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Was Islam spread by the sword?

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paarsurrey

Veteran Member
Was Islam spread by the sword?

No.

For example:

Spread of Islam in Circassians: [4]

History

Circassia was a small independent nation on the northeastern shore of the Black Sea. For no reason other than ethnic hatred, over the course of hundreds of raids the Russians drove the Circassians from their homeland and deported them to the Ottoman Empire. At least 600,000 people lost their lives to massacre, starvation, and the elements while hundreds of thousands more were forced to leave their homeland. By 1864, three-fourths of the population was annihilated, and the Circassians had become one of the first stateless peoples in modern history.
— Walter Richmond, The Circassian Genocide [48]

Russian conquest of Circassia

Between the late 18th and early-to-mid-19th centuries, the Adyghe people lost their independence as they were slowly conquered by Russia in a series of wars and campaigns. During this period, the Adyghe plight achieved a certain celebrity status in the West; but pledges of assistance were never fulfilled.

After the Crimean War, Russia turned her attention to the Caucasus in earnest, starting with the peoples of Chechnya and Dagestan. In 1859, the Russians had finished defeating Imam Shamil in the eastern Caucasus, and turned their attention westward. Eventually, the long lasting Russian–Circassian War ended with the defeat of the Adyghe forces. Adyghe leaders signed loyalty oaths on 2 June 1864 (21 May, O.S.).

The Conquest of the Caucasus by the Russian Empire in the 19th century during the Russian-Circassian War, led to the destruction and killing of many Adyghe—towards the end of the conflict, the Russian General Yevdokimov was tasked with driving the remaining Circassian inhabitants out of the region, primarily into the Ottoman Empire. This policy was enforced by mobile columns of Russian riflemen and Cossack cavalry.[49][50][51]

"In a series of sweeping military campaigns lasting from 1860 to 1864 ... the northwest Caucasus and the Black Sea coast were virtually emptied of Muslim villagers. Columns of the displaced were marched either to the Kuban [River] plains or toward the coast for transport to the Ottoman Empire ... One after another, entire Circassian tribal groups were dispersed, resettled, or killed en masse"[51] This expulsion, along with the actions of the Russian military in acquiring Circassian land,[52] has given rise to a movement among descendants of the expelled ethnicities for international recognition that genocide was perpetrated.[53]

In 1840, Karl Friedrich Neumann estimated the Circassian casualties to be around one and a half million.[54] Some sources state that hundreds of thousands of others died during the exodus.[55] Several historians use the phrase "Circassian massacres"[56] for the consequences of Russian actions in the region.[57]

On 20 May 2011, the Georgian parliament voted in a 95 to 0 declaration that Russia had committed genocide when it engaged in massacres against Circassians in the 19th century.[58]

Like other ethnic minorities under Russian rule, the Adyghe who remained in the Russian Empire borders were subjected to policies of mass resettlement.
The Ottoman Empire, which ruled most of the area south of Russia, considered the Adyghe warriors to be courageous and well-experienced. It encouraged them to settle in various near-border settlements of the Ottoman empire in order to strengthen the empire's borders.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circassians

I don't see any sword in spread of Islam in Circassians.

Regards
 

1robin

Christian/Baptist
From what I've been told, when reading this perfect book, you can't just read the words in front of your eyeballs... you must jump forwards and backwards, picking up the correct context, and of course you must never forget the culture of the day, AND whether this verse was revealed in Mecca or Medina, before or after some battle, and remember, IT'S ETERNAL, jeez, how hard can it be, it's perfect after all!

The Quran was not written for comprehension, it was written for retention. It is good for getting 9 year olds to memorize and chant the whole thing like a robot, but it is horrific for comprehending it. Reminds me exactly of what I was taught about brain washing in the Navy. Every significant literary scholar I have seen says it is a train wreck.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
The Quran was not written for comprehension, it was written for retention. It is good for getting 9 year olds to memorize and chant the whole thing like a robot, but it is horrific for comprehending it. Reminds me exactly of what I was taught about brain washing in the Navy. Every significant literary scholar I have seen says it is a train wreck.

Are/were you in the Navy?
I think Navy people are intelligent people. Britain conquered the world through waters.

Regards
 

1robin

Christian/Baptist
Are/were you in the Navy?
I think Navy people are intelligent people. Britain conquered the world through waters.

Regards
I was in the Navy during two wars but I never fired a shot. The Navy has many intelligent people but just like anything else it is plagued by idiots as well. You right about England. At one point no ship could set sail from any port in the world unless by English permission. When a place 1/50th our size controls half the world something is unique about them. If you like Naval literature the best book ever written on Naval tactics was by Theodore Roosevelt. It is required reading at Annapolis and is in ever Naval ship library we have. It is the definitive authority on sailing warfare. However Naval supremacy has it's costs. In 1800 Britain had so many ships they did not have enough powder to allow drilling with gunnery and did not have enough skilled sailors to operate the ships effectively. We bloodied their nose with a fleet about 100th their size in 1812 but 100 times their efficiency and experience. Experience is the most important factor in warfare.
 

Harikrish

Active Member
The Quran was not written for comprehension, it was written for retention. It is good for getting 9 year olds to memorize and chant the whole thing like a robot, but it is horrific for comprehending it. Reminds me exactly of what I was taught about brain washing in the Navy. Every significant literary scholar I have seen says it is a train wreck.

The Quran is written in verses like poetry. So it is easier to memorize than to analyze.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
The Quran is written in verses like poetry. So it is easier to memorize than to analyze.

It is easier/easiest to memorize for sure, it is easier/easiest to understand also, if one is sincerely and genuinely interested .

Quran mentions/claims it truthfully.

Regards
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
I was in the Navy during two wars but I never fired a shot. The Navy has many intelligent people but just like anything else it is plagued by idiots as well. You right about England. At one point no ship could set sail from any port in the world unless by English permission. When a place 1/50th our size controls half the world something is unique about them. If you like Naval literature the best book ever written on Naval tactics was by Theodore Roosevelt. It is required reading at Annapolis and is in ever Naval ship library we have. It is the definitive authority on sailing warfare. However Naval supremacy has it's costs. In 1800 Britain had so many ships they did not have enough powder to allow drilling with gunnery and did not have enough skilled sailors to operate the ships effectively. We bloodied their nose with a fleet about 100th their size in 1812 but 100 times their efficiency and experience. Experience is the most important factor in warfare.

Hope you are one in the intelligent ones.

Thanks and regards
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
The Quran was not written for comprehension, it was written for retention. It is good for getting 9 year olds to memorize and chant the whole thing like a robot, but it is horrific for comprehending it. Reminds me exactly of what I was taught about brain washing in the Navy. Every significant literary scholar I have seen says it is a train wreck.

The Quran was not written for comprehension, it was written for retention.

Quran is the easiest for retention/memorization and apprehension, if one is intelligent/unbiased and sincere.

Quran genuinely claims it, and its claim is reasonable and rational.

Regards
 

1robin

Christian/Baptist
The Quran is written in verses like poetry. So it is easier to memorize than to analyze.
This seems to be a softer version of what I said. If you want a falsehood adopted then put in the form of a chant or recitation but mix up chronology and meaning, enforce recitation at the youngest ages possible and you will produce believers that have no understanding of what they believe.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
Was Islam spread by the sword?

No.

For example:

Spread of Islam in Circassians: [5]

History

Circassia was a small independent nation on the northeastern shore of the Black Sea. For no reason other than ethnic hatred, over the course of hundreds of raids the Russians drove the Circassians from their homeland and deported them to the Ottoman Empire. At least 600,000 people lost their lives to massacre, starvation, and the elements while hundreds of thousands more were forced to leave their homeland. By 1864, three-fourths of the population was annihilated, and the Circassians had become one of the first stateless peoples in modern history.
— Walter Richmond, The Circassian Genocide [48]

Post-exile period

The Adyghes who were settled by the Ottomans in various near-border settlements across the empire, ended up living across many different territories in the Middle East. At the time these belonged to the Ottoman Empire and are now located in the following countries:

• Turkey, which has the largest Adyghe population in the world. The Adyghe settled in three main regions in Turkey:Samsun, along the shores of the Black Sea; the region near the city of Ankara, the region near the city of Kayseri, and in the western part of the country near the region of Istanbul. This latter region experienced a severe earthquake in 1999. Many Adyghe played key roles in the Ottoman army and also participated in the Turkish War of Independence.

• Syria. Most of the Adyghe who immigrated to Syria settled in the Golan Heights. Prior to the Six Day War, the Adyghe people were the majority group in the Golan Heights region — their number at that time is estimated at 30,000. The most prominent settlement in the Golan was the town of Quneitra. The total number of Circassians in Syria is estimated to be between 50,000 and 100,000.[59]

In 2013, the Syrian Circassians said they were exploring returning to Circassia, as tensions between the Bashar al-Assad regime and opposition forces escalates. Circassians from different parts of Syria, such as Damascus, have moved back to the Golan Heights, believed to be safer. Some refugees have been reportedly killed by shelling. Circassians have been lobbying the Russian and Israeli governments to help evacuate refugees from Syria. Some visas were issued by Russia.[60]

• Jordan. The Adyghe had a major role in the history of the Kingdom of Jordan.[61][62] They make up around 1% to 2% of the total population. Over the years, various Adyghe have served in distinguished roles in the kingdom of Jordan. An Adyghe has served as a prime minister (Sa'id al-Mufti), ministers (commonly at least one minister should represent the Circassians in each cabinet), high rank officers, etc., and due to their important role in the history of Jordan, Adyghe form the Hashemites honour guard at the royal palaces. They represented Jordan in the Royal Edinburgh Military Tattoo in 2010, joining other honour guards such as the Airborne Ceremonial Unit.[63][64]

• Iraq. The Adyghe came to Iraq in two waves: directly from Circassia, and later from the Balkans. They settled in all parts of Iraq — from north to south — but most of all in Iraq's capital Baghdad. A reported 30,000 Adyghe families live in Baghdad. Many Adyghe also settled in Kerkuk, Diyala, Fallujah, and other places. Circassians played a major role in different periods throughout Iraq's history, and made great contributions to political and military institutions in the country, to the Iraqi Army in particular. Several Iraqi prime ministers have been of Circassian descent.

• Israel. The Adyghe initially settled in three places — in Kfar Kama, Rehaniya, and in the region of Hadera. Due to a malaria epidemic, the Adyghe settlement near Hadera was eventually abandoned. Though Sunni Muslim, Adyghe are seen as a loyal minority within Israel, who serve in the armed forces.[65][66]

Circassians - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I don't see any sword in spread of Islam in Circassians.

Regards
 

1robin

Christian/Baptist
Quran is the easiest for retention/memorization and apprehension, if one is intelligent/unbiased and sincere.

Quran genuinely claims it, and its claim is reasonable and rational.

Regards
The Quran is factually wrong time after time, plagiarized from well documented sources known to be prevalent in Muhammad's time and to be heretical Jewish teachings, and conflicts with it's self and eyewitness testimony so often it is almost irrelevant.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
The Quran is factually wrong time after time, plagiarized from well documented sources known to be prevalent in Muhammad's time and to be heretical Jewish teachings, and conflicts with it's self and eyewitness testimony so often it is almost irrelevant.

You are simply wrong.

Regards
 

Scimitar

Eschatologist
paarsurrey, he's welcome to his opinion.. despite it, Islam remains the fastest growing religion in the world, with most of its conversions coming from the west - and from these women are outnumbering the men converts by a ratio of 4/1 according to CIA factbook. So an opinion is always welcome - even though it may not reflect the reality. :)

Was Islam spread by the sword? You'd have to ask yourself - in this current age, is Islam spreading by the sword? According to our apparent reality, it is not - it is spreading through the understanding and study of Islam by non Arab persons who have somehow been attracted to Islam for x,y or z reasons... much like it has always spread throughout history... btw, your opinion 1robin, does not reflect any known reality that an historian can attest to - and that is a fact.

Scimi
 

Sees

Dragonslayer
paarsurrey, he's welcome to his opinion.. despite it, Islam remains the fastest growing religion in the world, with most of its conversions coming from the west - and from these women are outnumbering the men converts by a ratio of 4/1 according to CIA factbook. So an opinion is always welcome - even though it may not reflect the reality. :)

Was Islam spread by the sword? You'd have to ask yourself - in this current age, is Islam spreading by the sword? According to our apparent reality, it is not - it is spreading through the understanding and study of Islam by non Arab persons who have somehow been attracted to Islam for x,y or z reasons... much like it has always spread throughout history... btw, your opinion 1robin, does not reflect any known reality that an historian can attest to - and that is a fact.

Scimi

What percentage of female converts would you guess come by way of marriage to Muslim men?
 

outhouse

Atheistically
Was Islam spread by the sword?

yes.


Islam remains the fastest growing religion in the world,

Many people have no control over breeding, and do so primitively having to many children that surpasses their natural resources, promoting poverty and disease, violence and warfare.

There is a reason why you own the crown as king of terrorism and violence, and illiteracy.

islams fasted rate of growth is due to uncontrolled breeding.
 

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
Given that apostasy is viewed as a crime, I wonder how that impacts the "growth" of Islam?

I know that there are shelters in the US dedicated to protecting women who want to leave Islam but fear punishment from Muslims if they do so...
 
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