Was Jesus A Narcissist?

[CynthiaCypher]

I wiki'd. You talking of the author of the culture of narcissism? Looks interesting. Have you read it?

It's one of my favorite books

 

[Caladan]

First I would like to present to you guys what the DSM-IV defines as narcissistic personality disorder, if I may:



Oh boy, oh boy. What more could I say? All one has to do is pick up your own copy of the New Testament and you will see that Jesus was a bit narcissistic to say the least. So what say you guys, was JC a narcissist?

If we attribute the epithets of the NT to be claimed by Jesus personally, then perhaps we could fool around with the idea. But there is evidence that much of the glorification of Jesus was to counter Imperial propaganda and was entered by the writers/editors of the gospels.
For example, there are reasons to believe that they titled Jesus the Son of God in order to slap Imperial propaganda which called Caesar the Son of God.
One thing is for sure, it doesn't seem that sensational (at least to me personally) to project on Jesus' personality as it emerges from the pages of the gospels. What's more interesting was the processes that were set in motion by a first century thinker in the Eastern Mediterranean during the times of the Roman empire.
I care less to speculate about his favourite brand of Kosher pickles, whether he liked red hairs better, whether he was a narcissist, or whether he ever played chess against Simon Magus. Especially since we are going to have to wildly project about an ideological narrative, and not only that an ideological narrative that was written in historical and geographical settings thousands of years into the past.

 

[Caladan]

Ooh I just revived a deceased thread!
damn you Who is on line list!

 

[CynthiaCypher]

Ooh I just revived a deceased thread!
damn you Who is on line list!

You had to revive this, just when I am in the midst of a heated debate about the Buddha being a misogynist.

People are going to start think I have it in for religious figures.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

If we attribute the epithets of the NT to be claimed by Jesus personally, then perhaps we could fool around with the idea. But there is evidence that much of the glorification of Jesus was to counter Imperial propaganda and was entered by the writers/editors of the gospels.
For example, there are reasons to believe that they titled Jesus the Son of God in order to slap Imperial propaganda which called Caesar the Son of God.
One thing is for sure, it doesn't seem that sensational (at least to me personally) to project on Jesus' personality as it emerges from the pages of the gospels. What's more interesting was the processes that were set in motion by a first century thinker in the Eastern Mediterranean during the times of the Roman empire.
I care less to speculate about his favourite brand of Kosher pickles, whether he liked red hairs better, whether he was a narcissist, or whether he ever played chess against Simon Magus. Especially since we are going to have to wildly project about an ideological narrative, and not only that an ideological narrative that was written in historical and geographical settings thousands of years into the past.

Even if Jesus may not have implicitly stated he was the son of God, I believe the historical Jesus believed that he himself was the messiah. That is grandiose in and of itself.

He believed that he was indeed the savior of the nation of Israel.

 

[Bob Dixon]

You had to revive this, just when I am in the midst of a heated debate about the Buddha being a misogynist.

People are going to start think I have it in for religious figures.

You mean you don't have it in for religious figures?

 

[paarsurrey]

First I would like to present to you guys what the DSM-IV defines as narcissistic personality disorder, if I may:



Oh boy, oh boy. What more could I say? All one has to do is pick up your own copy of the New Testament and you will see that Jesus was a bit narcissistic to say the least. So what say you guys, was JC a narcissist?

New Testament contains little from Jesus; so his personality is not reflected from NT.

 

[paarsurrey]

No


he doesnt have enough historicity to make any claim about personality

From NT Bible I agree

 

[paarsurrey]

Only if He wasn't who He said He was. Since I believe what He said, then no, He is not.

NT Bible gives not much about what Jesus actually said. Jesus words are lost; the original translations are lost; so NT Bible gives a very diluted account of Jesus' life, before the crucifixion and after it; at the most three years of his ministry.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

NT Bible gives not much about what Jesus actually said. Jesus words are lost; the original translations are lost; so NT Bible gives a very diluted account of Jesus' life, before the crucifixion and after it; at the most three years of his ministry.

Any evidence? No. I don't think you have any. The NT is the best source we have in regards to what Jesus said and did period.

You won't know two fraggin' bleeps about what Jesus said if you don't rely on the NT or Thomas.

 

[idav]

I've probably already said it but Jesus was a narcissist even if he was speaking the truth about himself.

 

[F0uad]

If i say i am a human am i a narcissist? I mean since the man did really belief it, i am pretty sure Jesus(p) was a humble man according the Gospels. Its the Authors who later make him divine and let him ''testify'' to these absurd such as being a part of god or a god or a son of god..

 

[paarsurrey]

Any evidence? No. I don't think you have any. The NT is the best source we have in regards to what Jesus said and did period.

You won't know two fraggin' bleeps about what Jesus said if you don't rely on the NT or Thomas.

Jesus and his mother spoke Aramaic; not a word of that exist; not even the Hebrew original.

English translation is from the Greek or Latin clearly they themselves are translation as Jesus did not know them.

New Testament
The New Testament is written in Koine Greek.
The discovery of older manuscripts, which belong to the Alexandrian text-type, including the 4th century Codex Vaticanus and Codex Sinaiticus, led scholars to revise their view about the original Greek text. Attempts to reconstruct the original text are called critical editions. Karl Lachmann based his critical edition of 1831 on manuscripts dating from the 4th century and earlier, to demonstrate that the Textus Receptus must be corrected according to these earlier texts.
Bible translations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

If one writes down the passages quoted from Jesus even from these translations; not much of NT will remain to argue.

Jesus' words are in very dilute form like we find it in the case of Buddha. Buddha spoke Magadhi; not a word of it now exists, in my opinion.

 

[paarsurrey]

NT Bible has been written with a vested interest or an ulterior motive; to make Jesus god or son of god which he did not claim to be; for this purpose Paul and the anonymous scribes; wrote around the incident of crucifixion in superfluous details if compared to rest o Jesus life which was also important but they ignored it. NT covers mostly or only three years of Jesus' life; not more what Jesus did before that and after when he left from Judea after the event of crucifixion; they were not interested in it; their purpose was served and that is it.

 

[beerisit]

NT Bible has been written with a vested interest or an ulterior motive; to make Jesus god or son of god which he did not claim to be; for this purpose Paul and the anonymous scribes; wrote around the incident of crucifixion in superfluous details if compared to rest o Jesus life which was also important but they ignored it. NT covers mostly or only three years of Jesus' life; not more what Jesus did before that and after when he left from Judea after the event of crucifixion; they were not interested in it; their purpose was served and that is it.

And the Koran has been written with what intent in mind?

 

[Harmonious]

First I would like to present to you guys what the DSM-IV defines as narcissistic personality disorder, if I may:



Oh boy, oh boy. What more could I say? All one has to do is pick up your own copy of the New Testament and you will see that Jesus was a bit narcissistic to say the least. So what say you guys, was JC a narcissist?

From what I've read, if Jesus was at all real, and he was anything like he was depicted in the gospels, then YES, he was narcissistic.

 

[Harmonious]

One possible interpretation of that passage: Jesus knew from the beginning of the scene that he was going to heal the woman's child, but he decided to use the instance to teach his followers something.

He starts out by reacting to the woman's plea in accordance with what was probably a commonly held prejudice among the Jewish people of his time and place. This doesn't put her off. All it does is cause her to humble herself still further.

(one possible) moral: the state of a person's mind is more important than the State they were born in. Attitude is more important than ethnicity.

You know...

According to Jewish law, regardless of what "commonly held prejudices" might have been, it was VILE what Jesus had this woman undergo.

She obviously needed help and sought Jesus for it. The fact that he pretty much called her a dog (even if it was only in a parable) was despicable. Assuming that Jesus was just a simple Jew like any other (which is what I'll do), this is what Jews call a serious profanation of God's name, for a Jew to act this wretchedly to a non-Jew.

The idea that "she might have thought she deserved it", or that "it was better than other Jews of the time" is patented nonsense. True, not all Jews of the time were better behaved, but there certainly were contemporary Jews who were saints in their behavior, ESPECIALLY as compared to Jesus.

This one small episode is nothing if not contemptible and classic narcissism, if self-aggrandizing.

 

[Harmonious]

Telling people to be compassionate doesn't usually have much of an effect other than to elicit an appropriate but empty gesture or two.

Showing people what self-importance and the cold-heartedness that often results from it looks like is a much more powerful lesson. He was a teacher, after all.

Sinning to show people what sins look like is NOT a useful teaching tool.

You know...

A few years ago, someone on a different message board asked me to read the Synoptic Gospels so that I could understand where Christians were coming from. At the time, I hadn't had much experience with Christian scriptures, and I was all set to believe that Jesus was a good-hearted, well-meaning, if misguided teacher.

By the time I finished all four gospels, I told the person who offered me the challenge, as it were, that I wasn't going to read any more Christian scripture, as every new passage brought new levels of loathing to a figure who I once thought of as a good although misguided man.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

You know...

According to Jewish law, regardless of what "commonly held prejudices" might have been, it was VILE what Jesus had this woman undergo.

She obviously needed help and sought Jesus for it. The fact that he pretty much called her a dog (even if it was only in a parable) was despicable. Assuming that Jesus was just a simple Jew like any other (which is what I'll do), this is what Jews call a serious profanation of God's name, for a Jew to act this wretchedly to a non-Jew.

The idea that "she might have thought she deserved it", or that "it was better than other Jews of the time" is patented nonsense. True, not all Jews of the time were better behaved, but there certainly were contemporary Jews who were saints in their behavior, ESPECIALLY as compared to Jesus.

This one small episode is nothing if not contemptible and classic narcissism, if self-aggrandizing.

I also believe what Jesus did to this woman probably is in contradiction to the Law and the Prophets.

 

[paarsurrey]

I also believe what Jesus did to this woman probably is in contradiction to the Law and the Prophets.

NT has many tell-tales, not to be believed per se.