The Translation Error Page - New Testament

[angellous_evangellous]

I have no remark on this. The Joseph Smith version is not a translation of any Greek text that we possess, or any other text that is available for review by anyone.

Ah, there it is.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Good grief! Perfectly good thread shot to ****. Please visit A_E's last post for an appropriate response to the Smith Version.

And now for something completely different:

What about Romans 3:22? I understand that the Greek word for "in" can also be translated "of."
"The righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ..." may be translated as "The righteousness of God through the faith of Jesus Christ..."

Yes, that is a very difficult passage for exegesis. I don't know of a definative answer for that. I favor "faith in Jesus Christ" and see it as consistent with the Pauline idea of being "in Christ" where the clearer "ev Christos" is used.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Back to the mistranslations...

This is one that I've been told is a mistranslation - Matthew 19:24 (see also Mark 10:25 and Luke 18:25):

NIV:

Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Supposedly, this is a confusion of two similar Greek words (something like "kamilos" and "kamelos", IIRC), one meaning "camel" and one meaning "thick rope".




Also, there's the hypothesis of Francisco Carotta that the entire New Testament was a mistranslation of the life story of Julius Caesar. A lot of his idea sounds extremely fishy, but he does bring up a fair number of interesting points.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Back to the mistranslations...

This is one that I've been told is a mistranslation - Matthew 19:24 (see also Mark 10:25 and Luke 18:25):

NIV:


Supposedly, this is a confusion of two similar Greek words (something like "kamilos" and "kamelos", IIRC), one meaning "camel" and one meaning "thick rope".

That's interesting. I'll have to check the varients when I get home tonight - or possibly later than that, I may need to consult some other sources. If this concept has any wieght at all, some Greek MSS will have "camel" and some will have "thick rope." If there are varients, it's due to mis-spelling. The different copies were done by hearing - one person would read it aloud to another scribe, who heard "kamilos" and wrote "kamelos" or vice-versa. What's really interesting is that it makes sense both ways - it's just as hard to get a thick rope through the eye of a needle as it is a camel.

Also, there's the hypothesis of Francisco Carotta that the entire New Testament was a mistranslation of the life story of Julius Caesar. A lot of his idea sounds extremely fishy, but he does bring up a fair number of interesting points.

That's just funny. I can't take this seriously.

Any contact points between the lives of the two great men in ancient biographies are incidental and may be shared by several others like Pythagoras, Socrates, et cetera.

 

[sojourner]

See the Lamsa version of the Bible. In the footnotes for Matt. 19, it says that the Aramaic word in question, gamla, means rope and camel.

 

[anders]

See the Lamsa version of the Bible. In the footnotes for Matt. 19, it says that the Aramaic word in question, gamla, means rope and camel.

Careful now if you're on dial-up, the pdf is 292 pages, and to make full use of it, you should know some Greek, Syriac and Hebrew.
A Lamsa fan writes

[FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]3. [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]Camel [/FONT][FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]or [/FONT][FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]rope[/FONT][FONT=TimesNewRoman,Bold]? – Matthew 19:24 / Mark 10:25 / Luke 18:25[/FONT][/FONT]

The Greek, reads "καµηλον" ([FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]kamélon) which is the accusative form of "[/FONT]καµηλος" ([FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]kamélos). This [/FONT]word, in Greek, only means "camel" and sometimes can mean "pack animal" however, if we take a look at it's Aramaic equivalent, we find the word [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]gamlo' is the only word in Aramaic to describe a [/FONT]generic camel (without getting specific, ie we have the words "colt," "foal," "mare," and "stallion," to describe types of horses, but one general word for the species, "horse").
However, [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]gamlo', has a double meaning. As Aramaic evolved separately from Hebrew, it picked up new [/FONT]idioms and meanings to it's vocabulary. [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]gamlo' is a perfect example, for Aramaic speaking peoples [/FONT]fashioned a rough, thick rope from camel's hair that had a very decent tensile strength, and after a while, it became to be known as, you guessed it, [FONT=TimesNewRoman,Italic]gamlo'.[/FONT]
...
We appear to have come across an idiom long lost in the Greek translation of an Aramaic original. Although it doesn't really change the meaning of the parable, it grants us insight into how in tune with his audience the Messiah actually was.
A 10th-century Aramaic lexicographer, Bar-Bahlul, says of “Gamla” (same word as gamlo’) in his Aramaic dictionary:
"Gamla is a thick rope which is used to bind ships"
Considering that Jesus was speaking to fishermen, this meaning of Gamla seems more appropriate, and I think is a fantastic proof that the Greek was translated from an Aramaic original.

But there is a Qur'an verse that also uses the camel/eye of needle phrase:
QS Al-A'raaf (7):40 in Yusuf Ali’s interpretation:

To those who reject Our signs and treat them with arrogance, no opening will there be of the gates of heaven, nor will they enter the garden, until the camel can pass through the eye of the needle: Such is Our reward for those in sin.

Mistranslation? Possibly. The quoted pdf has more suggestions.