Watchtower Governing Body: Are They The Exclusive Channel For God??

[djhwoodwerks]

Romans 6:23--- is it not true all who have died up until this day--paid the wages of sin=death. The JW teachers are 100% correct on the matter. The only ones who will not pay the wages are the anointed who are changed during the trib and the ones brought through Har-mageddon. and every single mortal that has died has proved its true.

Lol, you will die in your sins. Read the whole chapter of Romans not just 2 verses

 

[savagewind]

everything about our history is found in the book 'Jehovahs Witesses - Proclaimers of Gods Kingdom'

You can get that online which is where DJ is getting the information from. All JW's have read that book....we've all studied it, we know all the changes and all the prior teachings that came from the early bible students.

NOT everything.

Psalm 101:7
No one who practices deceit shall dwell in my house; no one who utters lies shall continue before my eyes.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

God is never wrong--but light is progressive if you listen to Jesus--He taught of his anointed teachers--- Who really is the faithful and discreet slave --who upon their master( Jesus) arriving( the presence) will appoint over all of his belongings to give food( spiritual) ---at the proper time= when God wills a truth revealed--progressive.
As well Luke 10:16---those who listen to Jesus anointed teachers are listening to Jesus and God as well--so the opposite as well those who reject Jesus anointed teachers are rejecting Jesus and God as well.
There is 0 perfection in mortal man.

A question is not prophecy.

ALL mankind are imperfect. Not one writer of the Bible got it wrong! Only false teachers, teaching their on opinions do.

 

[Pegg]

Lol, you will die in your sins. Read the whole chapter of Romans not just 2 verses

everyone is dying.... what does that tell you?

 

[Pegg]

A survey of Watchtower history reveals that Pastor Charles Taze Russell, the founder of the Jehovahs Witnesses, was once considered the "faithful and discreet slave."
The watchtower book "The Harp of God," published in the early 1920's states: "without a doubt Pastor Russell filled the office... And was therefore that wise and faithful servant, ministering to the household of faith meat I due season."

It was not incorrect to come to the conclusion that the faithful and wise servant would appear and feed spiritual food. That is a truth from the bible. They were incorrect in apply it to Pastor Russel, true. But they were correct in teaching that a faithful and wise slave would appear.
10 years later they came to believe that it would include a number of individuals.

 

[JFish123]

It was not incorrect to come to the conclusion that the faithful and wise servant would appear and feed spiritual food. That is a truth from the bible. They were incorrect in apply it to Pastor Russel, true. But they were correct in teaching that a faithful and wise slave would appear.
10 years later they came to believe that it would include a number of individuals.

The point is that True Prophets of God do not make mistakes when claiming biblical truth. No prophet in the bible made such errors over and over again. Any excuses for such false teachings and false prophecy fulfillment must point to a false prophet. I'm sorry but if the Watchtower were around in biblical times and they kept getting things wrong while claiming to be a prophet, they would have been stoned ten times over for being a false prophet. You can't let any indoctrination or bias cloud what is True Biblically. Especially about false prophets.

 

[savagewind]

It was not incorrect to come to the conclusion that the faithful and wise servant would appear and feed spiritual food. That is a truth from the bible. They were incorrect in apply it to Pastor Russel, true. But they were correct in teaching that a faithful and wise slave would appear.
10 years later they came to believe that it would include a number of individuals.

How do you know that the "faithful and discreet slave" is not the helper that Jesus promised to send?
Luke 24:49
I am going to send you what my Father has promised; but stay in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high.
John 14:16
And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever
John 15:26
When the Advocate comes, whom I will send to you from the Father--the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father--he will testify about me.
John 16:7
But very truly I tell you, it is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.
John 16:13
But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.

Are the governing body members the spirit of truth which Jesus promised to send?

 

[savagewind]

Which scripture points to the fact that the faithful and discreet slave is a composite of men and not the helper which Jesus promised to appoint?

 

[e.r.m.]

I attended a JW house meeting back in the eighties, & I will never forget it. They never once opened the Bible, and they read from either of the Watchtower or Awake magazine and discussed that instead. I hope that wasn't their standard meeting, being that I only attended one of them, but I was shocked. But I guess I can't be too surprised is that they said what they said in 2013.

 

[Pegg]

The point is that True Prophets of God do not make mistakes when claiming biblical truth. No prophet in the bible made such errors over and over again. Any excuses for such false teachings and false prophecy fulfillment must point to a false prophet. I'm sorry but if the Watchtower were around in biblical times and they kept getting things wrong while claiming to be a prophet, they would have been stoned ten times over for being a false prophet. You can't let any indoctrination or bias cloud what is True Biblically. Especially about false prophets.

Our GB nor any of our presidents nor any of our ministers view themselves as prophets. We use the bible as our guide. WE are not coming up with anything new.... the WT is merely stating what is already written by the prophets of old.

 

[Pegg]

I attended a JW house meeting back in the eighties, & I will never forget it. They never once opened the Bible, and they read from either of the Watchtower or Awake magazine and discussed that instead. I hope that wasn't their standard meeting, being that I only attended one of them, but I was shocked. But I guess I can't be too surprised is that they said what they said in 2013.

I dont believe that in the slightest because I know its not true. I attend all our meetings and the bible is used throughout. Perhaps you fell asleep at the meeting you attended and woke up at the end when they were putting their books away

 

[djhwoodwerks]

I dont believe that in the slightest because I know its not true. I attend all our meetings and the bible is used throughout. Perhaps you fell asleep at the meeting you attended and woke up at the end when they were putting their books away

You know that's true Pegg! We all do. The gentleman I study with, "EVERY time I have a question about a subject in the Bible, he say's "well lets look that up" I reach for my Bible and he reaches for the "What Does the Bible really Teach" book. All he knows about the Bible is what that book says.

 

[JFish123]

Our GB nor any of our presidents nor any of our ministers view themselves as prophets. We use the bible as our guide. WE are not coming up with anything new.... the WT is merely stating what is already written by the prophets of old.

The problem is the Watchtower mistranslates the bible to fit it's own theology. To make the bible say what it wants to say. That's the problem. And if any organization makes prophecies of any kind, like Jesus coming back in 1914 among many others, then they are taking on the role of a prophet whether they say so or not. And with there track record isn't good. Gods prophets in the bible Never error. The Watchtower has many times.
And the Watchtowers translation started off with falsehoods and just continued sad to say. Jehovahs Witnesses are very devout. I know some personally. But there believing in a false translation of the Word of God. That's the problem. And my heart goes out to them all.
The New World Translation has been rebuked by so many Greek and Hebrew scholars for it's many errors and a completely biased translation to fit the Watchtowers ideology into the Bible, instead of the other way around.
Dr. Robert Countess, who wrote a doctoral dissertation on the text of the NWT concluded that the translation "has been sharply unsuccessful in keeping doctrinal considerations from influencing the actual translation. It must be viewed as a radically biased piece of work. At some points it is actually dishonest. At others, it is neither modern nor scholarly." No wonder British scholar H.H. Rowley asserted, "from the beginning to end this volume is a shining example of how the Bible should not be translated." Indeed, Rowley said, this translation is, "an insult to the word of God."
Dr. Julius Mantey, author of 'A Manual Grammar of the Greek New Testament', calls the NWT "a shocking mistranslation."
Dr. Bruce M. Metzger, professor of New Testament at Princeton University calls the NWT "a frightful mistranslation," "erroneous," "pernicious," and "reprehensible."
In view of the wide spread "thumbs down" by Bible scholars, it is highly revealing that the Watchtower Society has always resisted efforts to identify members if the NWT committee. The claim was that they preferred to remain anonymous and humble. But an unbiased observer will also note that such anonymity also shields the translators from any blame for errors or distortions. And it prevents scholars from checking their credentials.
The Watchtower Society must have been utterly embarrassed when the names of the translators of the NWT were made public. The reason for this was that the translators were completely unqualified for the task.
4 out of 5 men in the committee had no Hebrew or Greek training whatsoever (they had only a high school education). The fifth was Fred W. Franz, who claimed to know Hebrew and Greek, but upon further examination under oath in court, he was found to fail a simple Hebrew test.
Note that the following cross-examination is from that court. It took place in November 24, 1954...
"Have you made yourself familiar with Hebrew?"
"Yes."
"So you have a substantial linguistic apparatus at your command?"
"Yes, for use in my biblical work."
The following day, Franz was put on the stand again, and the following interview took place...
"You, yourself, read and speak Hebrew do you?"
"I do not speak Hebrew."
"You do not?"
"No."
"Can you translate that into Hebrew?"
"Which?"
"That fourth verse of the second chapter of Genesis."
"You mean here."
"Yes."
"No, I won't attempt to do that."
While Jehovahs Witnesses may not want to hear it, the truth of the matter is that Franz, like the others on the New World Translation Committee, could not translate Hebrew or Greek with any real proficiency. It is our duty as Christians, as Followers of Jesus Christ to tell them in Love that there being deceived about God, about Jesus, about what's actually written in the Bible by the Watchtower Society. There very souls are at stake...

 

[Mountain_Climber]

If Jesus is not God but rules in the place of God then that makes Jesus God If He rules in Gods place. Either that or God is a liar...
"I will not share my glory with another."
-Isaiah 42:8

You are quoting an improper translation there. "I will not share my glory with another", is a wrong translation of that verse.

They don't read Romans 6:1-6 they take that one verse, verse 7, out of context to back their doctrine.

And judging by the clarity of their own Bible translation, that is a strange thing indeed:

Romans 6:
1 "What are we to say then? Should we continue in sin so that undeserved kindness may increase?
2 Certainly not! Seeing that we died with reference to sin, how can we keep living any longer in it?
3 Or do you not know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death?
4 So we were buried with him through our baptism into his death, in order that just as Christ was raised up from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we also should walk in a newness of life.
5 If we have become united with him in the likeness of his death, we will certainly also be united with him in the likeness of his resurrection.
6 For we know that our old personality was nailed to the stake along with him in order for our sinful body to be made powerless, so that we should no longer go on being slaves to sin.
7 For the one who has died has been acquitted from his sin." (NWT 2013)

The only thing I can see as a possible reason is that phrase I highlight in red, "we will certainly also be". That can be taken to mean that Paul is talking about something which only happens in the future. And due to other errors in their beliefs.they would likely assume that means after one's literal death. But that is just not so.

esometha is there in the present imperative. It therefore denotes continuing action in and through the present.

This also is more in sink with that word, "alla" which verse 5 should begin with but they left out. If they would put that back into the text where it belongs, verse 5 would read, "But (in the sense of contrariwise, or, "to the contrary") if we have become united with him in the likeness of his death, we should certainly also [now] be united with him in the likeness of his resurrection [no longer walking in sin].

1 ......Should we continue in sin so that undeserved kindness may increase?
2 Certainly not! Seeing that we died with reference to sin, [so] how can we keep living any longer in it?

It comes down to each individual being willing to see what it really says. For many are fearful to face the facts concerning themselves.

 

[savagewind]

Our GB nor any of our presidents nor any of our ministers view themselves as prophets. We use the bible as our guide. WE are not coming up with anything new.... the WT is merely stating what is already written by the prophets of old.

Did Jesus say men would be the faithful and discreet slave or maybe he meant the helper who he sent?

 

[savagewind]

You know that's true Pegg! We all do. The gentleman I study with, "EVERY time I have a question about a subject in the Bible, he say's "well lets look that up" I reach for my Bible and he reaches for the "What Does the Bible really Teach" book. All he knows about the Bible is what that book says.

Some scriptures are not fully quoted in the books. Then they look them up in The Bible. I know this is a fact. I did it for twenty years, almost three times each week.

 

[Pegg]

You know that's true Pegg! We all do. The gentleman I study with, "EVERY time I have a question about a subject in the Bible, he say's "well lets look that up" I reach for my Bible and he reaches for the "What Does the Bible really Teach" book. All he knows about the Bible is what that book says.

and yet he comes to your home to teach you.... interesting

 

[Pegg]

The problem is the Watchtower mistranslates the bible to fit it's own theology. To make the bible say what it wants to say. That's the problem.

Every christian denomination does that. When a priest or pastor gets up and reads a portion of scripture he puts his own interpretation to it. He tells the people what his views on it are....he explains what his particular brand of Christianity believes it to mean.

In the end, we are required to sift through the vast sea of ideas and interpretations and decide which one convinces me.

While Jehovahs Witnesses may not want to hear it, the truth of the matter is that Franz, like the others on the New World Translation Committee, could not translate Hebrew or Greek with any real proficiency. It is our duty as Christians, as Followers of Jesus Christ to tell them in Love that there being deceived about God, about Jesus, about what's actually written in the Bible by the Watchtower Society. There very souls are at stake...

Our translation committee never attempted to translate the Greek and Hebrew manuscripts. They based the NWT on a couple of english manuscripts. So all this hooohaaa about Brothers on the committee not being able to read and write in greek and hebrew is a moot point. They didnt need to have a scholarship in the greek and hebrew languages. They used scholarly translations as the basis or their bible. Look in all of our bible literature for information on hebrew and greek words and you'll find that they quote from many and varied reputable scholars.

I dont buy into baseless criticisms.

 

[savagewind]

Every christian denomination does that. When a priest or pastor gets up and reads a portion of scripture he puts his own interpretation to it. He tells the people what his views on it are....he explains what his particular brand of Christianity believes it to mean.

In the end, we are required to sift through the vast sea of ideas and interpretations and decide which one convinces me.




Our translation committee never attempted to translate the Greek and Hebrew manuscripts. They based the NWT on a couple of english manuscripts. So all this hooohaaa about Brothers on the committee not being able to read and write in greek and hebrew is a moot point. They didnt need to have a scholarship in the greek and hebrew languages. They used scholarly translations as the basis or their bible. Look in all of our bible literature for information on hebrew and greek words and you'll find that they quote from many and varied reputable scholars.

I dont buy into baseless criticisms.

And you ignore arguments which are based on fact. We can see you ignoring me.

 

[savagewind]

It is a FACT that Jesus promised to send a helper to teach. JWs say their helper did not appear for a long, long time and they are for helping only Jehovah's Witnesses.