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Tolerance

Smoke

Done here.
To teh first statment there are none, its a christian college they disagree with homosexuality I know gay are allowed to go to church and be members of the congregation but im sure about clergy, I dont know if my bible college accepts gay students, Im a gap year from it, and will be returning in september.

and to the last question they are allowed to participate but not be clergy. atleast that is what i think anglicanism is confusing ;)

And is it safe to say you approve of these policies excluding and stigmatizing gay people? If not, why do you belong to that church and go to that Bible college?
 

Rainbow Mage

Lib Democrat/Agnostic/Epicurean-ish/Buddhist-ish
Oh I see Smoke. Yes, Rowan was always a tad on the conservative side. I can't believe he did that though, just goes to show he's two-faced about the issue as well. When I went to see him in New Orleans when I was still Anglican he said the C of E was not cutting off the US church for ordaining a gay bishop and that he hopes the church can move toward being more open toward that. Now we see how true that was huh? LOL
 

tarasan

Well-Known Member
And is it safe to say you approve of these policies excluding and stigmatizing gay people? If not, why do you belong to that church and go to that Bible college?

you know there is a thing called tolerance....

even if people disagree with you, cutting them off from you isnt how to go about it. I accept them even if their beliefs differ from mine, and so long as tehy arnt yelling or degrading homosexuals that fine, disagreeing with what you do and disrespecting u are two different things,
 

Smoke

Done here.
you know there is a thing called tolerance....

even if people disagree with you, cutting them off from you isnt how to go about it. I accept them even if their beliefs differ from mine, and so long as tehy arnt yelling or degrading homosexuals that fine, disagreeing with what you do and disrespecting u are two different things,

So you oppose your Bible college's policy of cutting off gay people for disagreeing with them? In what practical ways do you express that opposition?
 

tarasan

Well-Known Member
So you oppose your Bible college's policy of cutting off gay people for disagreeing with them? In what practical ways do you express that opposition?

telling them, i mean I go to a multi denominational bible college, there are plenty of people who disagree, like i said respectful talking.
 

DallasApple

Depends Upon My Mood..
of course it is that how alot of Christians feel.

I know I know!! I know the answer!!! So then you have an excuse to hate someone?????? Because they arent exactly like you???And you can say they are an "abomination"????

Love

Dallas
 
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tarasan

Well-Known Member
I know I know!! I know the answer!!! So then you have an excuse to hate someone?????? Because they arent exactly like you???And you can say they are an "abomination"????

Love

Dallas

alot fo christians dont hate gays, i mean i know people who disagree with what they do as much as they disagree with those who have one night stands, being gay isnt really a big deal for them, its how i once was, and i found it hilarious how people made me out to a bigot, i was just kinda like "yeah.....im the one who hates..."

but heck people see what they wanna see.
 

Smoke

Done here.
telling them, i mean I go to a multi denominational bible college, there are plenty of people who disagree, like i said respectful talking.

Respectful talking to whom?
Would you belong to a club that excluded black or Jewish members?
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Tarasan you have to realize that a lot of this anti-Christian sentiment among gay people has been caused by Christians themselves for belittling gays and treating them as less then human beings who don't deserve the same rights as everyone else. I too cannot deny I am somewhat bitter.

OK, let's be consistent here. If a black woman told you that she was verbally harrassed by someone, would you say to her, "You have to realise that a lot of this racist sentiment among white people has been caused by black people themselves and their behavior - their very high illegitimate birth rates and incarceration rates. I too cannot deny that I am somewhat racist myself."

Just asking.
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
I am not calling you intolerent tarasan, I'm explaining to you why those gay guys likely reacted to you like they did. Christians have been persecuting gay people for decades, and even if it's not all Christians, it's enough of them to make gays bitter. Do not blame them for decades of intolerence on the part of Christians.

I'm not calling you intolerant, Shaniqua, I'm explaining to you why those white people likely reacted to you like they did. They've had their convenience store robbed by black people several times over the past few years, and even if it's not all black people, it's enough of them to make white people bitter. Do not blame them for decades of an unbelievably high crime rate on the part of black people.
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Tarasan when the majority of people in your religion rises above bigotry and intolerence of gays, then we'll rise above intolerence of fundamentalists. Ok?

Shaniqua, when black men stop having the highest incarceration rate of all demographic groups, and when black women stop having the highest rate of illegitimate births, white people will start being more tolerant.
 

DeitySlayer

President of Chindia
To be consistent with your analogies, Kathryn, what exactly have gays done that is 'deserving' of intolerance?
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
To be consistent with your analogies, Kathryn, what exactly have gays done that is 'deserving' of intolerance?

Deity, the topic is tolerance and bigotry. I don't believe that people should be judged by the color of their skin, and I don't believe that people should be judged by their sexual orientation. But some people do. And some people make the same excuses for intolerance of racial differences that they make for intolerance of sexual orientation differences.

Do you think that racism is justified?
 

DeitySlayer

President of Chindia
No, I do not think racism is justified, because, as you probably agree, the hypothetical reasons you set out are not an intrinsic quality of black people but rather a product of centuries of opression and cycles of social deprivation and poor education. The reasoning for intolerance of homosexuals is even weaker than this.
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
And here's the bigger point - whether we agree with tarasan or not when it comes to his church affiliation or religious beliefs, doesn't the very definition of tolerance mean that we TOLERATE beliefs and lifestyles that differ from our own? The question of the OP was "Does too much tolerance cause more harm than good?" I'm trying to stick to the OP question and look at the big picture rather than get sidetracked by focusing simply on the topic of gay rights. There are many rights outside of just gay rights - believe it or not.

My point is that if we want to support true tolerance, I believe that we must support the right for people to believe and live differently from us - and that even though we may disagree with them, as long as they do not infringe on our personal rights, we don't infringe on theirs.

I would never attend a bible college personally. I have visited those campuses, and known people who have graduated from those schools, and frankly, most of them are sort of sickening to me.

But I also wouldn't attend a historically black college either. I've also visited those campuses and known people who have graduated from those schools, and frankly, most of them are sort of sickening to me.

Both types of colleges generally are breeding grounds of bigotry, racism and intolerance. But people have the right to go there and to allow themselves to be indoctrinated.

And they have the right to sit right next to me in a restaurant and look over at me and my biracial kids and think whatever the heck they want to think about us, unmolested or challenged by me while they're sitting there enjoying the meal they've paid for. I have no right to walk over there and challenge them on their personal beliefs, even if they are sitting there wearing a T shirt that says "Bob Jones University" on it.

The best challenge I can offer is my beautiful, well behaved children and my own responsible lifestyle.

They don't have the right to tell me which college I should attend, or who I should marry, or where I should work, or what church I should attend or not attend, or who I should sleep with (as long as they're a consenting adult).

I've made life choices that many people have not agreed with, and I've been exposed to bigotry and had to deal with it in my own life. But as long as bigots aren't impeding my right to pursue my own life, liberty and happiness, I'm not going to bother them, or even be rude to them.

Turn about's fair play.
 
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DeitySlayer

President of Chindia
Exactly, Kathryn, and thus we should not tolerate those who would impinge on the rights of homosexuals or reduce them to second class citizens. They can hate gays all they want, but they should not be able to take action against them.
 

tarasan

Well-Known Member
Exactly, Kathryn, and thus we should not tolerate those who would impinge on the rights of homosexuals or reduce them to second class citizens. They can hate gays all they want, but they should not be able to take action against them.

indeed that is what ive been saying/trying to say.
 
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