What climate action to people favor or be willing to accept?

[Twilight Hue]

Start by cleaning up the oceans, along with severely limiting plastic production...

if they were remotely serious about the issues they would make it an elective endeavor rather than through compulsory and punitive measures that accomplish nothing but ire and distain towards the cause they seek to resolve.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Who is going to pay for this dream....or nightmare?

Hopefully the cottage industry that predictably will massively profit off the forced green movement.

 

[jbg]

Either we do - with $$, or the next generation does - with fighting extreme weather, flooding of all coasts and probably an eco dictatorship that tries to fix all the **** we leave them.

We don't know what, if anything, this ̷b̷o̷o̷n̷d̷o̷g̷g̷l̷e̷ new technology will accomplish.

 

[jbg]

if they were remotely serious about the issues they would make it an elective endeavor rather than through compulsory and punitive measures that accomplish nothing but ire and disdain towards the cause they seek to resolve.

I'll tell you one thing; people who think like us need to speak up, and sooner rather than later.

 

[crossfire]

if they were remotely serious about the issues they would make it an elective endeavor rather than through compulsory and punitive measures that accomplish nothing but ire and distain towards the cause they seek to resolve.

So that would mean we as consumers would have to make conscious choices and not just go by cheapest price.

I don't want my water polluted by actions of large corporations. Just fining these corporations for polluting the water is ineffective, as these fines just become part of doing business.

I'm open to any alternative suggestions that you might have that would be effective in stopping the polluters.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I'll tell you one thing; people who think like us need to speak up, and sooner rather than later.

Yep.

Provide incentives and you will get results.

Force punitive measures and get the middle finger essentially.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Why are you more comfortable with a technology that causes 613 times more deaths?
Do you understand how this is irrational?

I'm not .. I am not comfortable with any massive project .. I prefer the small ones

"Small is beautiful"

 

[Pete in Panama]

I'm not .. I am not comfortable with any massive project .. I prefer the small ones

"Small is beautiful"

Especially if we're not intruding on our neighbors --or our neighbors are intruding on us...

.

 

[Pete in Panama]

if they were remotely serious about the issues they would make it an elective endeavor rather than through compulsory and punitive measures that accomplish nothing but ire and distain towards the cause they seek to resolve.

Unfortunately what a lot of folks care about here are "free-rider" situations. It's like a bunch of folks live around a lake and they decide they want a cleaner lake they pass a law requiring ALL to stop polluting. If one person sneaks around the law, he ends up w/ a much cleaner lake w/o doing anything. The rest get an almost as good lake.

We don't want free riders, it's everyone or noone, and this applies to the atmosphere and the oceans. The problem we now get into is the fact that the U.S. is just 5% of the world's population, and if we clean up we need the cooperation of the other 95%. Maybe I could believe that we cause 15% of the world's pollution but even that would be controversial. w/o the cooperation of the rest of the world anything we do in the U.S. is meaningless.

Forget about the environment. First comes world unity.

 

[muhammad_isa]

w/o the cooperation of the rest of the world anything we do in the U.S. is meaningless..

It's not meaningless .. your attitude is one of "if we can't beat them, join them".

That is what the communist party in China has done isn't it? Embraced Capitalism?

 

[exchemist]

Who is going to pay for this dream....or nightmare?

Bear in mind the change in climate is already costing us trillions of dollars per year in damage from fire, flood, hurricanes etc. - and the resulting inexorable climb in insurance premia. The costs of climate control measures should be seen as mitigating further rises in such costs. Which is why the big insurers are fully behind climate countermeasures.

 

[exchemist]

Unfortunately what a lot of folks care about here are "free-rider" situations. It's like a bunch of folks live around a lake and they decide they want a cleaner lake they pass a law requiring ALL to stop polluting. If one person sneaks around the law, he ends up w/ a much cleaner lake w/o doing anything. The rest get an almost as good lake.

We don't want free riders, it's everyone or noone, and this applies to the atmosphere and the oceans. The problem we now get into is the fact that the U.S. is just 5% of the world's population, and if we clean up we need the cooperation of the other 95%. Maybe I could believe that we cause 15% of the world's pollution but even that would be controversial. w/o the cooperation of the rest of the world anything we do in the U.S. is meaningless.

Forget about the environment. First comes world unity.

The rest of the world is doing plenty. It is nice to see the USA has stopped dragging its feet.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Unfortunately what a lot of folks care about here are "free-rider" situations. It's like a bunch of folks live around a lake and they decide they want a cleaner lake they pass a law requiring ALL to stop polluting. If one person sneaks around the law, he ends up w/ a much cleaner lake w/o doing anything. The rest get an almost as good lake.

We don't want free riders, it's everyone or noone, and this applies to the atmosphere and the oceans. The problem we now get into is the fact that the U.S. is just 5% of the world's population, and if we clean up we need the cooperation of the other 95%. Maybe I could believe that we cause 15% of the world's pollution but even that would be controversial. w/o the cooperation of the rest of the world anything we do in the U.S. is meaningless.

Forget about the environment. First comes world unity.

Screw any policy that is antithesis to people's freedoms.

All you end up with is pushback and an even worse problem than before.

It's better suited to incentive rather than force.

 

[Pete in Panama]

Screw any policy that is antithesis to people's freedoms.

All you end up with is pushback and an even worse problem than before.

It's better suited to incentive rather than force.

...anything u say...

 

[Unfettered]

...anything u say...

I may not have used the same words, but his point is sound. Compulsion of the innocent is the hallmark of evil.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I may not have used the same words, but his point is sound. Compulsion of the innocent is the hallmark of evil.

Conversely incentives motivates people and encourages people to willingly go in a particular direction.

A hallmark of a free, open, and fair society.

Something that the , "land of the free" had categorically forgotten.

 

[Unfettered]

Conversely incentives motivates people and encourages people to willingly go in a particular direction.

A hallmark of a free, open, and fair society.

Something that the , "land of the free" had categorically forgotten.

Not sure I'm going to agree here. I would say that government shouldn't be incentivizing any more than it should be compelling. The devil is in the details.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Not sure I'm going to agree here. I would say that government shouldn't be incentivizing any more than it should be compelling. The devil is in the details.

What do you call "incentivizing"? I would say that taxes can be very incentivizing. I also think that a person should be charged a fair price for a product. Let's say that a product sold to people requires some sort of clean up afterwards, but most people cannot or do not clean up after themselves. Would a tax that can be used to pay for the clean up be reasonable?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Who is going to pay for this dream....or nightmare?

The same people who fund armies and wars.
And those who will profit from it in the future, more.

I know it's not gonna happen. But the OP is asking what we think should happen.
I think that is what should happen.

The world could easily afford it given a a change in few priorities.
Just to give you an idea: the world has spend a budget of 9 trillion in fiscal support in response to covid. And that's thus not even counting the purchases of masks, vaccines, additional budgets for research and staffing of the health sector, etc.

And all that in just 2-3 years.
When confronted with a crisis, the world is very capable of shifting gears and injecting massive funds.

Also, why exactly would you call it a nightmare?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I'm not .. I am not comfortable with any massive project .. I prefer the small ones

"Small is beautiful"

Only a massive project will turn society away from fossil fuels.
The economy literally runs on oil today. These are the economic fundamentals of our modern society.
When you are going to replace the roots, it's going to be a massive project.

And if you want it done yesterday rather then tomorrow, you better have a solid central coordination of said project as well as a solid cooperation between all parties.
Considering the threat to everybody on the planet and that it in fact is a matter of planetary security, I'ld say the UN is a good entity to lead that charge.

It's not just a country that is being threatened. It's a planet.
A planetary threat / problem requires a planetary response.