Those who believe there is no God live by faith

[sojourner]

In which case, it is not reality.

Reality is that which is true no matter what the convention or whether you disagree.

I’ve already said that the reality exceeds our capacity to voice. Even before electricity was a convention — when it still eluded us — it was still a reality.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Late? That's what they get for counting all the way to Five.

Reality counted five for them and lay the answer right across a vulnerable cheek.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

I do not think that he is making that argument. Have you perhaps conflated him with @3rdAngel ? I made that error.

He claims his god is "different" from 3rd angels' god, yet they both use the exact same book?

wait.... WHAT?

That is one thing I do not understand-- I can read the bible for myself. If there was a god, would it not behoove said god to make the "instructions" as clear as possible on the Big Questions: is hell real? And whatnot.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

I’ve already said that the reality exceeds our capacity to voice. Even before electricity was a convention — when it still eluded us — it was still a reality.

So you claim. So you fail to prove-- instead, you seem to think "Mystery Of God" and "Magical Knowing" is an answer.

It is true that we don't know everything, and likely never will.

It is also true-- long proven-- that faith never increased Total Knowledge by so much as a single fact.

 

[sojourner]

Either God, Deity or whatever, is GOOD? Or it is NOT GOOD. (or doesn't exist).

I believe the created order is an expression of love an beauty. That’s good.

It cannot-- absolutely cannot be GOOD, due to the existence of Competing Religions

At night, all cats are grey.

Allowing False Religions to thrive? Is Maliciously Evil, or Maliciously Indifferent-- or?

False? Who gets to make that judgment? Who’s Head Nincompoop In Charge of Religions?

Did Jesus' Disciples have Free Will?

Yes.

 

[shmogie]

"Prove me wrong" has been the cry of the crank down the ages. It does not work like that. It is the person making the claim that has to be prepared to justify it.

Atheists make the claim that there is no God. That is what the OP was addressing.

Seems to me the burden is on them to refute the criticism of their claim.

Faith is faith, isn't it?

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Uh huh. I bet you never ever took a tax break. I paid over 6K in taxes last year that tRump unfairly stole from me. Your accusation fails..

Do you attend church? Any church? My accusation is spot-on accurate. Your "hobby" only survives because it gets massive tax breaks on the backs of tax payers.

Tax The Churches, I say-- like any OTHER Entertainment Business.

Give'em BACK their tax exemption-- WHEN THEY PROVE THEIR EMPTY PROMISES.

Like, "eternal life" or "salvation" or "healing ministry" an other false claims.

I have nothing to do with Christian schools. Fail again..

Yet... you support the exact same Hobby as they do, using the same immoral book...

It’s out there; you’re just not looking..

Fail. If it actually was, it would be crowed every time some christian group does something nasty-- which is daily, these days. Thanks to Dump and his christian minions.

Nope. Not. You seriously need to get a new story, or else go bother the fundigelicals.

Yep. True. You all use the same book. A fatally flawed book that condones slave-keeping and worse.

Just because you ignore 90% of it? Well...

 

[sojourner]

That is one thing I do not understand-- I can read the bible for myself. If there was a god, would it not behoove said god to make the "instructions" as clear as possible on the Big Questions: is hell real? And whatnot

The Bible’s job isn’t to “give instructions” or to “answer questions.” When you want to repair a ‘74 Vega, you consult a Chilton’s — not the Bible.

So you claim. So you fail to prove-- instead, you seem to think "Mystery Of God" and "Magical Knowing" is an answer

I’m not seeking answers. That may be why you’re confused. I’m asking questions, doubting, seeking meaning.

It is true that we don't know everything, and likely never will

Thank you.

It is also true-- long proven-- that faith never increased Total Knowledge by so much as a single fact

Knowledge isn’t the goal of faith. No wonder it doesn’t work for you.

 

[Heyo]

There have been several bestsellers.

Such as?

 

[firedragon]

I see you failed -- to 100% -- to make an attempt do actually ADDRESS my point.

I'll ask again: DO YOU BELIEVE IN THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER?

Why or Why Not?

Same to you.

Cheers.

 

[shmogie]

So you claim. So you fail to prove-- instead, you seem to think "Mystery Of God" and "Magical Knowing" is an answer.

It is true that we don't know everything, and likely never will.

It is also true-- long proven-- that faith never increased Total Knowledge by so much as a single fact.

Faith has driven vast discoveries. Einstein had faith that relativity and his theory solved and explained many problems.

He had faith he could establish a theory of everything, and was working on it the day he died.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

I believe the created order is an expression of love an beauty. That’s good..

Yet you have absolutely NO basis to believe such things-- NONE.

Not the bible-- it's god is malicious.

Not reality-- there exists Great Evil, due to "god" failing to make his "message" Absolutely Clear to Everyone.

Fail. If god exists, it is Evil.

At night, all cats are grey..

Meaningless. See above.

False? Who gets to make that judgment? Who’s Head Nincompoop In Charge of Religions?
.

So you ADMIT that there is NO GOD AT ALL? Would that not be God's Job? To ensure "his" religion is the ONLY religion?

Oh! I nearly forgot: If god is real? IT IS MALICIOUS, see above

Yes.

So. Providing 100% PROOF does NOT, in fact remove Free Will?

Wow..... that means... that your god is being MALICIOUS in refusing to provide ANY!

Or it isn't real...

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Same to you.

Cheers.

Do you believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster? Bigfoot? Lock Ness monster?

Why or why not?

 

[Subduction Zone]

He claims his god is "different" from 3rd angels' god, yet they both use the exact same book?

wait.... WHAT?

That is one thing I do not understand-- I can read the bible for myself. If there was a god, would it not behoove said god to make the "instructions" as clear as possible on the Big Questions: is hell real? And whatnot.

I do not think that they do. firedragon appears to be a Muslim to me. Now I will not agree with his religion but he does not have the same separation from reality that the OP has.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Faith has driven vast discoveries. Einstein had faith that relativity and his theory solved and explained many problems.

He had faith he could establish a theory of everything, and was working on it the day he died.

No, he had reasonable expectations supported by evidence and observations.

 

[Heyo]

Wait... isn’t “atheist minister” sort of mutually exclusive?

Nope. Even though it sounds ridiculous, a minister can go through the motions without believing. And it isn't easy to leave when your livelihood depends on the lie. See: The Clergy Project » Support | Community | Hope

 

[Revoltingest]

Faith has driven vast discoveries. Einstein had faith that relativity and his theory solved and explained many problems.

He had faith he could establish a theory of everything, and was working on it the day he died.

This is one use of the word "faith", although "intuition" & "hunch"
would be better. In the religious use of the word, "faith" is about
belief in things supernature without objective evidence. That
usage wouldn't apply to Einstein's work.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

The Bible’s job isn’t to “give instructions” or to “answer questions.” When you want to repair a ‘74 Vega, you consult a Chilton’s — not the Bible. .

The fact that the bible says otherwise? Says much-- the fact that the bible even exists in the first place? Says more: If there is a god, it is Maliciously Evil-- for permitting the bible (most of which you disagree with) and other self-styled "holey" books to even exist!

I’m not seeking answers. .

That is obvious. You don't like the answers when the conflict with your pre-concieved ideas that have no basis in actual reality. .[/QUOTE]

Knowledge isn’t the goal of faith. No wonder it doesn’t work for you.

Faith is worthless, then. And clearly: Seeing as how much War, Evil, Corruption exists on Earth, largely due to FAITH?

Well, it's beyond worthless-- it's mostly evil.

 

[sojourner]

Do you attend church? Any church? My accusation is spot-on accurate. Your "hobby" only survives because it gets massive tax breaks on the backs of tax payers

I’m a member of the clergy, so, yeah, I attend church. Sorta comes with the job.

Other philanthropic “hobbies” that are nonprofits also receive tax breaks. The church is not taxed in order to keep it separate from the state. Unless you’d like more meddling in that regard?

Tax The Churches, I say-- like any OTHER Entertainment Business

This is just getting provocative. Upset are We? Perhaps you need to take a break?

Give'em BACK their tax exemption-- WHEN THEY PROVE THEIR EMPTY PROMISES

Taxes aren’t based on promises.

Like, "eternal life" or "salvation" or "healing ministry" an other false claims

Seems you know All About It. I’m glad. You can rest easy now.

Yet... you support the exact same Hobby as they do, using the same immoral book

No. I don’t. To which book do you refer? The Art of the Deal?

Fail. If it actually was, it would be crowed every time some christian group does something nasty-- which is daily, these days. Thanks to Dump and his christian minions

It is. You’re not listening.

Yep. True. You all use the same book. A fatally flawed book that condones slave-keeping and worse.

Just because you ignore 90% of it? Well

The flaw lies in the way it’s used, not that it’s used.

I think you and I are done here. You’re losing your cool.

 

[sojourner]

The fact that the bible says otherwise? Says much-- the fact that the bible even exists in the first place? Says more: If there is a god, it is Maliciously Evil-- for permitting the bible (most of which you disagree with) and other self-styled "holey" books to even exist!


That is obvious. You don't like the answers when the conflict with your pre-concieved ideas that have no basis in actual reality. .

Faith is worthless, then. And clearly: Seeing as how much War, Evil, Corruption exists on Earth, largely due to FAITH?

Well, it's beyond worthless-- it's mostly evil.[/QUOTE]
I think we’re done here. Your lack of understanding and your tone aren’t worth feeding.