What do you call it when a sitting President tries to extend their term in office through illegitimate means?

[Wandering Monk]

Mussolini also had support from the army, didn't he? The army probably didn't oppose him because they agreed with him.

It was similar with Hitler. The army could have stopped him early on if they wanted to, but as long as Hitler got rid of Ernst Rohm, the army was with him all the way - to the bitter end.

The U.S. military is similar to the permanent bureaucracy where they see Presidents come and go. As J. Edgar Hoover once put it, "They're just visitors to Washington. I'm a resident." They also take an oath to the Constitution, not to any President, King, Il Duce, or Fuhrer. They're not about to go along with any coup or install anyone as President For Life. And they wouldn't allow any kind of disorganized mob of fools to do it either.

Even if it's not all out of loyalty to the Constitution, the fact is, the military itself benefits from the current system as it stands. They have no reason to change it, and you can rest assured that they will defend it with all of the resources and manpower at their disposal.

In the case of Italy and Germany, both Mussolini and Hitler were fascist militarists - and in both countries, their militaries were small and somewhat neglected. Hitler promised to rearm the military, make them strong and powerful again - that would certainly be something their military leadership would want.

But in the U.S., the military already has everything they could possibly want under the present system and Constitution. The U.S. government pays the military a pretty penny to keep them happy, and they are armed to the teeth and proud of a long tradition of being the best fighting force in the world. They may be somewhat militaristic, and some may be warmongers. But that doesn't mean they would support a fascist dictatorship. If anything, they would be more subtle about it, using a bit more finesse. It would still have the same appearance and trappings of a liberal democracy, and the public would likely not even be aware that anything is different.

And let's not forget Generalisimo Franco in Spain. His war against the communists in Spain was supported by the church.

 

[blü 2]

If that is how you think a government can effectively be taken over you are sadly mistaken.

No, I'm sadly correct. Successful coups have a long history, as do failed coups. And see @Soandso's post #60 above.

 

[SkepticThinker]

But to prosecute the war for eternity may be interpreted as an expedient to remain president forever.

Has Russia surrendered or something?
You say the above as though Zelensky invaded another country and not the other way around.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Because he was the first person to pop into my head and so I responded to Estro. @Revoltingest

I guess we're all left wondering why he popped into your head then, since you don't seem to know either.

 

[Kathryn]

I guess we're all left wondering why he popped into your head then, since you don't seem to know either

Oh, I know why he popped into my head, though I doubt I owe you an explanation. I think it was several days ago, or at least it feels like it was.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Is there a word for that? Do you know what that is?

Yes, I do, and I've posted on it in the past, but it's worth mentioning again. From (source)

"You don't like that word [coup], do you? But it's accurate, although a more complete description would be failed self-coup. A coup is attempted by an out-party. If Trump were to try to seize the government today as a private citizen, it would be an attempted coup. But when the sitting head of state attempts to hold power, it becomes a self-coup."

A coup is not what took place in 2020.

Agreed. As noted immediately above, failed self-coup is the better description.

if it makes you happy to call it a coup like some silly others here, I'd say knock yourself out and enjoy yourself.

Failed self-coup. Apparently, you didn't learn when I corrected you in that other thread. That comment quoted above was posted to you.

Got any examples of any self coups?

Here, let me Google that for you: Examples Of Self-coups

I know why he popped into my head, though I doubt I owe you an explanation.

She didn't ask for an explanation. I don't recall anybody asking you. She was wondering what popped in your head, and probably why you posted a free association involving somebody who has nothing to do with any kind of coup, but never asked you why.

I won't ask, either. You've already explained elsewhere earlier today your aversion to reading and thinking and how little you care about ideas, so it would be unkind to trouble you with a question, and probably not helpful to read your answer.

 

[wellwisher]

Is there a word for that? Do you know what that is? I will give you a hint.

It rhymes with poo.

Spoiler

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!

www.dictionary.com

I was just reminded that some people on this board still don't know what a coup is. Even after nearly 4 years they still have not take the few seconds it would take to educate themselves.

So make no mistake. What Donald Trump did after the 2020 election was a self-coup, and auto-coup. that is what it was. There is no ambiguity. This is the dictionary definition. Trump tried to stay in office by declaring that the legitimate democratic election of his opponent was not legitimate. That is a coup.

Maybe it is not what you imagined it was, but that is the reality of what a coup is, and it is the reality of what Trump did

Do you mean like the Russian Collusion Coup. That was where a large coordinated conspiracy tried to back stab duly elected President Trump, like they did to duly nominated President Biden, and void the will of the voters. But Trump was too strong and too clean and endured the first waves, until the coup fell apart. All of fake news was in on the conspiracy. It was an army of conspirators against one. Even some Republicans got caught up in the early CIA hype and disinformation campaign.

Biden was not that clean; international influence peddling, which is why he could not dig in and fight even a smaller strike force. I am still not sure why Trump, did not go after all the top level conspirators in the DNC, who ran the coup several years. The Swamp was too entrenched back then and the criminals circled the wagon and protected each other. But this time they are running scared, since Trump will be better prepared and may need to nuke them first, since they will keep trying until nuked. Their addition of law fare has taken it to a new level of scum bag. This may be why they recruited Walz, since he did law fare to the citizens in his own state, during COVID.

If you have watched the DNC Convention, do you see the amount of security that the Democrats splurged on themselves at the DNC convention? There is National Guard, State Police, City Police from Chicago as well as a few other cities, Secret Service, etc. There are at least eight checks points to get into the Convention Hall plus ID is required, unlike voting.

How come during the Jan 6 Washington DC Protest and Riots, Pelosi and DNC did not have any real security for the Capital? Pelosi and the Mayor of Washington DC were both offered National Guard troops days in advance to be safe. Was that neglect or by design? The security that Trump was offered, when he was shot, was another accident just waiting to happen. Was Jan 6, a similar accident waiting to happen, with just a little push.

At least on Jan 6, not a single corrupt politician was injured. It funny how that worked out. I would assume if that riot had been a coup, with such minimal security in place, they should have been able make it a lot worse, and get what they wanted. Who runs an unprepared coup. It was not even in the same league as the Russian Collusion Coup, who had Trump under siege, with an army for two years. Why were the people who ran the Russian Collusion Coup allowed to be judge and jury for Jan 6?

There were way more people marching on Washington, on Jan 6, than the Palestinian Protesters on Aug 22. Why does the DNC give themself the VIP treatment but does not offer that to all? It would nice if they gave that much effort to the border and instead just to themselves. More people would benefit if they were less self serving.

 

[Kathryn]

She didn't ask for an explanation. I don't recall anybody asking you. She was wondering what popped in your head, and probably why you posted a free association involving somebody who has nothing to do with any kind of coup, but never asked you why.

I won't ask, either. You've already explained elsewhere earlier today your aversion to reading and thinking and how little you care about ideas, so it would be unkind to trouble you with a question, and probably not helpful to read your answer.

I didn't explain elsewhere earlier today my aversion to reading and thinking, or how little I care for ideas. I explained that the situation/post was several days old.

So I wasn't going to look up sources again.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Yes, I do, and I've posted on it in the past, but it's worth mentioning again. From (source)

"You don't like that word [coup], do you? But it's accurate, although a more complete description would be failed self-coup. A coup is attempted by an out-party. If Trump were to try to seize the government today as a private citizen, it would be an attempted coup. But when the sitting head of state attempts to hold power, it becomes a self-coup."

Agreed. As noted immediately above, failed self-coup is the better description.

Failed self-coup. Apparently, you didn't learn when I corrected you in that other thread. That comment quoted above was posted to you.

Here, let me Google that for you: Examples Of Self-coups

She didn't ask for an explanation. I don't recall anybody asking you. She was wondering what popped in your head, and probably why you posted a free association involving somebody who has nothing to do with any kind of coup, but never asked you why.

I won't ask, either. You've already explained elsewhere earlier today your aversion to reading and thinking and how little you care about ideas, so it would be unkind to trouble you with a question, and probably not helpful to read your answer.

There is no such thing as a self coup. Even your link to 'examples of self coups' are just not there. It's just a Google search window.

All coups require a notable enforcing authority that is compliant and loyal.

 

[Twilight Hue]

No, I'm sadly correct. Successful coups have a long history, as do failed coups. And see @Soandso's post #60 above.

No you are sadly mistaken. You still require an enforcing body that is loyal and capable and strong enough to effectively take a government over.

Sorry to disappoint your fantasy there.

 

[Betho_br]

Every autocracy is a counter-coup...

 

[Soandso]

There is no such thing as a self coup. Even your link to 'examples of self coups' are just not there. It's just a Google search window.

All coups require a notable enforcing authority that is compliant and loyal.

Willful ignorance

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!

www.dictionary.com

a coup d'état performed by the current, legitimate government or a duly elected head of state to retain or extend control over government, through an additional term, an extension of term, an expansion of executive power, the dismantling of other government branches, or the declaration that an election won by an opponent is illegitimate.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Willful ignorance

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!

www.dictionary.com

a coup d'état performed by the current, legitimate government or a duly elected head of state to retain or extend control over government, through an additional term, an extension of term, an expansion of executive power, the dismantling of other government branches, or the declaration that an election won by an opponent is illegitimate.

Willful ignorance of the facts.

It still requires cooperation of a backing authority capable of controlling a population.

 

[blü 2]

No you are sadly mistaken. You still require an enforcing body that is loyal and capable and strong enough to effectively take a government over.

Sorry to disappoint your fantasy there.

You seem not to understand the centrality of the "illegality" part.

And it further seems you didn't take the tip and pay attention to @Soandso's post #60 above.

 

[fantome profane]

Do you mean like the Russian Collusion Coup. That was where a large coordinated conspiracy tried to back stab duly elected President Trump, like they did to duly nominated President Biden, and void the will of the voters. But Trump was too strong and too clean and endured the first waves, until the coup fell apart. All of fake news was in on the conspiracy. It was an army of conspirators against one. Even some Republicans got caught up in the early CIA hype and disinformation campaign.

Biden was not that clean; international influence peddling, which is why he could not dig in and fight even a smaller strike force. I am still not sure why Trump, did not go after all the top level conspirators in the DNC, who ran the coup several years. The Swamp was too entrenched back then and the criminals circled the wagon and protected each other. But this time they are running scared, since Trump will be better prepared and may need to nuke them first, since they will keep trying until nuked. Their addition of law fare has taken it to a new level of scum bag. This may be why they recruited Walz, since he did law fare to the citizens in his own state, during COVID.

If you have watched the DNC Convention, do you see the amount of security that the Democrats splurged on themselves at the DNC convention? There is National Guard, State Police, City Police from Chicago as well as a few other cities, Secret Service, etc. There are at least eight checks points to get into the Convention Hall plus ID is required, unlike voting.

How come during the Jan 6 Washington DC Protest and Riots, Pelosi and DNC did not have any real security for the Capital? Pelosi and the Mayor of Washington DC were both offered National Guard troops days in advance to be safe. Was that neglect or by design? The security that Trump was offered, when he was shot, was another accident just waiting to happen. Was Jan 6, a similar accident waiting to happen, with just a little push.

At least on Jan 6, not a single corrupt politician was injured. It funny how that worked out. I would assume if that riot had been a coup, with such minimal security in place, they should have been able make it a lot worse, and get what they wanted. Who runs an unprepared coup. It was not even in the same league as the Russian Collusion Coup, who had Trump under siege, with an army for two years. Why were the people who ran the Russian Collusion Coup allowed to be judge and jury for Jan 6?

There were way more people marching on Washington, on Jan 6, than the Palestinian Protesters on Aug 22. Why does the DNC give themself the VIP treatment but does not offer that to all? It would nice if they gave that much effort to the border and instead just to themselves. More people would benefit if they were less self serving.

I don't read your posts. Just so you know. I didn't read this one. You can save your time.

 

[Soandso]

Willful ignorance of the facts.

It still requires cooperation of a backing authority capable of controlling a population.

It's not my job to make you cognisant of whether or not things actually exist. If you aren't willing to do the work and educate yourself, that's on you

 

[Subduction Zone]

Willful ignorance of the facts.

It still requires cooperation of a backing authority capable of controlling a population.

Now you are changing the argument after you were shown to be wrong. Also no one claimed that Trump succeeded. It was a failed attempted self coup. If had had succeeded then it would have been a self coup. Please note how many people have pointed out that much to your disappointment Trump failed.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Now you are changing the argument after you were shown to be wrong. Also no one claimed that Trump succeeded. It was a failed attempted self coup. If had had succeeded then it would have been a self coup. Please note how many people have pointed out that much to your disappointment Trump failed.

It was an insurrection, not a coup. Lol.

 

[Twilight Hue]

It's not my job to make you cognisant of whether or not things actually exist. If you aren't willing to do the work and educate yourself, that's on you

I'm more than educated unlike others who like to think a guy dressed like a Shaman , another with a stolen laptop , admist other yahoos are capable of overthrowing an entire government.

That coup fantasy is all theirs.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It was an insurrection, not a coup. Lol.

Attempted coup. And there is no reason that it could not be both. Do you think that those two are contradictory?