What Day was Jesus Crucified?

[waitasec]

It does not come out wrong when based on the Word of God - whether OT or NT.
The reason christianity has got it wrong is because they use guesswork instead of scripture. That is not GOD's fault.

:biglaugh:

 

[smokydot]

Smokydot , scripture tells us that Jesus ate the Pasover meal with his Disciples on the night of the 14th (which I never disputed) since night comes before day Jesus was still alive then. He died in the afternoon of that same day the 14th and was buried at sunset when the first day of unleavened bread started the 15th.
So we have the 'preparation of the Passover' when Jesus died and immediately we have the start of the first day of unleavened bread also called a High day,a Sabbath, a Feast day or Passover. Because it is called a Sabbath does not mean it is a saturday. Those 7 annual High days can fall any day of the week and are only called Sabbath because they are HOLY DAYS like the Saturday but do not have to be saturday.

But Passover was not one of those Sabbaths.

Christians make the mistake of assuming a preparation day is before a saturday (sabbath) that the crucifixion must have been on a friday.
That is the result of falsly assuming what they reject and deny which is the true Sabbath and yearly Sabbaths.
Just out of curiosity I wonder how many debators of this subject actually observe Passover and the weekly/annual Sabbaths ??? :rainbow1:

However, Beta, in the gospels Jesus died the day before the Sabbath, and rose the day after the Sabbath, on the first day of the week, Sunday.

Since he died the day before the Sabbath, and after eating the Passover meal, the Sabbath in question is not Passover.
Not to mention that Passover was not one of the Sabbaths.

 

[Beta]

The Passover according to the book of Mark (supposedly the 1st of the four gospels) structures the Passover in a weird way from what I've been reading here in this thread. What I find most interesting was Yeshua was crucified on that Friday morning and taken down before the Sabbath. After he is taken down the scripture seems to imply he was visited the next day after the Sabbath. This is where I'm having trouble understanding the 3 days 3 nights.

You have to look at other scriptures as well apart from Mark. The reason many are confused is that they only count the one Sabbath when in fact there were two in Passover week. There is also an 'Annual Sabbath ' on the first day of unleavened bread also often called a High Day (Joh.19v31) or Passover or Sabbath though not the weekly Sabbath .Jesus was crucified on wednesday the preparation day before the High Day Sabbath which was on a thursday THEN followed the friday on which the women bought and prepared spices Lk.23v56 .THEN they rested on the weekly Sabbath per commandment (the 4th). THEN they went to the tomb early sunday morning but Jesus was already risen. Jesus was exactly 3 daytimes and 3 nighttimes 72 hours in the tomb as he himself predicted Mat.12v39,40.

 

[smokydot]

The death of Jesus was before the High Day mentioned in Joh.19v31 also called a Sabbath or Passover or first day of unleavened bread and an annual HOLY DAY (but was not a saturday).

Nisan 14, Passover, is not a Sabbath.

The resurrection was/is not mentioned to be after a Sabbath. It says in Mat.28v1 and MK.16, after the Sabbath was past(the weekly Sabbath in which the women rested according to commandment the 4th)...the women came to the tomb.There were 2 Sabbaths that week with friday in between when they prepared spices and ointments.

Passover was not one of the Sabbaths. There were not two Sabbaths that week, Passover and Unleavened Bread, because Passover is not one of the Sabbaths.
Do you have a Scriptural reference for Passover being a Sabbath?

It does not say that Jesus rose after the Sabbath...for he was already risen. Do you see the difference ? Jesus did not rise after the Sabbath ...it was when the women came to anoint him and found him risen.

But if there two Sabbaths, with a day in between them while Jesus was in the grave, why didn't the women go to the tomb to annoint him on the day in between
the first and second one, instead of waiting until after the second one--that's three days without proper preparation of his body for burial.
Observing Jews would not wait that long.

The 'preparation (day) of the Passover' is not a Sabbath. Work was being done on that day and Jesus was crucified on that day that is why it is called the 'preparation day' in which work was done.

Do you have a Scriptural reference for Passover being one of the Sabbaths?

 

[Dirty Penguin]

You have to look at other scriptures as well apart from Mark. The reason many are confused is that they only count the one Sabbath when in fact there were two in Passover week. There is also an 'Annual Sabbath ' on the first day of unleavened bread also often called a High Day (Joh.19v31) or Passover or Sabbath though not the weekly Sabbath .Jesus was crucified on wednesday the preparation day before the High Day Sabbath which was on a thursday THEN followed the friday on which the women bought and prepared spices Lk.23v56 .THEN they rested on the weekly Sabbath per commandment (the 4th). THEN they went to the tomb early sunday morning but Jesus was already risen. Jesus was exactly 3 daytimes and 3 nighttimes 72 hours in the tomb as he himself predicted Mat.12v39,40.

While I understand what you're saying...the book of Mark was written for a specific audience at a specific time way before the other gospels were written so my focus is on that one instead of trying to combine the gospels to paint a new picture which, to be honest, is picking and choosing what I want and don't want them to be saying. As far as the book of Mark the time from the crucifixion (before the start of the Sabbath) up until the day after the Sabbath when it said the women came to visit the tomb does not appear to be 3 days and 3 nights....

 

[Beta]

But Passover was not one of those Sabbaths.
However, Beta, in the gospels Jesus died the day before the Sabbath, and rose the day after the Sabbath, on the first day of the week, Sunday.

Since he died the day before the Sabbath, and after eating the Passover meal, the Sabbath in question is not Passover.
Not to mention that Passover was not one of the Sabbaths.

We have been over this time and again , seems you won't accept that Jesus died on the day befor an ANNUAL SABBATH Joh.19v31 which was not the weekly Sabbath.And yes he died after eating the passover meal.That day was not a Sabbath but the next day was.
And the Gospels do NOT say he rose after a Sabbath. They say that he was (past tense) risen, he was not there when the women came to the tomb on sunday morning. If you want to read a resurrection into sunday it's your business but you will not be in agreement with scripture.
I am going to leave it there now , it's been explained over and over.

 

[fallingblood]

You might read Mat.26v17-21
The Passover (meal) is the same as the Last Supper.

No, it's not. John doesn't talk about a Passover Meal. The suggestion is never even brought up. In fact, John 18:28 states that Passover had not yet began and implies that the meal has not been eaten at that time (this is after Jesus is arrested).

 

[fallingblood]

You are so misinformed.

If I'm so misinformed, then prove it. Take out your scripture, and find, in the Gospel of John, where the Last Supper is ever called a Passover Meal. It is a simple request if what you are saying is true.

 

[fallingblood]

Of course I can understand what you are saying.
But GOD looks at time differently and he tells us that the death,burial and resurrection of Jesus IS ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURE which reflects HIS TIMING. It really does not matter what WE think.Either we fit into GOD's timing or we are left out in the cold .:yes:
My original post was a slip based on human reckoning - just like you do. Fortunately I soon realized the mistake.

Well, wouldn't it still be God's time the way Poisonshady put it? He's taking what he said out of Hebrew scripture. The timing that he uses reflects what Scripture says and thus, ideally (I'm not convinced that scripture is the word of God, but that is besides the point) should reflect what God's timing is.

A question rises to what you're saying though. Why would God lay down what he has to say in scripture, and then confuse everyone else by inventing something completely new that no one can know and/or contradicts what scripture says? It seems to be a considerable problem.

 

[Harmonious]

You have to look at other scriptures as well apart from Mark. The reason many are confused is that they only count the one Sabbath when in fact there were two in Passover week. There is also an 'Annual Sabbath ' on the first day of unleavened bread also often called a High Day (Joh.19v31)

No, there ISN'T an "annual sabbath."

The Shabbat before Passover is called Shabbat Hagadol, or the Great Sabbath. It isn't, in and of itself, more impressive than any other Sabbath. It is called Shabbat Hagadol because it precedes the holiday that demarcates the Jews as God's Chosen nation.

or Passover or Sabbath though not the weekly Sabbath .

No, there isn't.

Jesus was crucified on wednesday the preparation day before the High Day Sabbath which was on a thursday THEN followed the friday on which the women bought and prepared spices Lk.23v56 .THEN they rested on the weekly Sabbath per commandment (the 4th). THEN they went to the tomb early sunday morning but Jesus was already risen. Jesus was exactly 3 daytimes and 3 nighttimes 72 hours in the tomb as he himself predicted Mat.12v39,40.

I agree with Poisonshaday: it bugs me when people use the gospels as their reference to understand anything about Jewish life.

The authors of the gospels themselves were ignorant of Jewish law, and the fact that you can make the mistake of "High Day Sabbath" and seriously have NO idea what you are talking about only makes it clear that you CAN'T get your knowledge of Jewish things, holidays, dates, or anything else of that nature from Christian scriptures.

It never helps.

 

[Beta]

Nisan 14, Passover, is not a Sabbath.
Passover was not one of the Sabbaths. There were not two Sabbaths that week, Passover and Unleavened Bread, because Passover is not one of the Sabbaths.
Do you have a Scriptural reference for Passover being a Sabbath?
But if there two Sabbaths, with a day in between them while Jesus was in the grave, why didn't the women go to the tomb to annoint him on the day in between
the first and second one, instead of waiting until after the second one--that's three days without proper preparation of his body for burial.
Observing Jews would not wait that long.
Do you have a Scriptural reference for Passover being one of the Sabbaths?

I'm not sure we'll ever get to the bottom of this. I never never said Passover was a Sabbath- you do and some Jews do.
The 2 Sabbaths in question are :
1) the first day of unleavened bread (also called High Day,Sabbath or feast Day or even Passover by some)
2)the weekly Sabbath
Jesus did have a jewish burial wrapped in spices Lk.23v50-53 and that was on the day of preparation v54. The following day starting immediately after the burial at sunset was the Sabbath or ANNUAL High Day (not the weekly Sabbath).The women stood afar off watching the procedings v49.Since it was already the Sabbath they could do nothing but wait in order to buy and prepare spices and ointments when the Sabbath was over.We should remember their task was not accomplished as quick as it might be today and could well have taken them all day friday.They may not have had a supermarket nearby with fast transport or had Mixers, Grinders and electricity to conveniently switch on :areyoucra.They were women who also needed to eat and rest during their labours that could not be rushed. And again they were having to wait until the weekly Sabbath was past v56. (perhaps you might look into the process of making ointments and balsam to see how long it takes)

 

[fallingblood]

You obviously don't realize that God/Christ are not teaching 'Judaism' at all since Jews too are in error as we see from Mat.23 and other scriptures. Just because we share some things with other religions does not mean we are joining them. ALL religions have at least SOME truth. But being mixed with error non is acceptable to God - therefore we all need correction !

That is misunderstanding the rise of Christianity.

The early Christians did not find a distinction between themselves and Jews. For them, they were still devout Jews. They were just part of one more sect of first century Judaism. More so, both Jesus and the author of Matthew (as far as we can tell) were Jews. Again, Christianity started out as a sect of Judaism.

It was later on, after the first Jewish War, that a division began to form. Judaism was consolidating (partly because various other sects were destroyed) that Christianity began to be seen as a new religion (interestingly, the term Christianity never is mentioned in the New Testament). That division began widening really after the second Jewish war.

However, that division did affect what the Gospel writers said towards the mainstream Jews (not sure that is the best phrase, but the idea is still the same). They were upset that the Jews were pushing them away (as they were consolidating Judaism). So the NT is very biased when speaking about Jews.

 

[fallingblood]

Except for that part where he is arrested after the meal (Jn 18:1-2), which makes it the Passover meal.

Not a word about the Passover meal there. Read up to verse 28 which states that Passover had not yet began.

 

[waitasec]

Not a word about the Passover meal there. Read up to verse 28 which states that Passover had not yet began.

you can lead a horse to water...

 

[Harmonious]

The 2 Sabbaths in question are :
1) the first day of unleavened bread (also called High Day,Sabbath or feast Day or even Passover by some)

No. There IS no High Day, Sabbath. This day you are trying to create doesn't exist except in your heart and mind.

2)the weekly Sabbath

Look -

Sometimes, holidays are called Shabbat, but attempting to make Shabbat Hagadol something other than an actual Friday night-to-Saturday-night Sabbath is what we call bad fiction.

 

[Beta]

While I understand what you're saying...the book of Mark was written for a specific audience at a specific time way before the other gospels were written so my focus is on that one instead of trying to combine the gospels to paint a new picture which, to be honest, is picking and choosing what I want and don't want them to be saying. As far as the book of Mark the time from the crucifixion (before the start of the Sabbath) up until the day after the Sabbath when it said the women came to visit the tomb does not appear to be 3 days and 3 nights....

It is up to you which method of investigation you use in order to get at truth.In the OT we are adviced to piece it together ...here a little...there a little Isah.28v9,10. God does not think that is picking and choosing .

 

[Beta]

No. There IS no High Day, Sabbath. This day you are trying to create doesn't exist except in your heart and mind.
Look -

Sometimes, holidays are called Shabbat, but attempting to make Shabbat Hagadol something other than an actual Friday night-to-Saturday-night Sabbath is what we call bad fiction.

Scripture says otherwise. It mentions a High Day which is also called a Sabbath.
You can call it what you like , the Word of God is enough for me.

 

[Harmonious]

Scripture says otherwise. It mentions a High Day which is also called a Sabbath.
You can call it what you like , the Word of God is enough for me.

It should be - if you understood what it said.

Having actually celebrated Shabbat Hagadol and Passover, and other Shabbatot, I know what I'm talking about. And you, sir, don't know what you are reading if you've come to any other conclusion.

 

[Beta]

Fallingblood , you make some interesting points re christianity.
But the facts are that both Judaism and christianity have a lot of things wrong that Christ will address when he returns. :yes:

 

[Beta]

It should be - if you understood what it said.

Having actually celebrated Shabbat Hagadol and Passover, and other Shabbatot, I know what I'm talking about. And you, sir, don't know what you are reading if you've come to any other conclusion.

And I (madam) also observe the Sabbath and Feasts of the Lord including Passover and know something of what I talk of.