To defeat creationist, must you defeat their religion????

[outhouse]

The problem is not so much religion per se as is fundamentalism. It is perfectly plausible to believe in God and accept evolution at the same time. All that is required is to accept that the Genesis creation story is an allegory. But therein lies the problem: Fundamentalism forces its followers to fall fully for its fabricated fantasy (alliteration intended!) and militantly refuse to listen to the slightest idea that questions any of it.



We would be more than happy to let creationists be if they would just LEAVE US ALONE. But they are unwilling to. They force creationism into classrooms, they elect politicians simply because they do not accept evolution science, and they attempt to shout down any rational debate.

UV, it is violent what the creationists are doing. It is greatly unfortunate. But I cannot emphasize enough that those of us who accept science DID NOT CHOOSE TO START THIS. It is the creationists who lie in the name of truth, not the evolutionists.

that is a good take on how I feel

I and you know its allegorical information, so do they ancient hebrews who wrote it.

christian history jacked it all up and thi sneeds to be reformed once and for all to set straight those who are utterly blind to reality.

Im involved in other forums and YEC's are real! yes they still exist in todays world.


its proof of how primitive we are as a whole

 

[doppelganger]

What function(s) do you think religious belief serves?

 

[outhouse]

What function(s) do you think religious belief serves?

some who sucks dirt for a living, poor and poverty stricken, it would give them a false light at the end of the tunnel. The sick and dieing can find comfort in a mytical afterlife.

What you fail to realize the bible was written as a myth to be a moral guide for those that were uneducated and never heard a WORD from another book. At that time it would have been a book read for entertainment that had morals. Much like our movies we have today. No different really. Later on when the NT was created it was more for political motives then religion, it was a second chance for a religion that needed to grow beyond the hard core mean OT god. Constantine [the roman emporer] did a brilliant job when he motivated the compilation of the NT after marcion's poor attempt.

 

[doppelganger]

some who sucks dirt for a living, poor and poverty stricken, it would give them a false light at the end of the tunnel. The sick and dieing can find comfort in a mytical afterlife.

You honestly think that's why people have religious beliefs? Or that's your characterization of religious belief?

What you fail to realize the bible was written as a myth to be a moral guide for those that were uneducated and never heard a WORD from another book.

The Bible is composed of things written by a lot of different people, at a lot of different times and places, for a lot of different purposes. The stories are mostly teaching myths. I think you express a great deal of ignorance about the role mythology played in ancient societies. Aside from that, who is the "you" that you are directing this toward? Because it doesn't sound like you know thing one about what I do and do not "realize."

 

[Primordial Annihilator]

Ignorance is the root of all evil.....

 

[doppelganger]

How do you plan to "defeat their religion" when you are so completely lacking in any understanding of it?

You seem very angry, such that it is blinding your intellect.

 

[outhouse]

You honestly think that's why people have religious beliefs? Or that's your characterization of religious belief?

you asked function

people have religious belief because it was handed down to them due to their geographic location only. Children are born atheist until the parents or society pile's the myth on.

people follow myths because of fear alone. No old person wants to think its all over when hes dead. They all want to dream about living forever [facepalm] but that is how the rediculous myths are taught. "Be good" or you will go to a bad place when your dead. Fear among the living.

NO thanks

Ill pass on myths and focus on knowledge and education

 

[outhouse]

How do you plan to "defeat their religion" when you are so completely lacking in any understanding of it?

you dont want to get in a whizzing contest with me. you will get wet.

I would bet you know much less real biblical history then I do.

What I hear from you is ,,,, "I lack a real education in real history and science"

 

[outhouse]

its also not a matter of defeating religion as YOU put

its a matter of education into the facts regarding the bible that needs to be addressed

I never have a problem with those well educated

 

[doppelganger]

you asked function

people have religious belief because it was handed down to them due to their geographic location only. Children are born atheist until the parents or society pile's the myth on.

That's not a function of religious belief. That's a very narrow description of one of the sources of the form of religious beliefs.

people follow myths because of fear alone. No old person wants to think its all over when hes dead. They all want to dream about living forever [facepalm] but that is how the rediculous myths are taught. "Be good" or you will go to a bad place when your dead. Fear among the living.

You think that's the only function of religious belief?

NO thanks

Ill pass on myths and focus on knowledge and education

Well, I'm not sure where you got the idea I was recruiting you into a caricature of religion. I'm pretty sure I didn't say anything to give that impression to you or anyone else. You want to "defeat" religion, and I am trying to help you get over your anger so you'll understand it. I guarantee you will not succeed in destroying what you refuse to try to honestly understand.

What has religion done to you, outhouse?

 

[doppelganger]

you dont want to get in a whizzing contest with me. you will get wet.

I would bet you know much less real biblical history then I do.

What I hear from you is ,,,, "I lack a real education in real history and science"

Your insecurities are showing. So is your ignorance again. You might want to know a little about an opponent before you set out on a magical quest to defeat them.

Just a suggestion.

 

[outhouse]

I'm pretty sure I didn't say anything to give that impression to you or anyone else. You want to "defeat" religion

How do you plan to "defeat their religion"

you dont understand i dont have anger over religion or hatred. I pity most of the religious people I meet. its sad to see so many minds gone to waiste

I see blinded people daily that cannot see reality and fight it due to their beliefs. religion has caused enough damage to humanity and education.

Im stating religion needs to be stopped for spreading lies, religious need to be educated about the myth the bible contains and that it is not the divine word of god and that the creation story has no place in our modern lives at all.

 

[outhouse]

Your insecurities are showing. So is your ignorance again. You might want to know a little about an opponent before you set out on a magical quest to defeat them.

Just a suggestion.

your the one who stepped up to the plate, be prepared to back it. This isnt a magical quest and I could care less who you think wins. Im not in a contest.

if you have something that can prove your mythical god is real?

I could easily build a court case and try gods existance and win that he was created by ancient hebrews who compiled previous pagan myths.

Ancient hebrews were a compilation of semetic speaking people from many places who all brought their own storys with them from egypt and sumerian cultures as well as their own local cultures. These myths were compiled ONLY after hundreds and hundreds of years of oral tradition.

ancient hebrews only go back 1250BC as a culture, soon after that around 1000BC we start getting biblical writing from them [genesis] these fables come from 300-500 years of oral storys around campfires.

Normally oral tradition is accurate enough to hold its own, but only when it is used in the same culture. With ancient hebrews combining many different cultures history to form their own history, oral tradition is not only not accurate one can clearly see the creation of history through this tradition.

creation of deitys was nothing new during that time. It was standard SOP. If you did not create a god you had problems as I dont think there was ever a ancient culture that did not had a god myth or spirit to base beliefs on what they did not know

if you dont know, ancient hebrews had more then one god, at the same time they had the hebrew god you all know.

 

[doppelganger]

Im stating religion needs to be stopped for spreading lies, religious need to be educated about the myth the bible contains and that it is not the divine word of god and that the creation story has no place in our modern lives at all.

And I'm stating that you won't get anywhere in your mission until you calm down, listen and observe carefully, and understand what religious belief is and what it does.

Let us reason together.

What might religious belief accomplish for an individual believer? Let me narrow it a bit to get you going - what might be going on in the way a person perceives their identity and the relationship between their identity and the world as they experience it, for which religious belief might serve a purpose useful to the believer his or her self?

 

[doppelganger]

if you have something that can prove your mythical god is real?

Which mythical "god" is mine?

I'm not interested in a debate about the history and anthropology of religion with you at this time. I don't think it would be productive for either of us.

I would like an answer to who you think I am though.

:yes:

 

[Primordial Annihilator]

You seem very angry, such that it is blinding your intellect.

Anger is fear expressed.

Fear is the little death the mindkiller.....

 

[doppelganger]

Anger is fear expressed.

Fear is the little death the mindkiller.....

Agreed. Anger is mis-managed fear.

 

[Primordial Annihilator]

Im stating religion needs to be stopped for spreading lies, religious need to be educated about the myth the bible contains and that it is not the divine word of god and that the creation story has no place in our modern lives at all.

Is that justification enough to suppress a very large and varied faith believed by millions of peaceful law abiding citizens?

 

[Primordial Annihilator]

Agreed. Anger is mis-managed fear.

Yes indeed.

 

[outhouse]

I would like an answer to who you think I am though.

your someone defending your position an a religion based debate.

so I take it your answer is no "you must not defeat their religion"

And I'm stating that you won't get anywhere in your mission until you calm down,

this is my calm

I have no mission, im asking a question

I think the fight should be switched from defensive to offensive as well.

religion would crumble faced with the same scrutiny it puts upon science