There are no mistakes in Quran

[FearGod]

Prof Hay's rebuttal.

If water passes through a barrier then it is not a barrier that can not be transgressed.

What prevents fresh water from becoming a salt water, bring 2 bodies of water close to each other,one salt and the other fresh,
naturally both bodies will mix and make one body of water.

 

[Shad]

What prevents fresh water from becoming a salt water, bring 2 bodies of water close to each other,one salt and the other fresh,
naturally both bodies will mix and make one body of water.

That is a plume of water but it still mixes. Your comment does not support the video title. You made one claim then use a video making a different one.

http://www.adn.com/article/mythbusting-place-where-two-oceans-meet-gulf-alaska
http://soundwaves.usgs.gov/2008/03/

 

[FearGod]

That is a plume of water but it still mixes. Your comment does not support the video title. You made one claim then use a video making a different one.

http://www.adn.com/article/mythbusting-place-where-two-oceans-meet-gulf-alaska
http://soundwaves.usgs.gov/2008/03/

Labuan Cermin (two water lake); Indonesia
http://fisheries-ecovilla.com/archives/566


The aura is magnificent. The thing that makes Labuan Cermin lake different from other lakes is that the lake has two types of water, freshwater and salt water. That too, you will find both different waters in one area.
Not only that, but both types of organisms also live in the water of this Lake.
Freshwater fish living on the surface of the Lake while salt water fish live in the bottom of the Lake. Surprisingly, both types of water do not get mixed. It can be seen that the sea water and fresh water are separated by layers like clouds. The white muddy layer in the lake is allegedly the result of decomposition basic harbor organisms that trapped. The thickness of the layer of freshwater and saltwater can be changed in accordance with tidal sea water. This natural wonder is still a mystery of how this phenomenon occurs.

And he it is who has given freedom of movement to the two great bodies of water – the one sweet and thirst-allaying, and the other salty and bitter – and yet has wrought between them a barrier and a forbidding ban. (25:53)

 

[Augustus]

And he it is who has given freedom of movement to the two great bodies of water – the one sweet and thirst-allaying, and the other salty and bitter – and yet has wrought between them a barrier and a forbidding ban. (25:53)

(25:53)[/QUOTE]


Can I ask you about the Arabic?

"the two great bodies of water/seas" - is this clearly discussing 2 specific places? Does the word mean sea or just large body of water?

Is it not discussing 2 specific places, such the Sea of Galilee and the Dead Sea that are important in Biblical history rather than discussing rare aquatic phenomena half a world away? How does a lagoon in Indonesia qualify as a 'great body of water'?

 

[FearGod]

(25:53)


Can I ask you about the Arabic?

"the two great bodies of water/seas" - is this clearly discussing 2 specific places? Does the word mean sea or just large body of water?

Is it not discussing 2 specific places, such the Sea of Galilee and the Dead Sea that are important in Biblical history rather than discussing rare aquatic phenomena half a world away? How does a lagoon in Indonesia qualify as a 'great body of water'?

No, it isn't a metaphor.
You can think of it anything else but that'll be a wishful thinking.

Actually the next verse says, how then you deny and lie about my existence.

Surprisingly, both types of water are not mixed. It can be seen that the sea water and fresh water are separated by layers like clouds.
http://fisheries-ecovilla.com/archives/566

 

[Augustus]

No, it isn't a metaphor.
You can think of it anything else but that'll be a wishful thinking.

Saying 2 seas when you are referring to 2 actual seas is not a metaphor.

He let forth the two seas that meet together, (19)between them a barrier they do not overpass.

They meet via the river Jordan.

The problem with your explanation is that it is wrong. They do pass the 'barrier' just at a slow enough rate to create the impression that there is a 'barrier'.

He let forth the two seas that meet together, (19)between them a barrier they do not overpass. (20)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny?(21)From them come forth the pearl and the coral.(22)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny? (23)His too are the ships that run, raised up in the sea like land-marks. (24)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny?

Why would a verse aimed at Arabs be referring to a little known lagoon in Indonesia? How does this count as a 'sign' to the audience?

So there is an explanation that relates to the actual context of the Middle East and is factually correct. There is another example that relates to a lagoon in Indonesia that is factually incorrect.

Strange that you prefer the 2nd option.

 

[FearGod]

Saying 2 seas when you are referring to 2 actual seas is not a metaphor.

He let forth the two seas that meet together, (19)between them a barrier they do not overpass.

They meet via the river Jordan.

The problem with your explanation is that it is wrong. They do pass the 'barrier' just at a slow enough rate to create the impression that there is a 'barrier'.

He let forth the two seas that meet together, (19)between them a barrier they do not overpass. (20)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny?(21)From them come forth the pearl and the coral.(22)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny? (23)His too are the ships that run, raised up in the sea like land-marks. (24)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny?

Why would a verse aimed at Arabs be referring to a little known lagoon in Indonesia? How does this count as a 'sign' to the audience?

So there is an explanation that relates to the actual context of the Middle East and is factually correct. There is another example that relates to a lagoon in Indonesia that is factually incorrect.

Strange that you prefer the 2nd option.

The dead sea got coral and pearl, think as you wish.

 

[Shad]

Labuan Cermin (two water lake); Indonesia
http://fisheries-ecovilla.com/archives/566


The aura is magnificent. The thing that makes Labuan Cermin lake different from other lakes is that the lake has two types of water, freshwater and salt water. That too, you will find both different waters in one area.
Not only that, but both types of organisms also live in the water of this Lake.

A lake is one body of water. The water still mixes but the rate s not high enough to counter the flow of fresh water. Otherwise there would be an increasing amount of fresh water building up. There isn't.

Freshwater fish living on the surface of the Lake while salt water fish live in the bottom of the Lake. Surprisingly, both types of water do not get mixed. It can be seen that the sea water and fresh water are separated by layers like clouds. The white muddy layer in the lake is allegedly the result of decomposition basic harbor organisms that trapped. The thickness of the layer of freshwater and saltwater can be changed in accordance with tidal sea water. This natural wonder is still a mystery of how this phenomenon occurs.

The website is a travel website. It's opinion on chemistry is moot and provides no reference.

And he it is who has given freedom of movement to the two great bodies of water – the one sweet and thirst-allaying, and the other salty and bitter – and yet has wrought between them a barrier and a forbidding ban. (25:53)

This verse never mentions anything specific so the lake mentioned above is cherry picking while ignoring all the other examples of rivers, estuaries and lakes. all you have done is count 1 hit from a dubious sources and ignored the misses. Your argument relies on a fallacy.

 

[Shad]

Saying 2 seas when you are referring to 2 actual seas is not a metaphor.

He let forth the two seas that meet together, (19)between them a barrier they do not overpass.

They meet via the river Jordan.

The problem with your explanation is that it is wrong. They do pass the 'barrier' just at a slow enough rate to create the impression that there is a 'barrier'.

He let forth the two seas that meet together, (19)between them a barrier they do not overpass. (20)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny?(21)From them come forth the pearl and the coral.(22)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny? (23)His too are the ships that run, raised up in the sea like land-marks. (24)O which of your Lord's bounties will you and you deny?

Why would a verse aimed at Arabs be referring to a little known lagoon in Indonesia? How does this count as a 'sign' to the audience?

So there is an explanation that relates to the actual context of the Middle East and is factually correct. There is another example that relates to a lagoon in Indonesia that is factually incorrect.

Strange that you prefer the 2nd option.

The 2nd option makes the verse special rather than a mundane observation anyone can make. People are taught there are miracles so tend to read miracles into everything.

 

[FearGod]

A lake is one body of water. The water still mixes but the rate s not high enough to counter the flow of fresh water. Otherwise there would be an increasing amount of fresh water building up. There isn't.

You found a solution for the mystery.

The website is a travel website. It's opinion on chemistry is moot and provides no reference.

The website was removed, you may check the same article here

This verse never mentions anything specific so the lake mentioned above is cherry picking while ignoring all the other examples of rivers, estuaries and lakes. all you have done is count 1 hit from a dubious sources and ignored the misses. Your argument relies on a fallacy.

Yes, i know, but i'm a believer

(30:58)
verily We have propounded for men, in this Qur'an every kind of Parable: But if thou bring to them any Sign, the Unbelievers are sure to say, "Ye do nothing but talk vanities.

 

[Shad]

You found a solution for the mystery.

No I am pointing out that a body of water can often be arbitrary

The website was removed, you may check the same article here

A carbon copy of a travel guide with zero references to it's statements.

Yes, i know, but i'm a believer

Which is merely acknowledging your bias and your inability to overcome it. All you done is admit that you use fallacious reasoning as a believer by cherry picking and ignore the examples which contradict the verse.

(30:58)
verily We have propounded for men, in this Qur'an every kind of Parable: But if thou bring to them any Sign, the Unbelievers are sure to say, "Ye do nothing but talk vanities.

Irrelevant and preaching to the choir.

 

[FearGod]

No I am pointing out that a body of water can often be arbitrary

A carbon copy of a travel guide with zero references to it's statements.

Which is merely acknowledging your bias and your inability to overcome it. All you done is admit that you use fallacious reasoning as a believer by cherry picking and ignore the examples which contradict the verse.

Irrelevant and preaching to the choir.

I don't agree with you, the verse about God's power and plan in making such wonders is more than enough for me, i said (for me).

For you, it's up to you how you think about it, is't fair or i should agree with you blindly.

 

[Shad]

I don't agree with you, the verse about God's power and plan in making such wonders is more than enough for me, i said (for me).

Which is your opinion, one I do not share

For you, it's up to you how you think about it, is't fair or i should agree with you blindly.

Never said you had to agree with me. You made arguments for your religion. I poked holes in your reasoning. Simple as that.

 

[FearGod]

Never said you had to agree with me. You made arguments for your religion. I poked holes in your reasoning. Simple as that.

And your reasoning doesn't make sense to me, it makes sense to you and not to me.

 

[Shad]

And your reasoning doesn't make sense to me, it makes sense to you and not to me.

I do not expect someone that is prone to using fallacies in their reasoning to make sense of much. Still it is your problem not mine. If you do not understand fallacious reasoning in your own argument you wont understand my reasoning as you are unable to at this time.

 

[FearGod]

I do not expect someone that is prone to using fallacies in their reasoning to make sense of much. Still it is your problem not mine. If you do not understand fallacious reasoning in your own argument you wont understand my reasoning as you are unable to at this time.

And God knows your replies
(30:58)
We have told people various parables in this Quran. Even if you had shown them a miracle, the unbelievers would have said, "You are only the followers of falsehood".

 

[Shad]

And God knows your replies
(30:58)
We have told people various parables in this Quran. Even if you had shown them a miracle, the unbelievers would have said, "You are only the followers of falsehood".

You have told people using fallacious reason which is enough to dismiss the book as anything but man-made. Humans are prone to fallacious reasoning, God isn't. Your presupposition and projection of it are irrelevant. I am not part of your choir so the Quran has little meaning to me nor does your belief that God hears my reply. If God is bothered by this God can chat with me directly rather than it's minions using horrible arguments that do more harm than good.

 

[FearGod]

You have told people using fallacious reason which is enough to dismiss the book as anything but man-made. Humans are prone to fallacious reasoning, God isn't. Your presupposition and projection of it are irrelevant. I am not part of your choir so the Quran has little meaning to me nor does your belief that God hears my reply. If God is bothered by this God can chat with me directly rather than it's minions using horrible arguments that do more harm than good.

Yes i agree, the quran doesn't has a meaning for you but it has all the meaning for me.
You see it as a man-made whereas i see it as the words of the maker of this universe.

 

[Shad]

Yes i agree, the quran doesn't has a meaning for you but it has all the meaning for me.
You see it as a man-made whereas i see it as the words of the maker of this universe.

Sure. However your arguments for your views are lacking hence why it is not a rational nor logical position to hold but one of faith, ideology and indoctrination

 

[FearGod]

Sure. However your arguments for your views are lacking hence why it is not a rational nor logical position to hold but one of faith, ideology and indoctrination

For you yes, but not for me.
To me it's perfectly rational and logical matter.