What Did Jesus Actually Do?

[sojourner]

Nope, fact
Any good fiction will contain some factual information, in the case of the bible any historically accurate writing is incidental, i.e, towns that existed, some ancillary names that have verified 3rd party evidence to show they existed. There is no historical validation for either of the 2 main characters, the two your FAITH is based on

If there were historical evidence then you would have no need for faith

biblical scholars would disagree with you. The Gospels are not works of fiction; they're works of Gospel. "Gospel" and "fiction" are two distinct literary genres.

 

[Spartan]

As per usual, you're going by what you think the scriptures say. However, what you think and what is are possibly two different things.

You're not very believable.

 

[sojourner]

You're not very believable.

I don’t doubt it in your case. You’re extremely entrenched in one POV.

 

[Spartan]

I don’t doubt it in your case. You’re extremely entrenched in one POV.

Yep, it's called the truth. You don't move on from that.

 

[sojourner]

Yep, it's called the truth. You don't move on from that.

Again: an extremely narrow vision of truth. Truth is much broader than you give it credit for.

Edit: hence why you think you know precisely what the Bible says, even though there are other interpretations that are just as valid, and possibly better than the limited swath you provide for.

 

[Thief]

narrow is the gate.....and only a few find their way to it

so I've heard

 

[Spartan]

Again: an extremely narrow vision of truth. Truth is much broader than you give it credit for.

Edit: hence why you think you know precisely what the Bible says, even though there are other interpretations that are just as valid, and possibly better than the limited swath you provide for.

Truth is the narrow version. And as Jesus noted, broad is the path that leads to destruction.

 

[ChristineM]

I'll challenge you on your "fictional" books (New Testament) claim. You throw around the word fictional as if you have some solid examples to back up your rhetoric.

So, show me your BEST ONE EXAMPLE (1 - JUST ONE) of a fictitious person, place, or event in the GOSPELS. Cite the pertinent scripture(s) and make your argument (provide your evidence why it's fictional).

Let's see that bad boy.

I have already been here and showed that at least 2 of the authors you quote do not consider evidence,do not have evidence to consider and work using much confirmation bias. Unlike some i am not in the habit of repeating myself because you cannot be bothered with my posts. No doubt because they challenge your confirmation bias.

 

[ChristineM]

Correction: you believe that. You can't "know" it because you have no evidence of that.

No correction required.

Seems that its ok for religion to claim they know their god exists without any evidence but faith but not atheists...

However, the evidence i use is far stronger than 'do-h, i dont know so god"

First. In around 10,000 years of god worship not one of literally billions of people have provided any evidence of god. To me that makes gods the most unproven concept ever and on its own is good enough for me.

Then we get into specifics.

What creator god would create a race of people to worship him and also create mosquitoes (etc) to kill his premier invention?

What caring god would create disease such as childhood leukemia to inflict intense and painful suffering on the child. Dont forget what the childs parents also go through.

What beneficent god would allow suffering, poverty and starvation?

How about prayer


I know of 28 hypothesis on how the universe was created, all are born out either mathematically or by observing effects in our own universe. Not one requires a god.

There is much more but i reckon that will do for now

 

[ChristineM]

biblical scholars would disagree with you. The Gospels are not works of fiction; they're works of Gospel. "Gospel" and "fiction" are two distinct literary genres.

Evidence?

 

[sojourner]

Truth is the narrow version. And as Jesus noted, broad is the path that leads to destruction.

Jesus wasn’t talking about how we view truth. Please stop torturing the texts.

 

[sojourner]

No correction required.

Seems that its ok for religion to claim they know their god exists without any evidence but faith but not atheists...

However, the evidence i use is far stronger than 'do-h, i dont know so god"

First. In around 10,000 years of god worship not one of literally billions of people have provided any evidence of god. To me that makes gods the most unproven concept ever and on its own is good enough for me.

Then we get into specifics.

What creator god would create a race of people to worship him and also create mosquitoes (etc) to kill his premier invention?

What caring god would create disease such as childhood leukemia to inflict intense and painful suffering on the child. Dont forget what the childs parents also go through.

What beneficent god would allow suffering, poverty and starvation?

How about prayer
View attachment 32249

I know of 28 hypothesis on how the universe was created, all are born out either mathematically or by observing effects in our own universe. Not one requires a god.

There is much more but i reckon that will do for now

An ant knows the universe doesn’t exist, too.

 

[sojourner]

Evidence?

Dear God!

Study. The. Texts.

 

[ChristineM]

An ant knows the universe doesn’t exist, too.

Have you asked one?

 

[ChristineM]

Dear God!

Study. The. Texts.

Evidence : the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.

So provide texts that meet these criteria and i i will (re)study them

 

[sojourner]

Have you asked one?

Not going to qualify that with an answer

 

[sojourner]

Evidence : the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.

So provide texts that meet these criteria and i i will (re)study them

If you are unable or unwilling to understand literary genre, there’s no helping you.

Scholars recognize the Gospel as a literary form of itself.

 

[ChristineM]

Not going to qualify that with an answer

You made the statement of knowledge, are you not willing to back up your claim? Or was it just a guess?

 

[ChristineM]

If you are unable or unwilling to understand literary genre, there’s no helping you.

Scholars recognize the Gospel as a literary form of itself.

That is fine,it does not say its truthful or honest. Just that its will written.

And if you wish to continue with failed sarcasm just because you cannot handle definition, then i think we are done here

 

[firedragon]

From a historical standpoint, what, in his own lifetime, did Jesus of Nazareth achieve? I am having trouble figuring this out, because I can see objectively that Muhammad had a huge impact upon not only his own society but others, all within his lifetime. That the impact was either good or bad is not my point here, but that had had one. Baha'u'llah had some direct impacts, if small, upon his society. In contrast, I can't think of anything Jesus did that no-one else could have done.

He was born, he preached, he was executed.

This is probably going to turn into an 'It was all Paul not Jesus' thread, but have at it anyway.

Well. Muhammed was a man from the Quraishi clan. Well known, powerful, with means. As we have heard that is. The prophet Muhammed was the only one as we know who was claiming to be Gods messenger. Persecution came from everywhere due to religious views and the turn of people.

Jesus was a handy-man. Poor, from a poor family. Son of a handy-man. There were many people claiming to be the messiah. Persecution came from the Roman occupation who were killing everyone who claimed to be the messiah. All rebels or as they called 'bandits'. Pilate was a blood thirsty governor who suppressed uprisings in the most cruel manner.

Being where they came from, Muhammed went further than Jesus in distance, but Jesus also rose in height if you understand what I mean.

They are both equal in my eye thinking of all of this. As people. Not according to my personal faith.