What does God want from you?

Trailblazer · Aug 2, 2023

URAVIP2ME said:
I don't believe that dead people turn into angels, but that does Not mean there is no angelic life.

Some people who die will become angels in heaven, but other people who die will just go to the spiritual world and take on a form that best befits their station.

osgart · Aug 2, 2023

Trailblazer said:
You are a Baha'i, you just don't know it.

I wish God was real. I always have. I sometimes hope it. Reality doesn't allow me to believe. The God I hope for isn't found in bibles and religions.

The older I get the more it sounds wonderful. I can't ignore reality though.

Trailblazer · Aug 3, 2023

osgart said:
I wish God was real. I always have. I sometimes hope it. Reality doesn't allow me to believe. The God I hope for isn't found in bibles and religions.

The older I get the more it sounds wonderful. I can't ignore reality though.

I know God is real, of that I have no doubt, but God might not be exactly what is depicted in bibles or religions.

I struggle with some of the same things that you struggle with. How can there be a loving God given all the suffering I see in the world, but I also think that I could be wrong about the suffering and what it means. There could be cognitive distortions so God's love may not be what I expect it to be. I will probably struggle with this till the day I die, but I don't need to believe that God is loving in order to believe God exists

TagliatelliMonster · Aug 3, 2023

Trailblazer said:
It would seem that way since nobody can see God sustaining it.

Just like nobody can see the undetectable dragon that follows me everywhere I go.

The undetectable and the non-existant, look very much alike.

Trailblazer · Aug 3, 2023

TagliatelliMonster said:
The undetectable and the non-existant, look very much alike.

but they aren't always alike. Some undetectable things exist and remain undetectable.
God does not want to be detected and that is why God remains undetectable.

Bird123 · Aug 3, 2023

chinu said:
OP asks the question: What does God want from you ?
Now taking your above reply into consideration, if I answer: God want you to teach.

What do you think ? is this the correct answer for this ?

How about God wants you to have free choices? Don't want to teach then don't. On the other hand, hasn't everyone taught others something at some time?

I have a friend who just became a grandpa. Do you really think he would not share at least some of the wisdom he has acquired over time? Think Higher Level at the highest point where Unconditional Love has been completely understood. Unconditional Love always does what is best for the other. Do you really think there will come a time when there are no longer others? No others, really? Just create more. It's so simple. It's Limitless. It's Eternal.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Bird123 · Aug 3, 2023

Messianic Israelite said:
Hi Bird123. Good afternoon. You ask if this is an intelligent way of doing things. Psychologists have ascertained that the best way to teach a person in the right way is to give people rewards for doing the right thing, while punishments for doing the wrong thing. This is Yahweh's system and it works. Those who do not wish to adhere to Yahweh will simply receive punishments both in this life and eternal death to follow. However, Yahweh's way is that righteousness is not necessarily rewarded straight away. As a matter of fact, righteous people will not see a full reward for their righteousness until the end of their lives. This fosters patience, and faith, which again is a necessary ingredient for Yahweh's people if they want to be in the Kingdom and be used by Yahweh for future plans.

Yahweh doesn't play favorites as you have indicated. As a matter of fact, Yahweh is not a respecter of persons (Acts 10:34 and Romans 2:11-16). Yahweh has respect to those that fear Him (Psalm 147:10-11).

If we are fully obedient in keeping the commandments of Yahweh, we can learn life-long lessons that will last us for eternity. Lessons that cannot simply be taught except by experiencing and doing the commandments. No not everyone will make it to the Kingdom. Yahshua our Savior said specifically to enter in the narrow gate, for wide is the path and broad is the way that leads to destruction (Matthew 7:13-14). I think this is your problem. You've actually diminished from Yahweh by not thinking about justice. Justice means that wicked people will perish and righteous people will be rewarded. Yahweh is an Elohim of justice (Deuteronomy 32:4). That's why we love Him so much.

You said take your best people and put them in a heavenly state and they won't last 10 minutes. Interesting thought. We are living a heavenly life every day while we are keeping the commandments of Yahweh. Keeping the commandments of Yahweh has a purifying effect on us and this allows us to be heavenly. The Kingdom of Yahweh will be a heavenly Kingdom on this earth, operated by heavenly beings, including those who have proven themselves in this life i.e. the saints. Take righteous people out of this world and they will last in an heavenly environment. However, the wicked will not (Isaiah 26:10). So I disagree with you on that one.

You refer to a time-based casual universe as being more appropriate for learning than this one. Actually, I disagree. You say actions should be returned to us. This is the system that is already in place. Isaiah 3:10 explains this. However, one of the problems that several of the writers of the Hebrew Scriptures write about is, Why do the wicked prosper? (see Job 21:7-17) Sometimes, wicked people do not receive the just reward for their actions in this life. Sometimes that evil is passed on to their children. However, Psalm 73:16-19 tells us that the wicked do not have it good. They are set in slippery places. They could fall and shatter at any time and that will be the end of them. It's a curiosity that Yahweh doesn't judge the wicked right away, but the scriptures also teach that Yahweh is long suffering towards all (2 Peter 3:9). You refer to a non-time based physical body. Yahweh will not give such a body to people who have not proven themselves and this I think is the most logical thing to do. Look what happened to Satan and he has become the most evil Being this earth has ever known.

With the system you propose you say "With this system, there is no need for Judging, Hating, Condemning, Anger, Wrath, Intimidating, Coercing, Manipulating, Controlling, Ruling, We against they, Good or Evil and all those petty things mankind holds so dear. Take all that garbage out and it leaves High Intelligence at a Higher Level, Unconditional Love." Sorry, how is justice and righteousness garbage? The Bible tells us that "Righteousness and justice are the foundation of thy throne" in Psalm 89:14. You also void out emotions like anger. Would you prefer us to be mindless, emotionless, apathetic beings with no interest whatsoever in life. Good and evil will always exist, just as light and darkness. You cannot remove the one, or the other. Those who refuse to do good are evil, and those who refuse to do evil are good. This idea that all a Creator would be required to show in your system is "unconditional love" is in my opinion quite absurd. Reciprocity is important in Yahweh's Covenant. It means Yahweh will bless if we keep our terms of the Covenant. Look what they did to Yahshua the Messiah. Yahshua was a very loving individual and they killed him, just as they killed the righteous prophets down through history. If it was just a case of showing unconditional love, wicked people would take advantage of this, using it as a weakness and do all kinds of evil resulting in much misery, harm and ill will, not just adversely affecting themselves but also those around them.

What are your results? If you simply reward, people will learn no more than how to get a reward. As soon as the reward is gone they will go back and choose the opposite just to Discover the other side. At some point if they deem the reward not good enough, they will be gone as well. On the other hand, if one learns through living those lessons, Intelligence will choose the best choices. There has never ever been a need for God to define good or evil. Each will decide for themselves.

Those who are punished will learn to hate, seek any revenge possible, hurt others as payback for being slighted. Is this really what you want to teach your children? Why would God be so helpless not to fix all His children or be so hateful not to?

What is more important, Justice or fixing the problem? What is more important, Punishment or fixing the problem? What is more important, payback or fixing the problem?
Until the problem is fixed it will never go away.

What does Righteousness create? We against they? An excuse to hate? What do these things teach? Goodness? Not on your life.

By teaching all children through their free choices and interaction with others, it is a WE only. This eliminates the excuse to Hate or even be jealous. When everyone reaches the point of understanding and wisdom to make the best choices, won't everyone be so-called righteous? Why would you deny anybody Heaven? Why would you want to? What does that say about you? If God would deny, what would that say about God? That is not a Higher Level. It is petty.

If you attempt to alter the actions of others through pain, anger, wrath, hate, intimidation, threats , manipulation or coercion, what are you teaching the children? Don't these things just generate anything but the best answers and a Heavenly state? Do you want to teach your children this is the way to get results?

You say God isn't playing favorites through the system you describe, however by allowing a select few over others Heaven, that is exactly what you describe. What would God be teaching those children then? It certainly isn't goodness. It certainly isn't a Higher Level!

We all have the power to choose what we deem important. People will choose to value those petty things mankind holds so dear until they understand all sides. At this point, those petty things will no longer be a viable choice one could make. Why not? It would not be Intelligent to do because one has already learned they will not bring the best results.

You speak of judging people good or evil. In a multilevel classroom, one will see others learning lessons one has already learned. Is this the time to Hate, Judge, Condemn, Wrath, Angry, Threaten, Intimidate through pain? Heavens no!!! It's the time to work at Fixing the real problem instead generating more of those petty things mankind holds so dear. It is the true path to a Heavenly state.

For those of us who must watch others learning lessons one has already learned, it is a reminder of what those best answers really are.

It doesn't matter what everyone else does. It's what each person chooses to do that counts.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

TagliatelliMonster · Aug 4, 2023

Trailblazer said:
but they aren't always alike.

Except that they are.
What is the difference between a ball that doesn't exist and a ball without detectable manifestation?

Trailblazer said:
Some undetectable things exist and remain undetectable.

And have the exact same role / impact / function as things that don't exist.

Trailblazer said:
God does not want to be detected and that is why God remains undetectable.

Just like my undetectable dragon and the undetectable pink graviton fairies who regulate gravity.

CG Didymus · Aug 4, 2023

osgart said:
I wish God was real. I always have. I sometimes hope it. Reality doesn't allow me to believe. The God I hope for isn't found in bibles and religions.

The older I get the more it sounds wonderful. I can't ignore reality though.

Back 50 years, when I was around Baha'is, saying "They are Baha'is. They just don't know it", was used all the time to describe anybody that believed in the oneness of humanity, in the equality of men and woman and several other very general Baha'i beliefs. But then there is the details... The deeper beliefs of the Baha'i Faith.

For someone to believe in the generalities doesn't make them Baha'is. If the person accepts the whole thing, that Baha'u'llah is the return of Christ and of Buddha and of Krishna etc. and that his teachings are from God and will last for at least 1000 years... That there is only one God and that he has sent many manifestations throughout the years to all people and cultures the world over... then... a person is getting close to believing in the Baha'i Faith and is ready to take the next step in becoming a Baha'i.

But the deeper details of their beliefs are what's important. Not believing in a few of the basic beliefs. The basic beliefs, like the "Golden Rule" of treating others like you'd want them to treat you, can be found in any religion and in many cults. Like you say... the God you hope for isn't found in Bibles and in religion.

CG Didymus · Aug 4, 2023

TagliatelliMonster said:
Except that they are.
What is the difference between a ball that doesn't exist and a ball without detectable manifestation?

And have the exact same role / impact / function as things that don't exist.

Just like my undetectable dragon and the undetectable pink graviton fairies who regulate gravity.

Yes, like how did we all get here? Hmmm? Maybe an invisible thing created everything. But then who created that invisible thing? Hmmm? Maybe it always existed. Hmmm?

How did the world get so screwed up... with all the evil and suffering? Hmmm? Maybe an invisible creation of the invisible thing turned evil and tempted the first people on the Earth. Those people fell for the temptation and the Invisible Thing had to teach them a lesson for their disobedience. So, that Invisible, All-Knowing, All-Loving, Thing, cursed them and the Earth and all that was on the Earth. And that's how evil and suffering came about.

Hmmm? Is there any hope? Or is this how things will always be? Hmmm? The Just and Merciful Invisible Thing sent his Son, that looked human, but was really an embodiment of the Great and Almighty Invisible Thing, to die and save all the people that believed in his Son and in his Son's sacrifice will be forgiven of all their wrongdoings and any inherited screwed-upness that they inherited from those original humans that disobeyed Our True Lord and God, the Invisible Thing.

Then someone else came up with a different idea. Hmmm? No, no, this world is just an illusion. We keep coming back into human, or maybe animal bodies, until we get it right. Then we become free of this messed up world and get to live in a wonderful invisible world.

Then someone else says that no, that is wrong and just plain stupid. What the invisible thing really did was make lessor invisible things to control things like the wind, the seas, the rain and the sun. But we must do things to appease them and not let them get angry. So, what the invisible things need is things to be sacrificed to them. Hmmm? What would those invisible things accept as a sacrifice? Animals? Yeah. But would that be enough? Hmmm? Maybe people? Maybe virgins?

Yes, how many different things have people come up with to explain why things are the way they are? But why do most of them involve and "Invisible Thing"?

Muffled · Aug 4, 2023

lukethethird said:
What He really wants is a virgin.

I believe I have never heard Him say so to me or to others.

Muffled · Aug 4, 2023

Bird123 said:
OK. God creates the universe and God creates you. What does God want from you?

If you are an atheist, speculate. If God really exists and creates the universe and God creates you. What does God want from you?

Before you just give a quick answer, consider a Being capable of creating the universe and you has to be very very smart. Consider High Intellect with your answers. Make God's answer High Intellect.

I believe He wants me to believe that He loves me.

Muffled · Aug 4, 2023

JustGeorge said:
She/he/it doesn't know I exist.

I believe He does know every little thing about you past and future.

Trailblazer · Aug 4, 2023

CG Didymus said:
For someone to believe in the generalities doesn't make them Baha'is.

It does according to Abdu'l-Baha. I told @osgart he is a Baha'i because of what is in his heart and his good character.

When asked on one occasion: “What is a Bahá’í?” ‘Abdu’l-Bahá replied: “To be a Bahá’í simply means to love all the world; to love humanity and try to serve it; to work for universal peace and universal brotherhood.” On another occasion He defined a Bahá’í as “one endowed with all the perfections of man in activity.” In one of His London talks He said that a man may be a Bahá’í even if He has never heard the name of Bahá’u’lláh. He added:—

The man who lives the life according to the teachings of Bahá’u’lláh is already a Bahá’í. On the other hand, a man may call himself a Bahá’í for fifty years, and if he does not live the life he is not a Bahá’í. An ugly man may call himself handsome, but he
deceives no one, and a black man may call himself white, yet he deceives no one, not even himself. Bahá’u’lláh and the New Era, pp. 71-72

osgart · Aug 4, 2023

Trailblazer said:
It does according to Abdu'l-Baha. I told @osgart he is a Baha'i because of what is in his heart and his good character.

When asked on one occasion: “What is a Bahá’í?” ‘Abdu’l-Bahá replied: “To be a Bahá’í simply means to love all the world; to love humanity and try to serve it; to work for universal peace and universal brotherhood.” On another occasion He defined a Bahá’í as “one endowed with all the perfections of man in activity.” In one of His London talks He said that a man may be a Bahá’í even if He has never heard the name of Bahá’u’lláh. He added:—
The man who lives the life according to the teachings of Bahá’u’lláh is already a Bahá’í. On the other hand, a man may call himself a Bahá’í for fifty years, and if he does not live the life he is not a Bahá’í. An ugly man may call himself handsome, but he
deceives no one, and a black man may call himself white, yet he deceives no one, not even himself. Bahá’u’lláh and the New Era, pp. 71-72

I have a lot of trouble loving the world, and I don't serve all of humanity. Universal peace and brotherhood comes down to individuals and what they desire for themselves and others. I'm all for people getting what they deserve. When people get what they rightfully deserve good things happen and everybody benefits.

I don't think humanity is endowed with perfections. I see humanity struggles with an animal nature that's needy, and has many limitations.

When I write about virtues and truth I have the desire and conviction that those are the laws of living a worthwhile life. The laws themselves are perfect and there's always levels to climb so that it would take many lifetimes to reach supreme character. I'm not sure I can count that high.

I do have the desire for rightfulness and if I live an eternity I'd like to get to a place of perfect character. Otherwise I'm not signed up for living forever.

I mean if I could help make the world a better place I'd do that. It's always up to the individual as to what they become in life.

I don't see that earth will ever achieve an perfect unity. We are here today, gone tomorrow, and there are no guarantees that life is forever. Nature itself is indifferent to the causes of justice and life.

Trailblazer · Aug 4, 2023

osgart said:
I have a lot of trouble loving the world, and I don't serve all of humanity.

I feel the same way about people and I am not one of those Bahais who serves all of humanity.

osgart said:
Universal peace and brotherhood comes down to individuals and what they desire for themselves and others. I'm all for people getting what they deserve. When people get what they rightfully deserve good things happen and everybody benefits.

I feel the same way.

osgart said:
I don't think humanity is endowed with perfections. I see humanity struggles with an animal nature that's needy, and has many limitations.

I agree. Humanity struggles against its animal nature and has many imperfections. There are only a numbered few saintly souls.

osgart said:
When I write about virtues and truth I have the desire and conviction that those are the laws of living a worthwhile life. The laws themselves are perfect and there's always levels to climb so that it would take many lifetimes to reach supreme character. I'm not sure I can count that high.

That is what is important, that you care about and strive towards virtues and truth and that you have the desire and conviction that those are the laws of living a worthwhile life, not that you are perfect. None of us are perfect, all we can do is strive. I don't think we achieve perfection in this life, but we will continue to advance towards perfection in the next life, for all of eternity.

“And now concerning thy question regarding the soul of man and its survival after death. Know thou of a truth that the soul, after its separation from the body, will continue to progress until it attaineth the presence of God, in a state and condition which neither the revolution of ages and centuries, nor the changes and chances of this world, can alter. It will endure as long as the Kingdom of God, His sovereignty, His dominion and power will endure. It will manifest the signs of God and His attributes, and will reveal His loving kindness and bounty.”

Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 155-156

What we can hope for is that when we die we are sanctified from the vain imaginings of the peoples of the world.

“Blessed is the soul which, at the hour of its separation from the body, is sanctified from the vain imaginings of the peoples of the world….”

Gleanings, p. 156

osgart said:
I do have the desire for rightfulness and if I live an eternity I'd like to get to a place of perfect character. Otherwise I'm not signed up for living forever.

That is what is important, a desire for rightfulness. We can only become more perfect as we continue to live. Nobody knows what the next life wil be like but I believe we will continue to progress.

osgart said:
I mean if I could help make the world a better place I'd do that. It's always up to the individual as to what they become in life.

I feel the same way. I would like to make the world a better place but I am very restricted by my own emotional issues so ther is only so much I can do. To those whom much is given much is expected, and vice versa. I try to use the abilities I have and that is all I can do. I also strive to do better, to rise above my feelings and good things can happen from that. Just yesterday I listened to and was kind to two people, and that is progress for me, since I normally keep to myself. I believe that being kind to others is the most important thing we can do.

1: O SON OF SPIRIT! My first counsel is this: Possess a pure, kindly and radiant heart, that thine may be a sovereignty ancient, imperishable and everlasting. The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 3

osgart said:
I don't see that earth will ever achieve an perfect unity. We are here today, gone tomorrow, and there are no guarantees that life is forever. Nature itself is indifferent to the causes of justice and life.

Well, I am the eternal optimist, so I believe that the earth will achieve unity someday, and I believe that since it is in the Baha'i Writings.

“God’s purpose is none other than to usher in, in ways He alone can bring about, and the full significance of which He alone can fathom, the Great, the Golden Age of a long-divided, a long-afflicted humanity. Its present state, indeed even its immediate future, is dark, distressingly dark. Its distant future, however, is radiant, gloriously radiant—so radiant that no eye can visualize it......

What we witness at the present time, during “this gravest crisis in the history of civilization,” recalling such times in which “religions have perished and are born,” is the adolescent stage in the slow and painful evolution of humanity, preparatory to the attainment of the stage of manhood, the stage of maturity, the promise of which is embedded in the teachings, and enshrined in the prophecies, of Bahá’u’lláh. The tumult of this age of transition is characteristic of the impetuosity and irrational instincts of youth, its follies, its prodigality, its pride, its self-assurance, its rebelliousness, and contempt of discipline.” The Promised Day is Come, pp. 116-117

What does God want from you?

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