There is no evidence for God, so why do you believe?

[ElishaElijah]

No a story said that. I'll stick with the opinion of Christian Scholarship, we don't know what Jesus said.
Not interested in your fantasy world.

You can dispute all you want but the issue is “What does the Bible say and teach”. You don’t know what Jesus said but I do because He gave me His Spirit, that’s how we communicate today. You can’t because you don’t have the Spirit.
Here is another Voltaire article:
Voltaire’s Prediction, Home, and the Bible Society: Truth or Myth? Further Evidence of Verification

 

[samtonga43]

Yup and the authority of the scriptures from Allah are also just as clear.Actually way clearer, they take the authority of scripture very seriously. And yet it's - IT'S TRUE BECAUSE IT SAYS SO!!!!!!!!!! Billions of people believe this, have personal relationships, cite hundreds of Islamic scholars and by 2050 will outnumber Christians in the U.S.

Yet, it's still fiction.

IT'S TRUE BECAUSE joelr SAYS SO!!!!!!!!!!

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

IT'S TRUE BECAUSE joelr SAYS SO!!!!!!!!!!

He did a reductio ad absurdum and since you know logic you know how that works.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Those christians that in your opinion aren't "real christians", read the same bible and obviously they think they do meet the criteria.

In fact, I'm pretty sure that I can find christians reading that same bible who'll then use those same criteria to argue that YOU aren't a "real christian".

Well go for it and prove your point, use the Bible to prove me wrong.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Well go for it and prove your point, use the Bible to prove me wrong.

I don't actually care what your bible says.
I'm just trying to make clear to you how arrogant you are by doubling down on your no-true scotsman fallacy.

You can fight with other christians about who of you both is "the REAL slim shady". Euh, I mean, christian. If you can agree with the other thousands of denomination (and perhaps even more sub-denominations), then you can can come and tell me what a "real christian" is when you all speak with one voice.

Until then, I won't be losing a second of sleep over it. And I'll just accept that people are christian when they tell me that they are christians.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Well go for it and prove your point, use the Bible to prove me wrong.

That is not possible. Proof is a formal logical process based on assumptions. You will just pick a different set that the other side.

 

[samtonga43]

All of this is nonsense. Every religion says these things. Islam, Hinduism, all of them. Once you experience this God blah, blah.,...They are stories and scripture written by people with zero evidence that any Gods or supernatural things really happened. The myths are taken from other nations and like Osirus, Jesus is not real. You are not even trying to produce evidence?

Claim: Osiris was called “Lord of Lords”, “King of Kings”, “God of Gods”, “Resurrection and the Life”, “Good Shepherd”, “Eternity and Everlastingness”, and the god who “made men and women to be “born again”
Truth: These names for Jesus were not used by Osiris, who was called, “Lord of All”, the “Good Being”, “Lord of the Underworld”, “Lord (King) of Eternity”, “Ruler of the Dead”, “Lord of the West”, “Great One”, “He who takes seat,” “the Begetter”, “the Ram”, “Great Word”, “Chief of the Spirits”, “Ruler of Everlastingness”, “Living God,” “God above the gods.” These rather general names were not uncommon for many other deities as well.

Claim: Osiris’ birth was announced by Three Wise Men: the three stars Mintaka, Anilam, and Alnitak in the belt of Orion, and Osiris had a star in the east (Sirius) that signified his birth
Truth: It is true that some scholars connect Osiris with Orion, but they don’t stretch the imagination to call the three stars of the belt “wise men”, and there is no mention of an eastern star in the Osiris mythology.

Claim: Osiris had a Eucharist ceremony of sorts, in which his flesh was eaten in the form of communion cakes of wheat
Truth: There is no evidence for this in the research of the scholars

Claim: Osiris taught much of the same material as Jesus; many teachings are identically the same, word for word
Truth: There is absolutely no evidence of any of this, and the “wisdom” of Osiris is still available for review.

Claim: Osiris was killed and later resurrected, providing hope every believer might also be resurrected into eternal life
Truth: Osiris was murdered and his body was then dismembered and scattered. Later, his body pieces were recovered and rejoined, and he was rejuvenated. Osiris then journeyed to the underworld, where he became the lord of the dead. He did not resurrect with a glorified body and walk with men on earth, as did Jesus. He was not alive again, as was Jesus, but was instead a “dead” god who never returned among the living


Is Jesus Simply a Retelling of the Osiris Mythology? | Cold Case Christianity

 

[rational experiences]

You can dispute all you want but the issue is “What does the Bible say and teach”. You don’t know what Jesus said but I do because He gave me His Spirit, that’s how we communicate today. You can’t because you don’t have the Spirit.
Here is another Voltaire article:
Voltaire’s Prediction, Home, and the Bible Society: Truth or Myth? Further Evidence of Verification

How can Jesus a baby born as a man owning his own life give you his spirit?

The theme is God first and man's scientific temple pyramid science thesis. Sacrificed life Jesus review.

As earth owned all types of stone products. First. Natural.

You study data the letter to number review gave the title of the testimony of the fall of man by phi fallout as Jesus.

Letters numeracy arrived at the title.

Old testimony Moses. New title Jesus.

As ice the saviour mass body was sacrificed it is the newly returned stable reborn mass. Each year ice.

Gave you cool water and it allowed nature's oxygenation of it to exist.

Seeing science via burning gases fallout and tree bushes burnt removed what nature gave us. Our oxygen..to live. Life existing.

So oxygenated ox... holy. Was a Christ term. Generation. Without cold CH gases present in mass cold water and oxygen doesn't exist. Held by pressure at the ground.

The saviour ice gave us back our life safety. It was sacrificed. As only humans exact as humans being human own human DNA genesis within.

We all own being human. What's missing in any baby life is personal by human sex sin Inheritance. We ARE all human species type.

Not only did it allow water mass to still exist. The rain mass flooded heavens cooling sacrificed gases. Spirit.

When you tell a story tell the natural story first. Not the thesis of creation by just a man lying.

I don't believe in the sacrifice of life. I believe in healthy human babies.

 

[ElishaElijah]

I don't actually care what your bible says.
I'm just trying to make clear to you how arrogant you are by doubling down on your no-true scotsman fallacy.

It’s not arrogant to properly teach the Word of God, it’s right and honest. What’s dishonest is to intentionally twisting Scripture and say it means something other than what it says or without reading and understanding the Scriptures and then claim you know what it says.

 

[ElishaElijah]

That is not possible. Proof is a formal logical process based on assumptions. You will just pick a different set that the other side.

The Bible interprets itself, Scripture interprets Scripture. I’m not asking anyone what they believe about Bible origins or any of that. Whether or not you think it’s a myth, made up or whatever. I want to know who actually knows what the Bible says and teaches. I haven’t found a skeptic or atheist yet who knows, there may be some but I haven’t seen anything but false ideas about the Bible presented so far from this group of unbelievers.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

The Bible interprets itself, Scripture interprets Scripture. I’m not asking anyone what they believe about Bible origins or any of that. Whether or not you think it’s a myth, made up or whatever. I want to know who actually knows what the Bible says and teaches. I haven’t found a skeptic or atheist yet who knows, there may be some but I haven’t seen anything but false ideas about the Bible presented so far from this group of unbelievers.

No, I do get what you are saying. You just don't get what I am saying.

 

[ElishaElijah]

There are no Christians in the Bible?

Criteria for being a follower is belief, and cast out devils


These signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils. Mark 16:17

Also -

1. 
   baptize

1. 
   Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 2:38
   1. Work hard for Jesus.
      Be ... abounding in the work of the Lord. 1 Corinthians 15:58
      1. 
         Curse those who don't love Jesus.

1. 
   If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema. 1 Corinthians 16:22

1. Force all of your thoughts to obey Jesus.
   (Don't be a free thinker.)Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ. 2 Corinthians 10:5

1. If you're going to glory, glory in Jesus.
   He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord. 2 Corinthians 10:17

1. Examine yourself to see if Jesus is in you.
   (If he's not, you're a reprobate.)Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates? 2 Corinthians 13:5

1. Be free with Jesus.
   Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Galatians 5:1

1. Have the same mind as Jesus.
   Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus. Philippians 2:5

1. Salute every saint in Christ Jesus.
   Salute every saint in Christ Jesus. Philippians 4:21

1. Believe on the name of God's son, Jesus Christ.
   This is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ. 1 John 3:23

1. Abide in Jesus.
   Abide in him; that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and not be ashamed before him at his coming. 1 John 2:28

1. Don't refuse Jesus.
   And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel. See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. Hebrews 12:24-25

1. Remember that Jesus of David's seed was raised from the dead.
   (According to the "gospel" of the author of 2 Timothy.)Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel. 2 Timothy 2:8

1. Do everything in the name of Jesus.
   Whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus. Colossians 3:17

That's it. People who claim to be Christians are Christians, the end.

That’s not it:
““Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, didn’t we prophesy in your name, drive out demons in your name, and do many miracles in your name?’ Then I will announce to them, ‘I never knew you. Depart from me, you lawbreakers!’”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭7:21-23‬ ‭CSB‬‬

A person is not a Christian just because they said they were or are.

 

[Sheldon]

I go by what the Bible says teaches not someone else’s definition.

All Christians say this, yet there are 45k varyingly different sects and denominations.

 

[Sheldon]

I go by what the Bible says teaches not someone else’s definition. Jesus was clear on this. Sorry you’re reducing yourself to personal attacks now but the subject is “What does the Bible actually say and teach”? This seems to escape you and you don’t know. And yes people left Jesus even though they knew He was the Messiah ex. The rich man.

“As he was setting out on a journey, a man ran up, knelt down before him, and asked him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” “Why do you call me good?” Jesus asked him. “No one is good except God alone. You know the commandments: Do not murder; do not commit adultery; do not steal; do not bear false witness; do not defraud; honor your father and mother.” He said to him, “Teacher, I have kept all these from my youth.” Looking at him, Jesus loved him and said to him, “You lack one thing: Go, sell all you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.” But he was dismayed by this demand, and he went away grieving, because he had many possessions.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭10:17-22‬ ‭CSB‬‬
John 3 explains why people don’t come to Jesus, the light as well:
“This is the judgment: The light has come into the world, and people loved darkness rather than the light because their deeds were evil. For everyone who does evil hates the light and avoids it, so that his deeds may not be exposed. But anyone who lives by the truth comes to the light, so that his works may be shown to be accomplished by God.””
‭‭John‬ ‭3:19-21‬ ‭CSB‬‬

You're simply wrong here, and we have plenty of evidence that Christians leave the religion. I even supplied some, and you simply responded with hand waving, as usual.

The Clergy Project.
"Are you a religious professional who no longer believes in any God or gods?"

Quod erat demonstrandum...

 

[Sheldon]

Do Christians leave Christianity? I never said they didn’t

You certainly did, you claimed any atheists who were once Christians were not really Christians. Are you recanting that claim now?

 

[Sheldon]

Gigantic no-true-scottsman

One in an endless procession of no true Scotsman fallacies @ElishaElijah has used, and when you point this out all you get in response is hand waving.

 

[Sheldon]

The Bible describes the criteria, so you just need to read and understand that? It’s not that hard so if you don’t bother to read the Bible on that subject you still won’t know.

The bible is clearly not reliable, as has been explained, or else there would not be 45k varyingly different Christian sects and denominations. You can repeat this claim all you want, but it is demonstrably untrue.

 

[ElishaElijah]

You certainly did, you claimed any atheists who were once Christians were not really Christians. Are you recanting that claim now?

I did explain that multiple times with Scripture. Do you need that information again?

 

[Sheldon]

Since Jesus said that it will be interesting to see the motives when all that is exposed.

You have no idea what Jesus may or may not have said, again this has been explained countless times. The bible contains hearsay anecdotal claims in the gospels, no contemporary or eyewitness accounts exist, the earliest written record is decades after the alleged events, and the of unknown authorship.

 

[Sheldon]

I did explain that multiple times with Scripture. Do you need that information again?

You made the claim, now you're denying it, or are you? Do you accept that there are atheists who were once Christians, or do you deny this?