What Do Palestinians Want?

[Shusha]

Before we go too far down the "who owns the correct demographics" road, let's pause to remember what our goal here is. Its to create two independant, self-governing, self-determining States for two peoples, isn't it? Delegitimizing each other serves no purpose toward that goal. So let's just accept that yes, some of the populations have been there for a long time. Some were immigrants a few hundred years ago. Some were more recent immigrants. No one's rights are CHANGED by any of this. And even if they were, the unscrambling of the egg at this point is not possible. Can we focus on solutions instead of justifications?

 

[Shusha]

It seems that you're among the sons of Judah whom were known to be righteous
compared to the sons of Israel...

Am I the only one who has a problem with this?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

No one's rights are CHANGED by any of this.

What an incredibly stupid statement. The occupation is precisely a denial of rights justified, in part, on a denial of the Nakba and a feel-good framing of the 67 War.

 

[FearGod]

Am I the only one who has a problem with this?

Jews were divided among themselves, sons of Judah were known as the righteous and the
wicked ones were the sons of Israel whom we think that they're lost but no they aren't.

 

[rosends]

Jews were divided among themselves, sons of Judah were known as the righteous and the
wicked ones were the sons of Israel whom we think that they're lost but no they aren't.

There was a civil war and two kingdoms were established in the land of Israel. One was the kingdom of Israel, and one was the kingdom of Judah. I'm not sure why this is relevant.

 

[FearGod]

There was a civil war and two kingdoms were established in the land of Israel. One was the kingdom of Israel, and one was the kingdom of Judah. I'm not sure why this is relevant.

Are you saying the land of Israel , so clearly you're among the sons of Israel and not the sons of Judah.

 

[Shusha]

What an incredibly stupid statement. The occupation is precisely a denial of rights justified, in part, on a denial of the Nakba and a feel-good framing of the 67 War.

Only if you deny Jewish rights.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

There was a civil war and two kingdoms were established in the land of Israel. One was the kingdom of Israel, and one was the kingdom of Judah. I'm not sure why this is relevant.

Right. (Actually, there were two schisms, with the 'history' of both being written by the Davidniks and their successors.)

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Only if you deny Jewish rights.

Out of curiosity, have you ever been to Israel? ... to the "West Bank"?

 

[Flankerl]

There was a civil war and two kingdoms were established in the land of Israel. One was the kingdom of Israel, and one was the kingdom of Judah. I'm not sure why this is relevant.

Let me guess: Zionists are descendants of the Kingdom of Israel while anti-Zionist Jews who are perfectly fine to live under their Muslim Masters are descendants of the Kingdom of Judah.

Same **** as every day.

Are you saying the land of Israel , so clearly you're among the sons of Israel and not the sons of Judah.

Suddenly reality
1050 BCE–930 BCE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Israel_(united_monarchy)
930 BCE–720 BCE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Israel_(Samaria)

*gasp*

 

[FearGod]

Let me guess: Zionists are descendants of the Kingdom of Israel while anti-Zionist Jews who are perfectly fine to live under their Muslim Masters are descendants of the Kingdom of Judah.

Same **** as every day.





Suddenly reality
1050 BCE–930 BCE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Israel_(united_monarchy)
930 BCE–720 BCE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Israel_(Samaria)

*gasp*

The sons of Israel and the sons of Judah were enemies, the sons of Judah were the good ones
whereas the sons of Israel were the bad ones
Choosing today the name Israel tells it all.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

From Haaretx; Revisiting the UN Partition Plan: is it still relevant? ...

The Arabs’ opposition to the realization of the UN Partition Resolution, as reflected in their attacks on Jewish settlements and the roads that connected them, gradually led to the removal of the plan from the agenda of the Zionist leadership. Every so often, reference was made to it and to the boundaries of the designated Jewish state, but nearly always this reference was accompanied by some mention of the territories beyond the borders.

“There were 279 Jewish settlements in Palestine on 29 November 1947,” writes Benny Morris in his book “Birth of the Palestinian Refugee Problem: 1947-1949” (Cambridge Middle East Library). “Between the start of Arab-Jewish hostilities the following day and the beginning of March 1949, 53 new Jewish settlements were established, followed by about 80 more by the end of August 1949. Almost all of these were established on Arab-owned lands, and dozens of them were established on territory earmarked in the UN partition resolution for the Palestine Arab state. [emphasis added - JS]

“The partition resolution, only reluctantly accepted by the Yishuv’s leaders, left outside the Jewish state-to-be clusters of Jewish settlements – the Etzion Bloc, the settlements in Western and Upper Galilee and several settlements north and east of Jerusalem – and forbade, at least for a transition period, Jewish settlement in the areas earmarked for the Palestine Arab state,” the historian writes.​

 

[Flankerl]

The sons of Israel and the sons of Judah were enemies, the sons of Judah were the good ones
whereas the sons of Israel were the bad ones
Choosing today the name Israel tells it all.

Too bad that you logic is stupid as the Kingdom of Saul, David and Solomon was named Israel as is the land itself.

But hey whatever fits your narrative huh?

 

[columbus]

The sons of Israel and the sons of Judah were enemies, the sons of Judah were the good ones
whereas the sons of Israel were the bad ones
Choosing today the name Israel tells it all.

No.
Neither 3000 year old history nor the name Zionists put on their state "tells it all". It doesn't even matter.
Zionists built something good in a desolate place. The Palestinians haven't, they've been too focused on fighting.
They've both had six decades and the results are in. Zionism is morally superior to Islamism. That is why Israel is so much better than Palestine.
Tom

 

[rosends]

Are you saying the land of Israel , so clearly you're among the sons of Israel and not the sons of Judah.

I don't know what you are talking about. There were two kingdoms in the land of Israel, northern one and a southern one. One was made up of about 10 tribes and the other was made up of about 2 tribes. The kingdom of Israel was defeated and exiled. I still don't see your point. I am descended from the kingdom of Judah.

 

[Shusha]

I don't know what you are talking about. There were two kingdoms in the land of Israel, northern one and a southern one. One was made up of about 10 tribes and the other was made up of about 2 tribes. The kingdom of Israel was defeated and exiled. I still don't see your point. I am descended from the kingdom of Judah.

He's not trying to present facts, or even an acceptable narrative of facts. He's just trying to justify the labeling of Israel and Jews as "evil".

 

[RocketJSquirell]

Am I the only one who has a problem with this?

Susha, I have a problem with it, but only because it is ignorant hate speech. Other than that it is fine. ;-)

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

And then

A Muslim Cleric: There Was NEVER A "Palestinian People"



I do, but only because t is ignorant hate speech. Other than that, it is fine. ;-)

And Trump has found some folks who saw Muslims dancing on 9/11. That a zealot can find anecdotal justification should surprise no one.

 

[FearGod]

I don't know what you are talking about. There were two kingdoms in the land of Israel, northern one and a southern one. One was made up of about 10 tribes and the other was made up of about 2 tribes. The kingdom of Israel was defeated and exiled. I still don't see your point. I am descended from the kingdom of Judah.

Judah was the name of the kingdom and the other tribes whom were known as Israelis living in the northern part
were lost or no one knows were they've gone, so rationally saying that Judah and his sons stayed in the region in the
kingdom of Judah.

Since Israel belong to the 10 or 11 tribes whom were lost then who bring back the name Israel
and not Judah to existence.

 

[columbus]

Since Israel belong to the 10 or 11 tribes whom were lost then who bring back the name Israel
and not Judah to existence.

"Palestinian" is the modern form of the name of the pagan invaders from the same time frame. Should that mean something about the current people going by the name?
Tom