godnotgod
Thou art That
No one can set you free simply because you already are free.
We are like birds in a cage with an open door.
The cage is nothing else but mind itself. :angel2:
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What came before the Big Bang?
- Thread starter yoda89
- Start date
No one can set you free simply because you already are free.
We are like birds in a cage with an open door.
The cage is nothing else but mind itself. :angel2:
Alt Thinker
Older than the hills
So to be free you have to be ... out of your mind?
godnotgod
Thou art That
Sounds like you're in your right mind.
"There is a great difference and also a great similarity between madness and enlightenment. The similarity has to be understood first, because without understanding it, it will be difficult to understand the difference.
Both are beyond the mind madness and enlightenment.
Madness is below the mind.
Enlightenment is above the mind.
But both are out of the mind.
Hence, you have the expression for a madman 'out of his mind.' The same expression can be used for the enlightened person; he is also out of his mind.
Mind functions logically, rationally, intellectually. Neither madness nor enlightenment function intellectually. They are similar: madness has fallen below reason, and enlightenment has gone above reason, but both are irrational*; hence, sometimes in the East a madman is misunderstood as being an enlightened man. These similarities are there."
by OSHO, From 'Personality to Individuality'
*I would take issue with Enlightenment being irrational: it is more non-rational, than irrational.
Alt Thinker
Older than the hills
Sounds like you're in your right mind.
"There is a great difference and also a great similarity between madness and enlightenment. The similarity has to be understood first, because without understanding it, it will be difficult to understand the difference.
Both are beyond the mind madness and enlightenment.
Madness is below the mind.
Enlightenment is above the mind.
But both are out of the mind.
Hence, you have the expression for a madman 'out of his mind.' The same expression can be used for the enlightened person; he is also out of his mind.
Mind functions logically, rationally, intellectually. Neither madness nor enlightenment function intellectually. They are similar: madness has fallen below reason, and enlightenment has gone above reason, but both are irrational*; hence, sometimes in the East a madman is misunderstood as being an enlightened man. These similarities are there."
by OSHO, From 'Personality to Individuality'
*I would take issue with Enlightenment being irrational: it is more non-rational, than irrational.
Legend has it that when Lao Tzu was told his wife had died, he banged on a pot.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
godnotgod
Thou art That
Where is there anyone inside of anything that wants out?
Empty inside....through and through.
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godnotgod
Thou art That
Thanks for bringing that up, but it struck me as not sounding like Lao Tzu, so I looked it up. It is actually the Tasoist sage Chuang Tzu, or Zhuangzi, to be more accurate. Hope you don't mind a little elaboration on the story, below:
Zhuangzi himself shows indifference toward death and decries the common practice of mourning because the mourner assumes knowledge of the unknown and pretends his dislike of it. In contrast, by his understanding of the nature of things, the sage is no longer affected by external factors and the changes of the world. On this passage the great commentator Kuo Hsiang comments: “When ignorant, he felt sorry. When he understood, he was no longer affected. This teaches man to disperse emotion with reason.”
When Zhuangzi’s wife died, his friend Hui Shih found Zhuangzi sitting on the ground, singing and banging on pots. On asking him how he could be so unfeeling to his wife, he was told by Zhuangzi: “When she had just died, I could not help being affected. Soon, however, I examined the matter from the very beginning. At the very beginning, she was not living, having no form, nor even substance. But somehow or other there was then her substance, then her form, and then her life. Now by a further change, she has died. The whole process is like the sequence of the four seasons, spring, summer, autumn, and winter. While she is thus lying in the great mansion of the universe, for me to go about weeping and wailing would be to proclaim myself ignorant of the natural laws. Therefore I stopped!”
https://philosophynow.org/issues/27/Death_in_Classical_Daoist_Thought
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Thief
Rogue Theologian
Which could explain most of 'your' post work!
Alt Thinker
Older than the hills
godnotgod
Thou art That
...making the bottom line for me no entrapped "I" in a cage requiring escape, unlike your situation.
So get out! :slap:
godnotgod
Thou art That
Since I read about it 50 years ago, I am surprised I got any of it right.
You got the meat of it, though.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
And 'who' would that 'me'....be?
(and your ongoing denial of self goes on.......and on....on.....on.....)
Do 'you' hear the echo of 'your' routine?
godnotgod
Thou art That
You got it. It's just an echo of an echo of an echo of an illusory ego called "I", which you fool yourself into the belief that it is real, and which one day will wing its way to some lollipop heaven in the sky to continue to be stroked, gratified and adored ad nauseum. Echoes are empty, through and through. No contamination with the has-been dust-baggage called "I" that you continue to desperately cling to in......
CHECKMATE! :slap:
Clue: You continually tell us that time does not exist. Did it ever occur to you that "I" cannot exist except in time? Connect dots.
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Thief
Rogue Theologian
"I" cannot fool 'myself' unless 'I' exist.
('you' are sounding kinda silly having gone this far)
godnotgod
Thou art That
How can "I" exist if there is no time?
It is because it DOESN'T exist that the self-created mind fools itself into thinking that it does!
Checkmate!
The ego loves to crow about it's so-called existence, like a (C)ock-On-Dunghill, when, in fact, it is just a peacock's prancing about made up of so much hot air, a has-been wannabe that has never quite arrived. And so, it spins its foolish fantasies about perpetuation in some imaginary cotton candy, hunky-dory afterlife, when it hasn't even begun to understand how to live THIS one!
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What the hell is "I" ?
One exists into the flowing wisp of seconds that constitute the "now" of a bit of space contained in a wisp of the escaping vortex of distance covered that represents the moving through space-time to the very next fraction of tomorrow. In that captured slice of reality rests the moment of a single meaning of one's gnosis known as "I". In that moment, and for the next moment, "I" can be flavored as life's promise of moments to come, but these moments never occur because the whoosh of momentum speeds by into yesterday. We can't really capture that instant of truth known as the "I" in reality know as "ME". We move into another plain of existance that shows, but not offers, the offered availability of another instance of the "I" that we can enjoy, but for a small kiss on the cheek as a token of the truth we want to be.
Ahhhh....the elusiveness of "I", we can never get to the "ME", maybe heaven will stand still for us all,...... maybe !
`
Did "I" say that......what a bunch of crap !!
~
nuff stuff
'mud
One exists into the flowing wisp of seconds that constitute the "now" of a bit of space contained in a wisp of the escaping vortex of distance covered that represents the moving through space-time to the very next fraction of tomorrow. In that captured slice of reality rests the moment of a single meaning of one's gnosis known as "I". In that moment, and for the next moment, "I" can be flavored as life's promise of moments to come, but these moments never occur because the whoosh of momentum speeds by into yesterday. We can't really capture that instant of truth known as the "I" in reality know as "ME". We move into another plain of existance that shows, but not offers, the offered availability of another instance of the "I" that we can enjoy, but for a small kiss on the cheek as a token of the truth we want to be.
Ahhhh....the elusiveness of "I", we can never get to the "ME", maybe heaven will stand still for us all,...... maybe !
`
Did "I" say that......what a bunch of crap !!
~
nuff stuff
'mud
Thief
Rogue Theologian
So...it's not about 'you'?
Thief
Rogue Theologian
How can "I" exist if there is no time?
It is because it DOESN'T exist that the self-created mind fools itself into thinking that it does!
Checkmate!
The ego loves to crow about it's so-called existence, like a (C)ock-On-Dunghill, when, in fact, it is just a peacock's prancing about made up of so much hot air, a has-been wannabe that has never quite arrived. And so, it spins its foolish fantasies about perpetuation in some imaginary cotton candy, hunky-dory afterlife, when it hasn't even begun to understand how to live THIS one!
Time does not exist.
I do.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
Profound moment.