What are religionists being taught about other religions?

[loverofhumanity]

Baha'is also say that some of the teachings in the other religions are wrong. And yes other Faiths do read from other Scriptures. Christians read from the Hebrew Bible and they reinterpret it to mean what they want it to mean. And they disregard all other books the Jews believe in. But, just like Baha'is probably don't read a book from Scientology, Christians don't read the books of religions they believe to be false. But it is easy to read from the parts of the books from the past religions, the parts you like, and say you believe in those words. But, then like the Christians, Baha'i reinterpret the meaning of those Scriptures to mean what Baha'is want them to mean.

And I'm perfectly fine with doing that, if I were a Baha'i. Because I would have the belief that my religion, the Baha'i Faith, is telling me the truth about the true meaning from the Scriptures of those other Holy books. But, if I wasn't a Baha'i, I wouldn't want them telling me how to interpret verses in my own religion's Scriptures. And, because Baha'i do that, it would be difficult for me to "consort" with them with amity. Knowing they really don't believe what I believe about my own religion. And knowing the many Baha'is, maybe not you, will try and show me how I'm wrong and how the Baha'i Faith is right. Like, let's say a Hindu that believes in reincarnation. You're telling me the Baha'i would never challenge that belief and try and "correct" that belief with what the Baha'i writing say?

The problem I believe is when you say ‘my own religion’. I believe No religion belongs to or is ‘ owned by any one group’. No one group it is my belief has a monopoly or trademark on any Prophet or Holy Book or more importantly on it’s meaning and interpretation.

All the Prophets and Holy Books I believe were sent by God for all humanity. So we all have the God given right to hold a viewpoint or interpretation of any Holy Book as it belongs to us humanity.

 

[loverofhumanity]

What do Baha'is do with people that don't believe everything about the Baha'i Faith? Do you let them follow their heart and make their own choice? Or, do you show them in the Baha'i writings what they should believe? Like let's say a man living with two women. And they insist that they don't believe their lifestyle is wrong? Or, there's always the big one, when a Baha'i breaks the Baha'i Covenant.

It's almost like that for a Fundy Christian not to believe in the Bible literally. They should not follow their lying heart, because, you know, it's Satan trying to deceive them.

Ive been a Baha’i 45 years. My sister knows I’m a Baha’i but in 45 years I’ve never had a conversation with her about it because if she wanted she could investigate it for herself or ask me. So we talk about the weather or health when we meet. My nephew is a drinker and gambler and he knows I’m a Baha’i but I just let him alone to live as he wishes. We all get along fine.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Any truth? So who gets to define what is true in his religion? If it is him, it might not be something you believe is true.

I don’t believe that I will ever be wise enough to define what is truth so I turn to the Manifestations and follow Their definitions. Interestingly no Manifestation contradicts another Manifestation. It’s only the followers that contradict each other so I stick with the Manifestations definitions of truth.

 

[loverofhumanity]

For the Baha'is, this is the problem. Other religions believe all sorts of things that don't agree with what the Baha'i Faith teaches. And what do Baha'is say? That there were additions, traditions of men. There were thing misinterpreted and made to be literal when they were meant to be symbolic. But, does that explain all the differences in the various beliefs in the different religions? One God, many Gods, no God? Some people were prophets and manifestations, yet others were false?

So what do you believe about Krishna? I don't think you believe he was an incarnation of Vishnu? And what about Vishnu, Shiva, Brahma? A three-part Godhead?

Hmmm? One day... "Jesus is the only way. He is the Son of the living God and is God. He was crucified and rose again on the third day. He is the only way a person can be saved from their sins and avoid going to hell with the devil and his angels."
The next day... "I'm a Baha'i. Jesus, the man, is dead and buried. His spirit rose. There is no devil and God isn't going to send people to hell. Noble you were created. You were not born in sin. Jesus is a perfect reflection of God. He is not God."
That is not stronger. That is different.

As if Baha'is believe in a literal Adam. But, if you want to pretend the story was literal, then of course Adam had no father and mother... God made him out of clay. But Jesus, if you want to take that story literally, was born at a time where it took a man and a woman to make a baby. With Jesus, God, through the Holy Spirit, got Mary pregnant. And why Baha'is, of all the Bible stories, takes that one literally, I will never know. Yet, they don't believe that God could raise Jesus from the dead?

Basically we believe the Words of the Manifestations of God. Our interpretations come from Them not ourselves.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Baha'is also say that some of the teachings in the other religions are wrong. And yes other Faiths do read from other Scriptures. Christians read from the Hebrew Bible and they reinterpret it to mean what they want it to mean. And they disregard all other books the Jews believe in. But, just like Baha'is probably don't read a book from Scientology, Christians don't read the books of religions they believe to be false. But it is easy to read from the parts of the books from the past religions, the parts you like, and say you believe in those words. But, then like the Christians, Baha'i reinterpret the meaning of those Scriptures to mean what Baha'is want them to mean.

And I'm perfectly fine with doing that, if I were a Baha'i. Because I would have the belief that my religion, the Baha'i Faith, is telling me the truth about the true meaning from the Scriptures of those other Holy books. But, if I wasn't a Baha'i, I wouldn't want them telling me how to interpret verses in my own religion's Scriptures. And, because Baha'i do that, it would be difficult for me to "consort" with them with amity. Knowing they really don't believe what I believe about my own religion. And knowing the many Baha'is, maybe not you, will try and show me how I'm wrong and how the Baha'i Faith is right. Like, let's say a Hindu that believes in reincarnation. You're telling me the Baha'i would never challenge that belief and try and "correct" that belief with what the Baha'i writing say?

I think a major point needs clarification. It is not us Baha’is of ourselves who make any calls about the meanings of the scriptures of any religion but Baha’u’llah and His authorised Successors.So I think you need to be challenging Baha’u’llah directly by quoting His own Words and proving them to be false not us as we have no real knowledge except what Baha’u’llah teaches.

 

[JesusKnowsYou]

The example I made is kind of what a new "born again" Fundamentalist Christian would go through. The person would be told how the Bible teaches that they are a sinner and can't save themselves, and then how Jesus is the only way to salvation. Once "saved" then those Christians would be taught how the Creation story is to be taken literally? A friend of mine was a Fundy Christian and struggled with taking things in the Bible literally. And it was hard for him to express doubts to his Christian friends.

Ugh. My comment was supposed to say that the Bible does not teach a young Earth or six 24-hour creative periods.

The Bible does teach that all people are sinners and that we need the Lord Jesus Christ in order to be saved. That is what I honestly believe.

What I don't understand is how/why your friend can't express his doubts. I mean, faith cannot exist without doubt.

That's a sad situation.

 

[CG Didymus]

The problem I believe is when you say ‘my own religion’. I believe No religion belongs to or is ‘ owned by any one group’. No one group it is my belief has a monopoly or trademark on any Prophet or Holy Book or more importantly on it’s meaning and interpretation.

All the Prophets and Holy Books I believe were sent by God for all humanity. So we all have the God given right to hold a viewpoint or interpretation of any Holy Book as it belongs to us humanity.

So it would be okay to interpret the Baha'i writing to suit my beliefs? Cool!

Now let's get real You are "consorting" with amity with a Hindu, a Jew and a Christian. The Hindu starts talking about past lives he's lived to finally arrive at the spiritual place he is at in this life. The Jew tells the Christian how God has given them the Law for all their generations. The Christian tells all of you that you need Jesus to be saved. Do you challenge those beliefs of those people and try and explain the Baha'i view on those things? Or, change the subject and focus on the things that all of you have in common?

Of course the correct answer is for the Baha'i to be the one that brings all of them together in spite of their differences. Does that happen in the real world? Are Baha'is building bridges between themselves and people in the other religions? I'm sure it happens at interfaith gatherings, but does it happen between Baha'is and religious groups that have strong beliefs that they have the only truth? And, can people in other religions respect Baha'is and consort with them, knowing that Baha'is believe the other religions are out dated?

Other than liberal religious groups, I don't see people with strong beliefs being able to hold off telling the other people in a the different religions how wrong they are. And, I think that includes Baha's. At some point the Baha'is is going to have to admit that they believe that the Baha'i Faith has the real truth and has the real answers for today, and the other person's religion does not.

 

[CG Didymus]

I don’t believe that I will ever be wise enough to define what is truth so I turn to the Manifestations and follow Their definitions. Interestingly no Manifestation contradicts another Manifestation. It’s only the followers that contradict each other so I stick with the Manifestations definitions of truth.

Okay, stick only to what the manifestations have said. What are the truths we can learn from Hinduism? Then from Buddhism. Then Judaism. Then Christianity. Then Islam. Then the main truths from The Bab, and last, the main truths of Baha'u'llah.

Then, show how the followers in each of those religions contradicted the truth?

 

[CG Didymus]

I think a major point needs clarification. It is not us Baha’is of ourselves who make any calls about the meanings of the scriptures of any religion but Baha’u’llah and His authorised Successors.So I think you need to be challenging Baha’u’llah directly by quoting His own Words and proving them to be false not us as we have no real knowledge except what Baha’u’llah teaches.

Okay, what does Baha'u'llah say are the meanings of the Scriptures of Hinduism? And then Buddhism?

 

[paarsurrey]

Sounds like Jehovah's Witness, since Mormons don't use the term 'elder' that I'm aware of.
My experience at the kingdom halls of JW was exceptionally isolationist and xenophobic. Children with nonbelieving parents were encouraged to emancipate and get away from the parent at earliest opportunity, unless the child felt conversion was possible.
The only goal for door to door work was conversion, not commiseration or learning about the community or expanding horizons any further beyond the watchtower by-line. If you were a 'pioneer' you logged how many doors you saw and literature you placed, filling a quota depending on your part or full time status. If you didn't think you were going to get a return call or bible study, you left and thought nothing more on it

This could have changed since then, and my region and congregation could have been worse examples than the norm, but it was a sad state of affairs and I'm not sad to see those days behind me.

"I'm not sad to see those days behind me"

Was one a JW or a Bahai previously, please?

Regards

 

[loverofhumanity]

So it would be okay to interpret the Baha'i writing to suit my beliefs? Cool!

Now let's get real You are "consorting" with amity with a Hindu, a Jew and a Christian. The Hindu starts talking about past lives he's lived to finally arrive at the spiritual place he is at in this life. The Jew tells the Christian how God has given them the Law for all their generations. The Christian tells all of you that you need Jesus to be saved. Do you challenge those beliefs of those people and try and explain the Baha'i view on those things? Or, change the subject and focus on the things that all of you have in common?

Of course the correct answer is for the Baha'i to be the one that brings all of them together in spite of their differences. Does that happen in the real world? Are Baha'is building bridges between themselves and people in the other religions? I'm sure it happens at interfaith gatherings, but does it happen between Baha'is and religious groups that have strong beliefs that they have the only truth? And, can people in other religions respect Baha'is and consort with them, knowing that Baha'is believe the other religions are out dated?

Other than liberal religious groups, I don't see people with strong beliefs being able to hold off telling the other people in a the different religions how wrong they are. And, I think that includes Baha's. At some point the Baha'is is going to have to admit that they believe that the Baha'i Faith has the real truth and has the real answers for today, and the other person's religion does not.

Yes that’s true. Eventually we can’t hide from the world that we believe Baha’u’llah is the Promised One of all Faiths.

We expect worldwide opposition and welcome it. It will help purify us and prepare us for our great mission for we are far from being perfect and so must go through trials and tribulations in order to cleanse us of our defilements which is one of the main purposes of tests.

How great, how very great is the Cause! How very fierce the onslaught of all the peoples and kindreds of the earth. Ere long shall the clamor of the multitude throughout Africa, throughout America, the cry of the European and of the Turk, the groaning of India and China, be heard from far and near. One and all, they shall arise with all their power to resist His Cause. Then shall the knights of the Lord, assisted by His grace from on high, strengthened by faith, aided by the power of understanding, and reinforced by the legions of the Covenant, arise and make manifest the truth of the verse: "Behold the confusion that hath befallen the tribes of the defeated!" (Abdul-Baha)

 

[loverofhumanity]

So it would be okay to interpret the Baha'i writing to suit my beliefs? Cool!

Now let's get real You are "consorting" with amity with a Hindu, a Jew and a Christian. The Hindu starts talking about past lives he's lived to finally arrive at the spiritual place he is at in this life. The Jew tells the Christian how God has given them the Law for all their generations. The Christian tells all of you that you need Jesus to be saved. Do you challenge those beliefs of those people and try and explain the Baha'i view on those things? Or, change the subject and focus on the things that all of you have in common?

Of course the correct answer is for the Baha'i to be the one that brings all of them together in spite of their differences. Does that happen in the real world? Are Baha'is building bridges between themselves and people in the other religions? I'm sure it happens at interfaith gatherings, but does it happen between Baha'is and religious groups that have strong beliefs that they have the only truth? And, can people in other religions respect Baha'is and consort with them, knowing that Baha'is believe the other religions are out dated?

Other than liberal religious groups, I don't see people with strong beliefs being able to hold off telling the other people in a the different religions how wrong they are. And, I think that includes Baha's. At some point the Baha'is is going to have to admit that they believe that the Baha'i Faith has the real truth and has the real answers for today, and the other person's religion does not.

Yes that’s true. Eventually we can’t hide from the world that we believe Baha’u’llah is the Promised One of all Faiths.

This opposition is foreshadowed and unavoidable.

How great, how very great is the Cause! How very fierce the onslaught of all the peoples and kindreds of the earth. Ere long shall the clamor of the multitude throughout Africa, throughout America, the cry of the European and of the Turk, the groaning of India and China, be heard from far and near. One and all, they shall arise with all their power to resist His Cause. Then shall the knights of the Lord, assisted by His grace from on high, strengthened by faith, aided by the power of understanding, and reinforced by the legions of the Covenant, arise and make manifest the truth of the verse: "Behold the confusion that hath befallen the tribes of the defeated!" (Abdul-Baha)

 

[loverofhumanity]

Okay, stick only to what the manifestations have said. What are the truths we can learn from Hinduism? Then from Buddhism. Then Judaism. Then Christianity. Then Islam. Then the main truths from The Bab, and last, the main truths of Baha'u'llah.

Then, show how the followers in each of those religions contradicted the truth?

You’re asking the impossible. But I’ll give it my best.

Read the Bhagavad-Gita, the Dhammapadda, The Torah, the Gospels, the Writings of the Bab and Baha’u’llah their main teaching is love, unity and brotherhood. Even to attempt to summarise the wonder and beauty of all the teachings of These Manifestations in one post is beyond me and to try to do that would be futile. So love and brotherhood is what I’ll go with as this was the essence of what they all taught amongst other things.

All these Manifestations taught love and unity so where the followers have gone astray is that they are disunited and scattered into competing sects many which have gone to war with each other when the purpose of the Manifestations was always love, brotherhood and fellowship.

So today although all these religions exist outwardly all the world can witness that there is no love and unity between them and there is always tensions and threats of wars and conflicts.

So the Manifestations appear again and again to try to encourage and educate us to be loving and united.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Okay, what does Baha'u'llah say are the meanings of the Scriptures of Hinduism? And then Buddhism?

Which meanings are you enquiring about?

 

[Moz]

The problem I believe is when you say ‘my own religion’. I believe No religion belongs to or is ‘ owned by any one group’. No one group it is my belief has a monopoly or trademark on any Prophet or Holy Book or more importantly on it’s meaning and interpretation.

All the Prophets and Holy Books I believe were sent by God for all humanity. So we all have the God given right to hold a viewpoint or interpretation of any Holy Book as it belongs to us humanity.

All the Prophets and Holy Books I believe were sent by God for all humanity.

The Hebrew prophets were sent specifically to the Jews they were definitely NOT saying the message of God that they brought was for all mankind. The New Testament as well was written to believers for believers. The actual Bible story is of Two worlds at odds with each other until the end, it is not some kumbaya movement like the Bahia think. Armageddon and the destruction of the unrighteous world is the bible answer, not mankind unifying and discovering peace. Peace is enforced when the violent are killed by God.

 

[Moz]

You’re asking the impossible. But I’ll give it my best.

Read the Bhagavad-Gita, the Dhammapadda, The Torah, the Gospels, the Writings of the Bab and Baha’u’llah their main teaching is love, unity and brotherhood. Even to attempt to summarise the wonder and beauty of all the teachings of These Manifestations in one post is beyond me and to try to do that would be futile. So love and brotherhood is what I’ll go with as this was the essence of what they all taught amongst other things.

All these Manifestations taught love and unity so where the followers have gone astray is that they are disunited and scattered into competing sects many which have gone to war with each other when the purpose of the Manifestations was always love, brotherhood and fellowship.

So today although all these religions exist outwardly all the world can witness that there is no love and unity between them and there is always tensions and threats of wars and conflicts.

So the Manifestations appear again and again to try to encourage and educate us to be loving and united.

The Gospels do NOT teach Love Unity and brotherhood to the outside world but to fellow believers. The outside world is to be tolerated and accommodated as much as possible but it was to be viewed as separate. The Hebrews were well known for NOT associating with the other nations or religions. This is why the Bahia attempt to co-opt Biblical authority is so galling, they claim a tradition that is incompatible with the teachings of that tradition.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Okay, what does Baha'u'llah say are the meanings of the Scriptures of Hinduism? And then Buddhism?

In the Tabernacle of Unity Baha’u’llah answers a number of questions regarding Hinduism put to Him. You can download that book and read the questions and His answers.

Buddhism was never asked of Him likely because it was not widespread in that area but Abdul-Baha has mention it was a true religion.

But as we have no way of ascertaining from the older religions what was revealed by the Manifestations and what was added to the religion by men Baha’u’llah has stated that in this day the way to authenticate and legitimise any claim of truth is by observing these Words.

“Whatsoever runneth counter to the Teachings in this day is rejected, for the Sun of Truth is shining resplendent above the horizon of knowledge.”

The Tabernacle of Unity
Bahá’u’lláh

In the Book of Certitude Baha’u’llah explains the true meaning of return which Hindus believe is reincarnation. Buddha never denied the existence of God and we cannot know if records of Him teaching about God existed and were lost but Baha’u’llah says that all the religions were inspired by the same Reality or Common Source.

 

[loverofhumanity]

All the Prophets and Holy Books I believe were sent by God for all humanity.

The Hebrew prophets were sent specifically to the Jews they were definitely NOT saying the message of God that they brought was for all mankind. The New Testament as well was written to believers for believers. The actual Bible story is of Two worlds at odds with each other until the end, it is not some kumbaya movement like the Bahia think. Armageddon and the destruction of the unrighteous world is the bible answer, not mankind unifying and discovering peace. Peace is enforced when the violent are killed by God.

The world at that time was not yet fully explored or discovered but we find that the teachings that there is One God and the law of love thy neighbour have been adopted worldwide so potentially they were for all humanity.

The wolf and lamb lying down together and one shepherd and one fold point not to complete extinction but reconciliation and unity between previous antagonistic and hostile nations, races and religions.

We are learning the hard way that war is undesirable and in this age I believe that, despite further likely catastrophes, we will become one people under one God worldwide and learn war no more. It will take time and not happen instantly or without effort from us.

This is the promise enshrined in the Bible not kumbaya. And it will come about I belueve because the Word of God promises it will happen. . Peace will come and war will be no more in due time I believe and then God’s Kingdom which we Baha’is are building now will gradually be established all over the earth.

And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. (Isaiah 2:4).

 

[Moz]

The world at that time was not yet fully explored or discovered but we find that the teachings that there is One God and the law of love thy neighbour have been adopted worldwide so potentially they were for all humanity.

The wolf and lamb lying down together and one shepherd and one fold point not to complete extinction but reconciliation and unity between previous antagonistic and hostile nations, races and religions.

We are learning the hard way that war is undesirable and in this age I believe that, despite further likely catastrophes, we will become one people under one God worldwide and learn war no more. It will take time and not happen instantly or without effort from us.

This is the promise enshrined in the Bible not kumbaya. And it will come about I belueve because the Word of God promises it will happen. . Peace will come and war will be no more in due time I believe and then God’s Kingdom which we Baha’is are building now will gradually be established all over the earth.

And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. (Isaiah 2:4).

The "He shall judge among the nations and rebuke many people" bit is what you should be focused on in this instance not the Peace that comes after it. The Judging the nations thing... that is a little thing in the Bible called Armageddon, The Day of the LORD, Judgement Day, The War of God Almighty. The Abrahamic religions were ALL taught that God would intervene and END this world not transform it.

Dan2:34 While you watched, a stone was hewn from a mountain without a hand being put to it, and it struck its iron and clay feet, breaking them in pieces.35 The iron, clay, bronze, silver, and gold all crumbled at once, fine as the chaff on the threshing floor in summer, and the wind blew them away without leaving a trace. But the stone that struck the statue became a great mountain and filled the whole earth.

The Kingdom of GOD is not a transformation of THIS world but the implementation of an entirely new management.

 

[loverofhumanity]

The Gospels do NOT teach Love Unity and brotherhood to the outside world but to fellow believers. The outside world is to be tolerated and accommodated as much as possible but it was to be viewed as separate. The Hebrews were well known for NOT associating with the other nations or religions. This is why the Bahia attempt to co-opt Biblical authority is so galling, they claim a tradition that is incompatible with the teachings of that tradition.

We believe God sent Christ for all humanity that whoever believed in Him would be saved.

The Bible we believe was given by God to all humanity to read and understand. Jesus we believe was sent for all humanity. Christians I believe have no ownership claims on Jesus or the Bible. God in the Bible says He loves all humanity and so sent us Jesus and gave us the Gospels.. But the known world then was very small. However Jesus has been accepted worldwide.

John 3:16

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life

If you love only your own fellow believers, Jesus says you are no better than the pagans for they love each other also. Only unconditional love for all humanity is acceptable to Jesus. Below He says to love all not just your fellow believers. No wonder you’ve had inquisitions and crusades because it’s easy to go to war against those you don’t love.

Matthew 5:43-48

Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfec