristineM]

I can respect that, but think of the effects the religious extremists have on all. We may well have an Armageddon type catastrophe, a WWIII in some future generation, with a religious roots. It would have nothing to do with reality but everything to do with belief.

I can easily imagine a WWIII scenario being a religious tiff.

 

[Ajax]

No, never. Jesus said we would see the Son of man coming in the clouds, but He never said we would see Him.

Who is the Son of man who will come in the clouds of heaven?

Mark 14:62 And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven. Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man...

www.religiousforums.com

First we have to clarify who was the Son of Man the NT writers wrote about..

The term, "Son of a Man, is used by Jesus 80 times as a way to refer to himself (32 times in Matthew; 14 times in Mark; 26 times in Luke; and 10 times in a different way from the Synoptic Gospels in John). In all these texts Jesus is the speaker; no one ever addresses him as Son of a Man. The identification with Jesus is, however, in most texts clear, and in some texts even explicit e.g., Mark 2:10-11 "But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins. So he said to the man, I tell you, get up, take your mat and go home.” and Mark; 8:31 "He then began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and after three days rise again."

So for someone who believes the Bible, Jesus said three times that he will return. Whether that was truly said (with divine knowledge) or made up by him or the authors, is another story.

 

[Twilight Hue]

This question is for non-believers of the Christian faith. All Christians believe that Christ will return. When you hear them say this what do you think it really means?

False expectations on something that will never happen.

 

[SalixIncendium]

This question is for non-believers of the Christian faith. All Christians believe that Christ will return. When you hear them say this what do you think it really means?

What do I think it really means to whom? To me?

It means Christ will return, but only to RF, to proclaim he is the Christ and either preach to the community or ask members to ask him the most difficult question they can come up with.

 

[ChristineM]

What do I think it really means to whom? To me?

It means Christ will return, but only to RF, to proclaim he is the Christ and either preach to the community or ask members to ask him the most difficult question they can come up with.

He's been a couple of times recently...

 

[JustGeorge]

What do I think it really means to whom? To me?

It means Christ will return, but only to RF, to proclaim he is the Christ and either preach to the community or ask members to ask him the most difficult question they can come up with.

He does seem to do that from time to time. RF is a fun place. I can see why Christ would want an account here.

Though, I'd be way more impressed to see Kalki, or King Arthur. I like variety.

 

[SalixIncendium]

He does seem to do that from time to time. RF is a fun place. I can see why Christ would want an account here.

An account? Since he's returned, he's created at least 5 that I can think of. I think the guy has more socks than Carter's has pills.

 

[Link]

No, that is not why it is a sore subject. I would not even have to be a Baha'i to know that Jesus is not going to return. I only need to read the Bible.
Even if Baha'u'llah was not the return of Christ, the same man Jesus is not returning, according to the Bible.

Honestly, Bahais can't even see the belief of Angels and day of judgment in Quran. No one can really take seriously what you say about any holy book saying anything.

 

[Trailblazer]

First we have to clarify who was the Son of Man the NT writers wrote about..

In the NT, the Son of Man does refer to Jesus and the NT writers might have 'believed' and thus wrote that we would see Jesus return in the clouds, but that is nothing Jesus said.

Moreover, the OT says that the messiah would be one like the Son of man.

Christians believe that the following verses are about Jesus, but if Jesus was the Son of man, as Jesus claimed to be, the following verses cannot be about the Jesus.

Daniel 7:13-14 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

I believe that those verses are about Baha'u'llah who was one like Jesus.

I believe that Jesus ascended into heaven. and Baha’u’llah, one like the son of man, descended from the heaven of the Will of God, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. Those verses are about an earthly Kingdom, not a heavenly Kingdom. Jesus’ Kingdom is in heaven, Baha’u’llah’s Kingdom will be on earth, after it is built by humans.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

 

[Trailblazer]

Honestly, Bahais can't even see the belief of Angels and day of judgment in Quran. No one can really take seriously what you say about any holy book saying anything.

Baha'is do believe in Angels and day of judgment. Baha'u'llah wrote about both of those.

 

[Link]

Baha'is do believe in Angels and day of judgment. Baha'u'llah wrote about both of those.

You believe Angels to be humans and day of judgment to be the period of Baha'allah Prophethood. It makes no sense. Again, all your interpretations are beyond ridiculous and there's no sincerity to truth which is why I care less about what you think Gospels say about Jesus' return.

 

[CG Didymus]

They've been brainwashed into a belief that is designed to give hope to believers and spread doom to non believer's.

It may give believes hope but it doesn't bother not believers.

For how a lot of non-believers would see it... that's a great answer.

It's telling the believers, "Keep trusting. Keep holding on. Any day now, Jesus will come back a slay all the evil people and cast Satan into hell."

2000 years later... "Keep believing. Look at the times. With everything that's happening, Jesus is bound to be coming any day now."

 

[Trailblazer]

You believe Angels to be humans and day of judgment to be the period of Baha'allah Prophethood. It makes no sense. Again, all your interpretations are beyond ridiculous and there's no sincerity to truth which is why I care less about what you think Gospels say about Jesus' return.

We believe Angels are humans on earth or humans who have ascended to the celestial kingdom.

“And now, concerning His words: “And He shall send His angels….” By “angels” is meant those who, reinforced by the power of the spirit, have consumed, with the fire of the love of God, all human traits and limitations, and have clothed themselves with the attributes of the most exalted Beings and of the Cherubim. That holy man, Ṣádiq, 37 in his eulogy of the Cherubim, saith: “There stand a company of our fellow-Shí’ihs behind the Throne.” Divers and manifold are the interpretations of the words “behind the Throne.” In one sense, they indicate that no true Shí’ihs exist. Even as he hath said in another passage: “A true believer is likened unto the philosopher’s stone.” Addressing subsequently his listener, he saith: “Hast thou ever seen the philosopher’s stone?” Reflect, how this symbolic language, more eloquent than any speech, however direct, testifieth to the non-existence of a true believer. Such is the testimony of Ṣádiq. And now consider, how unfair and numerous are those who, although they themselves have failed to inhale the fragrance of belief, have condemned as infidels those by whose word belief itself is recognized and established.

And now, inasmuch as these holy beings have sanctified themselves from every human limitation, have become endowed with the attributes of the spiritual, and have been adorned with the noble traits of the blessed, they therefore have been designated as “angels.” Such is the meaning of these verses, every word of which hath been expounded by the aid of the most lucid texts, the most convincing arguments, and the best established evidences.” The Kitáb-i-Íqán, pp. 78-80

We believe that the Day of Judgment is the day of the coming of the Manifestation of God.

"In the Bahá’í interpretation, the coming of each Manifestation of God is a Day of Judgment, but the coming of the supreme Manifestation of Bahá’u’lláh is the great Day of Judgment for the world cycle in which we are living. The trumpet blast of which Christ and Muhammad and many other prophets speak is the call of the Manifestation, which is sounded for all who are in heaven and on earth—the embodied and the disembodied. The meeting with God, through His Manifestation, is, for those who desire to meet Him, the gateway to the Paradise of knowing and loving Him, and living in love with all His creatures. Those, on the other hand, who prefer their own way to God’s way, as revealed by the Manifestation, thereby consign themselves to the hell of selfishness, error and enmity.” Bahá’u’lláh and the New Era, pp. 219-220

I do not care what you or anyone else thinks about Jesus' return. It is beyond ridiculous to me to believe that Jesus is going to come down from heaven through the clouds in the sky and land feet first on earth. Then what? If that happened how would anyone know it was Jesus? Beyond ridiculous.