Trump ordered to pay nearly 355 million in NY fraud case.

[Subduction Zone]

Still doesn't make excessive fines ok.
Nor does it make the process of filing an appeal nearly impossible ok either.

What "fines"? This has been explained many times in this thread. These are not fines.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes, "because" he doesn't have nearly a half billion dollars in cash to pay, and would have to sell properties just to appeal a ruling. Even if he were to win the appeal and not end up having to pay anything, whatever property he sold to get the money would still be gone.

That is not true. He had a an alternative that he ignored. He could have gone to the judge. He could have admitted that he cannot raise a bond. And then he could have offered properties up as collateral. He would have to offer up more than enough to cover the disgorgement and interest. But here is where it could go very well for him. He could have offered up the deeds for the judge to hold. If he lost, the control of the deeds would be in the state's hands. If he won, he would get the deeds back and not owe anything nor would he be out of the cash for putting up a bond.

In the E. Jean Carroll case he found someone that was willing to cover him with a bond. He will lose that money that he paid for the interest on the bond no matter what. If he wins he won't have to pay any more than the bond fee, which was probably a bit over 10%. If he could get the judge to take enough deeds to hold as collateral he would not be out the at least $50 million for the bond fee alone.

If Trump is so sure that he would win why won't he do that?

 

[Revoltingest]

Yes, "because" he doesn't have nearly a half billion dollars in cash to pay, and would have to sell properties just to appeal a ruling. Even if he were to win the appeal and not end up having to pay anything, whatever property he sold to get the money would still be gone.

People often pay bondsmen to put up the money.
In Trump's case, his history of not paying what he
owes likely inspired no one to post a bond.
He's a poor credit risk.

 

[fantome profane]

Yes, "because" he doesn't have nearly a half billion dollars in cash to pay, and would have to sell properties just to appeal a ruling. Even if he were to win the appeal and not end up having to pay anything, whatever property he sold to get the money would still be gone.

 

[F1fan]

If Trump can’t come up with the money or collateral to cover the appeal the state can immediately start the process to seize assets. This will likely be cash in banks, stocks, and other easily sold items. Real estate will take longer since there is work to do with anyone who has a lien or ownership agreement, and these will have to be resolved. Most likely it’s a matter of finding buyers for Trump’s stake. New York can also seize property out of state. Once they file a lien Trump could still sell his stake in a property but the money would go to anyone else with a claim against him.

I’m a bit surprised that no one has agreed to help him. It’s also concerning since Trump might get more desperate and be willing to promise anything.

 

[Subduction Zone]

If Trump can’t come up with the money or collateral to cover the appeal the state can immediately start the process to seize assets. This will likely be cash in banks, stocks, and other easily sold items. Real estate will take longer since there is work to do with anyone who has a lien or ownership agreement, and these will have to be resolved. Most likely it’s a matter of finding buyers for Trump’s stake. New York can also seize property out of state. Once they file a lien Trump could still sell his stake in a property but the money would go to anyone else with a claim against him.

I’m a bit surprised that no one has agreed to help him. It’s also concerning since Trump might get more desperate and be willing to promise anything.

There is a possibility, just a small one, that he managed to contact OVER THIRTY DIFFERENT BOND COMPANIES and they all said 'no'. He has been known to lie on the rare occasion.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I’m a bit surprised that no one has agreed to help him.

Why?

 

[F1fan]

Why?

Because it is a chance to own a guy who leads in many polls for the presidency. Half a billion is nothing to Putin or MDS. It’s a gamble. If Trump lises tgey get nothing and Trump will get away with a swindle. Of course he would be a marked man.

They still might come through with a deal but it’s telling just how toxic Trump is. Only conservative voters want him. It’s likely most of the Americans who think the universe is 6000 years old.

Could you imagine a world where a US president owes the leader of its main adversary half a billion dollars? And the minority of voters would make it happen.

 

[F1fan]

There is a possibility, just a small one, that he managed to contact OVER THIRTY DIFFERENT BOND COMPANIES and they all said 'no'. He has been known to lie on the rare occasion.

I’m sure the legal staff made a lot of calls. That he begging for donations and setting up fund raisers like Gulliani did shows it’s all bad news. Trump could file for personal bankruptcy. That will mean his assets will be assessed by the court and all debts paid. He owes 700 million that’s due in the next few years, and that will have to be paid, or assets set aside for it to be covered.

He also has the Truth Social thing going public soon, but its actual value is being questioned.

What’s funny is that we expected the criminal charges to be his downfall and it’s looking like his stupidity and arrogance that is causing huge civil judgments. It was his mistake to not apologize and settle with Carroll. It was a bigger mistake to defame her again. And he’s still doing it. And he could have settled with New York and agreed to some payment terms. But no. He was relying on his donors to cover his costs but the are not coming through. Even the RNC takeover is backfiring. And that will only harm republicans down ballot.

Trump is good at providing reality tv and now it’s costing him.

 

[McBell]

As part of the arrangement, the Trump Organization must open its books to Jones, who has also been given the ability to suggest court-ordered changes in how the Trump Organization operates.​

​

She must be notified about any large cash transfers, the creation or dissolution of assets, the restructuring of debt and "any efforts to secure surety bonds," according to Engoron's order issued Thursday.​

​

Judge in Trump's civil fraud trial imposes monitor to oversee Trump Organization's finances

The judge in former President Trump's civil fraud trial has imposed a monitor to oversee the Trump Organization's finances.

abcnews.go.com

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Anything to interfere in the election process

This is an interesting trope. There is no election interference with these prosecutions. The primaries are proceeding as scheduled and the general election ought to occur on time as well. The election interference comes from state level MAGA Republicans through gerrymandering, purging voters, and making voting more difficult, and is expected come refusing to certify the election results they don't like.

Sure, Trump has to keep appearing in court during the campaign, but he'll just have to manage his time effectively around those constraints. If he doesn't have time for both, then he doesn't have time to run for office, because he has no choice but to make time for court. If that's what's meant by election interference, it's not. The election will proceed as planned whatever becomes of Trump. That's simply not election interference.

And anybody can vote for Trump who wants to even if some states could keep him off of their ballots.

But I'll tell you who does have a legitimate complaint that their campaigns are being interfered with: every other Republican candidate. The RNC, which exists ostensibly to promote the candidacy of Republicans up and down the ticket is not just an ATM for Trump's legal woes.

Trump's handlers have recently revealed that Trump won't be making many public appearances anyway. The official reason is a cash crunch, but it is suspected that they just don't want him speaking much, since every time he does nowadays, it generates another video with several examples of his mental decline each (source):

"On Saturday [3/16/24], Donald Trump revealed that his mind is so far gone, he no longer remembers the election in which he ran against Joe Biden. Instead Trump now thinks that Biden got into office by defeating someone named “Obaba.” Shortly after this, Trump’s handlers leaked to the media that they’ll be sharply cutting back on Trump’s in-person rallies going forward, in favor of mostly having Trump “campaign” virtually from home, blaming campaign budget issues for the change."

He can do his virtual campaigning wherever he is during whatever free time he has assuming that his handlers don't prevent that as well, although it's pretty hard to imagine them being able to silence him.

So, no election interference.

how toxic Trump is. Only conservative voters want him.

Not even. Just the MAGA conservatives, which are about half of Republican voters. Trump never did better than 50-60% of the primary votes when there were other Republicans still running, and even after Haley dropped out leaving Trump unopposed, still, in the last two primaries, some 15-20% of Republican primary voters voted for somebody other than Trump.

It is expected that the very conservative never-Trumpers will just stay home on election day, and that many of the more centrist Republican voters will vote for Biden, since even as a Democrat, he represents their pro-democracy, anti-Putin values better than Trump does.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Yes, "because" he doesn't have nearly a half billion dollars in cash to pay, and would have to sell properties just to appeal a ruling. Even if he were to win the appeal and not end up having to pay anything, whatever property he sold to get the money would still be gone.

But if his conviction were overturned, he would have the cash proceeds from that sale. We're still only talking about a paper "loss" from selling in a hurry, but even that would be offset by the fact that the real estate market is generally up spectacularly right now.

As a counter-example:

Apparently, bail on a non-violent burglary charge is typically $10,000-$25,000. The average person with a burglary charge doesn't just have that kind of cash in their chequing account, so they're going to have to go to a bail bond place.

The typical cost for a bail bond is 10% of the bond's value, so someone charged with that kind of offense is going to be out $1,000 to $2,500 that they can't afford even if they're found not guilty... or they have the option of sitting in jail despite not being convicted of any crime.

I havs much more sympathy for those people than I do for someone who's 1) already been convicted and 2) would be only missing out on some of his hoped-for ROI, not actually taking a loss.

 

[Subduction Zone]

But if his conviction were overturned, he would have the cash proceeds from that sale. We're still only talking about a paper "loss" from selling in a hurry, but even that would be offset by the fact that the real estate market is generally up spectacularly right now.

As a counter-example:

Apparently, bail on a non-violent burglary charge is typically $10,000-$25,000. The average person with a burglary charge doesn't just have that kind of cash in their chequing account, so they're going to have to go to a bail bond place.

The typical cost for a bail bond is 10% of the bond's value, so someone charged with that kind of offense is going to be out $1,000 to $2,500 that they can't afford even if they're found not guilty... or they have the option of sitting in jail despite not being convicted of any crime.

I havs much more sympathy for those people than I do for someone who's 1) already been convicted and 2) would be only missing out on some of his hoped-for ROI, not actually taking a loss.

I do not have much pity for Trump. The position that he is in right now is his own fault. He could still make it a lot more pain free by agreeing to sell off some properties to pay for his loss. It is his best bet. If he is given time to sell them, and allows his current overseer that power, they could take some time and possibly make some money from today's high values. If he is forced to sell them quickly he will lose a ton of money. I have to agree with @Laniakea to an extent. He will lose a lot if he is forced to sell on such a short notice. But he has one alternative that is not mentioned much. He can get out his deeds to enough properties to convince the judge that they would cover his costs. Again, since he is likely to lose the appeal, or have his money that he owes barely reduced, he will still have to come up with a lot of money quickly when the appeal is over and that would mean having those properties sold at fire sale rates.

Trump has until Monday to make a deal of some sort. If he doesn't he will be out of time. Couldn't happen to a nicer fella!

 

[fantome profane]

He will lose a lot if he is forced to sell on such a short notice.

When you break the law sometimes there are negative consequences. Not always, not often enough, but sometimes.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I do not have much pity for Trump. The position that he is in right now is his own fault. He could still make it a lot more pain free by agreeing to sell off some properties to pay for his loss. It is his best bet. If he is given time to sell them, and allows his current overseer that power, they could take some time and possibly make some money from today's high values. If he is forced to sell them quickly he will lose a ton of money. I have to agree with @Laniakea to an extent. He will lose a lot if he is forced to sell on such a short notice. But he has one alternative that is not mentioned much. He can get out his deeds to enough properties to convince the judge that they would cover his costs. Again, since he is likely to lose the appeal, or have his money that he owes barely reduced, he will still have to come up with a lot of money quickly when the appeal is over and that would mean having those properties sold at fire sale rates.

Trump has until Monday to make a deal of some sort. If he doesn't he will be out of time. Couldn't happen to a nicer fella!

Good news! Trump doesn't need to sell off any properties. He's announced publicly that he has more than enough ready cash to pay the whole amount.

Trump Claims He Has Nearly $500 Million In Cash—As His Lawyers Insist He Can’t Pay NY Fraud Judgement

The statement marks a reversal from Trump’s statements Monday that he does not have the cash to pay the bond and can’t find any companies to secure it for him.

www.forbes.com

 

[Subduction Zone]

Good news! Trump doesn't need to sell off any properties. He's announced publicly that he has more than enough ready cash to pay the whole amount.

Trump Claims He Has Nearly $500 Million In Cash—As His Lawyers Insist He Can’t Pay NY Fraud Judgement

The statement marks a reversal from Trump’s statements Monday that he does not have the cash to pay the bond and can’t find any companies to secure it for him.

www.forbes.com

Frabjous day! Callooh Callay!

I will believe it when I see it. If he does come up with it I wonder if he will be able to account for it? This could get very interesting.

 

[Pogo]

Good news! Trump doesn't need to sell off any properties. He's announced publicly that he has more than enough ready cash to pay the whole amount.

Trump Claims He Has Nearly $500 Million In Cash—As His Lawyers Insist He Can’t Pay NY Fraud Judgement

The statement marks a reversal from Trump’s statements Monday that he does not have the cash to pay the bond and can’t find any companies to secure it for him.

www.forbes.com

Surprise, Surprise what he says one week is completely different than the next but hey if he could get away with a fib, all the good for him.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Surprise, Surprise what he says one week is completely different than the next but hey if he could get away with a fib, all the good for him.

I can only imagine what it's like to be one of Trump's lawyers trying to argue for him, all the while knowing that he's going to undermine his case to the judge with all the ridiculous crap he posts on social media.

I would hope that they're being well-paid to put up with this crap, but I have a feeling that Trump will stiff them on their bills, too. Hopefully they got paid a healthy retainer up front to take the case.

 

[fantome profane]

I would hope that they're being well-paid to put up with this crap, but I have a feeling that Trump will stiff them on their bills, too. Hopefully they got paid a healthy retainer up front to take the case.

Well Trump isn't paying them in any case.

Trump’s PAC spent $230k a day on legal fees in February, records show

Trump is blowing through cash in the middle of a critical campaign crunch as he faces 88 criminal charges and tens of millions of dollars in penalties

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I would hope that they're being well-paid to put up with this crap, but I have a feeling that Trump will stiff them on their bills, too. Hopefully they got paid a healthy retainer up front to take the case.

Well paid? By Trump? Isn't the GOP's garrulous grifter currently focussed on GoFundMe drives?