What does God want from you?

[Bird123]

It can be, but in a good way. Evil comes usually from weakness of will, while goodness from power and might.

So you are saying that a person robbing a bank is weak willed? Is a person angry hurt and killing people weak willed? No way! They are making choices they think are best for themselves. There is so much that they do not Understand. God will teach them regardless of mankind's actions. When they Understand all sides, Intelligence will make these choices no longer viable to make.

Could you make these choices? Of course not, you have already learned those lessons. Is this a reason to Hate others Learning? Of course not, it's time to work at Fixing the problems.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Link]

So you are saying that a person robbing a bank is weak willed? Is a person angry hurt and killing people weak willed? No way! They are making choices they think are best for themselves. There is so much that they do not Understand. God will teach them regardless of mankind's actions. When they Understand all sides, Intelligence will make these choices no longer viable to make.

Could you make these choices? Of course not, you have already learned those lessons. Is this a reason to Hate others Learning? Of course not, it's time to work at Fixing the problems.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Injustice towards others is a sign of weakness. Lack of insight, weakness. Lack of resolve, weakness.

This is why in Islam we always say "there is no will nor power save by God"

Of course, you got to keep in mind, that dark magic and Iblis pushes towards evil, It may even pose as honorable or mighty, but it's weakness and cowardice to do injustice towards others.

 

[Link]

They are making choices they think are best for themselves.

It's out of weakness as Imam Sajjad (a) says:

My Allah, if You rise me up, who is there to push me down? If You push me down, who is there to raise me up? But I know that there is no wrong in Your decree and no hurry in Your vengeance. He alone hurries who fears to miss, and only the weak needs to wrong. But You are exalted, My Allah, high indeed above all that!

 

[Bird123]

God allows freedom of choice, but still sends guidance. He is not going to let humans manipulate others and watch it all happen with no guidance from him.

The lesson you keep speaking of, is not a lesson at all. Life is meaningless from your scenario. We should have all just been in paradise from start with no trial if what you say about God loving everyone equally and unconditionally is true.

The fact we are tried with good and evil, shows, that your philosophy does not make sense.

Who do you think sets up the parameters of people's lives? Did you set up the parameters or were you born into those parameters?

Wisdom is acquired along the journey to Discover knowledge. Unconditional Love always does what is Best for the other. God could implant all the knowledge in His children, however would they have the wisdom to make the best choices? Don't you Understand? Unconditional Love isn't about giving the other everything they want. It's about doing what is Best for them.

Isn't best making sure the wisdom is acquired in order to be able to create a Heavenly state for oneself and others? Do you really want your kids dependent or able to stand on their own two feet? Think! Which is the Best choice?

Now, you can say trial because our choices tell God and the world what we know and what we need to learn. It's easy to see the bank robber and killer need lessons. On the other hand, there is much to learn and many different levels. Everyone learns in life through their free choices.

Hey, Make good choices and learn those lessons. Those who do not learn the lesson are bound to repeat it. On the other hand, people can be stubborn and set in those ways. Sometimes it takes more than once. How many continue on valuing those petty things mankind holds so dear? How many keep finding excuses to Hate?

It has never ever been about do what I say or I will punish you. This is mankind's thinking.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Link]

@Bird123 let's not make it too complicated. Since you believe in God, those who ascend towards God and see him are the same as those who turn away and run away towards darkness and caprice? Do you truly believe they are equal and God will deal with them equally? What lesson do you get out of that?

By the way, there are doors towards God. Repenting is one. Craving him and wanting to taste him is another. Obeying him is another. Wanting to see him and recognize him another. People go to God different intentions, but any of those doors will lead to God.

If you hate the idea of authority and fear, then what prevents people from craving God and desiring his fountain? You see, whatever type you are, there is no excuse.

However, running away from God towards illusions of falsehood won't be accepted.

 

[Bird123]

What evil does Quran teach?

I have not read the entire Quran, however the parts that I did read were Threatening, Coercing, Manipulating. It tells that God will hurt you, punish you. God already knows your moves so you can escape. Doesn't it tell you to hurt nonbelievers. We are good. They are evil. The only way to get to God is through them. It values so many of the petty things mankind holds so dear. This proves it does not come from God simply because it does not reflect God and how God really is.

When the Quran uses and values these petty things, they are teaching others it is something to be used. This is not teaching goodness.

I have found no holy book that really Understands God at all. Religion is mankind's attempt to understand God. All religion are creations of mankind. That is who they reflect. Following mankind and beliefs can lead one no farther than the level they are at. This isn't God!!

Is there no goodness in holy books? There is some goodness in holy books. Words of Love, Kindness, and Helping others is something hard to mess up. Deep down, it is something we all know in our hearts. On the other hand goodness is not all what holy books are teaching. Sometimes, it 's easier for people to follow the ruling, controlling, manipulating and the we against they that seem to represent the power and might so many want. What is the old saying? Everybody wants to rule the world and some by any means.

Choose freely, however these are all lessons many choose to learn. It doesn't matter what anyone believes. God will, in time, teach everyone WHAT IS!!

Perhaps, you should start a new thread. How has the Quran hurt you and other people? Others could do the same with their holy books. Perhaps, another side will be seen.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Ella S.]

It is not I who has no evidence. It is you. You want the evidence served up like the beliefs you seek.

Yeah, that's generally what one expects from an argument or counter-argument during a debate.

 

[Link]

@Bird123 I see you are full of love and compassion. It's a good thing. Don't get me wrong. But every virtue is confined to it's limit.

Courage turns to recklessness if gone extreme for example.

In Quran, when Ibrahim (a) was given the good news from Angels he feared at first, he started arguing for people of Lut (a). I feel you are in this extreme, you want everyone forgiven. I've been there myself in the past.

Hate and vengeance never feel good. But they have a proper place.

The paradigm of Quran is that Satan would lead us astray without God's guidance and that we have to rely on God and his guidance or else we will rely on deceivers (sometimes it's the case they foremost deceive themselves). We can wish Satan is non-existent, that black magic does not blind people to the truth, etc, all of that won't make the reality change for what it is.

Getting use to God's vengeance was not easy for me, but once you become familiar with it, it's not so bad, you even begin to admire it. It's hard I know because of empathy towards people.

Today is my last day here for a while, school starts tomorrow. I wish you good luck and it was pleasant talking to you @Bird123 !

Universal unconditional love is unfortunately injustice towards good people and their oppressors. Empathy towards oppressed will make you see what I mean.

 

[AnthonyGiarrusso]

God wants you to follow his orders, which there are many. God's primary reason for artificially creating the human race was to have premium selection of afterlife to be sent to paradise and to send the standard afterlife back to Earth and avoid hell. That is what God told me in an interview.

 

[Bird123]

That's exactly what I'm trying to tell you.

But you're very quick to defend your eyes-shut position. You can't even see that you have no effective definition of truth, no meaningful concept of truth, nothing that might give you an objective standard of truth.


For a start, you seem to have no coherent concept of what objective reality actually is.


Accurate statements about reality. Whatever's there, let it be found, described, and if we can, understood.

Whatever doesn't have objective existence, but is purely conceptual, notional, imaginary, let it be clearly understood to be just that.

Which is why you need what you don't presently have, a clear and meaningful concept of truth, and a consequent objective test for truth.

OK, give me your objective test for truth.

How about the objective test for truth is Math. Everything must add up perfectly or you do not have truth. Of course, truth must always be questioned. In the example of the atom, new knowledge turned old truth into a belief.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

Injustice towards others is a sign of weakness. Lack of insight, weakness. Lack of resolve, weakness.

This is why in Islam we always say "there is no will nor power save by God"

Of course, you got to keep in mind, that dark magic and Iblis pushes towards evil, It may even pose as honorable or mighty, but it's weakness and cowardice to do injustice towards others.

Are you saying the bank robber had lack of resolve? There was a company that was broken into. They broke into an old safe. If you saw that safe and what they had to do to get in that safe, resolve was not the issue. Most would have given up long before they got into that safe.

People who make bad choices act out of petty things like greed and selfishness, not caring who gets hurt. It isn't about weakness or cowardice. One might say ignorance in that they lack the knowledge to choose the best choices. On the other hand, learning is what life is all about.

It's a mosaic of the differences that makes interaction a learning thing. There are people making bad choices like robbing a bank. There are also people who strive to selflessly make the world safe for others, sometimes putting themselves in great risk. The pieces come together so all can learn. Think multi-angular. With 8 billion people and an infinite number of lessons people are learning, the dynamics are amazing.

God created the world so Brains win. Knowledge and wisdom creates strength and power. Fear is generated by the unknown. If one knows, there is no longer fear.

Weakness comes from the lack of knowledge and no more. Example: in world war 2 Germany invaded Poland. Germany went in with tanks and planes. Poland had soldiers on horseback. Who do you think won? Brains and advanced weaponry slaughtered brave people on horseback. Another example: the American Indian. Why did the American Indian lose? It wasn't about cowardice or weakness. Why do you think they were call Braves? It was about capabilities brought on by the advancement of knowledge and Discovery.

The more knowledge and wisdom one acquires along one's journey to God; the more strength and power one acquires. The Hungry student advances quicker than the lazy student. It's all simple Math!!

Now the American Indian life would probably been a great life living with nature and on the land, however one would never have acquired planes,space flight, and all the advances in medicine and technology. If the goal is moving forward learning and growing, brains, knowledge, and wisdom acquired through Discovery must bring strength and capabilities in order to point the direction of the true journey.

God's goal for people is not to simply have it made. I think everyone has thought about living a peaceful life with few problems just staring at the stars at night as an American Indian, however how much is really being accomplished?

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

It's out of weakness as Imam Sajjad (a) says:

My Allah, if You rise me up, who is there to push me down? If You push me down, who is there to raise me up? But I know that there is no wrong in Your decree and no hurry in Your vengeance. He alone hurries who fears to miss, and only the weak needs to wrong. But You are exalted, My Allah, high indeed above all that!

Are the weak really always wrong? Are the strong always right? Does might really make right?

Vengeance never comes from God. Why not? It will never be at a Higher Level of Thinking. Vengeance is mankind. if you value vengeance, you follow mankind.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Everything in creation reveals the attributes of God.

What attribute of God does the tapeworm reveal?

 

[ppp]

People who make bad choices act out of petty things like greed and selfishness, not caring who gets hurt.

People make bad choices with empathy, caring and the best of intentions.

 

[Bird123]

@Bird123 let's not make it too complicated. Since you believe in God, those who ascend towards God and see him are the same as those who turn away and run away towards darkness and caprice? Do you truly believe they are equal and God will deal with them equally? What lesson do you get out of that?

By the way, there are doors towards God. Repenting is one. Craving him and wanting to taste him is another. Obeying him is another. Wanting to see him and recognize him another. People go to God different intentions, but any of those doors will lead to God.

If you hate the idea of authority and fear, then what prevents people from craving God and desiring his fountain? You see, whatever type you are, there is no excuse.

However, running away from God towards illusions of falsehood won't be accepted.

I do not Believe God exists. I know God exists!! There is a Big difference.

We are all God's children. Does one disown, condemn or fry in Hell one's children?

Is your desire to be better than others in the eyes of God? We against they will not bring the best results.

God has many many children. Many more than one could count. Each at a different level of knowledge and understanding. All God's children are treated as equal. On the other hand, each chooses their own lessons through their choices. Everything will not be the same except the results from however many physical lifetimes one needs to learn and understand it all. There is much to learn.

Remember an action of God. God doesn't give out knowledge. Wisdom is acquired on the journey to acquire knowledge. God isn't giving the rules religions are demanding. God places knowledge around us all. It waits to be Discovered and along this journey Wisdom is acquired.

God hides nothing. All the secrets about God and the universe stare us all in the face.

It has never ever been about Believing, Repenting, Craving, Obeying, Ruling, Controlling, Authority or even Fear. These things are laced by mankind within those petty things mankind holds so dear. In time, each will Discover better ways.

You still do not get it. Must you rule and control? Any free choices are acceptable to God. On the other hand, make good choices. Many can choose some very hard lessons for themselves. The lessons are not punishment. Lessons merely teach one what one's actions and choices really mean.

The first thing God pointed out to me was that mankind carries such a narrow view. I cry that!! Perhaps this is something we all can work on.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!!

 

[Bird123]

@Bird123 I see you are full of love and compassion. It's a good thing. Don't get me wrong. But every virtue is confined to it's limit.

Courage turns to recklessness if gone extreme for example.

In Quran, when Ibrahim (a) was given the good news from Angels he feared at first, he started arguing for people of Lut (a). I feel you are in this extreme, you want everyone forgiven. I've been there myself in the past.

Hate and vengeance never feel good. But they have a proper place.

The paradigm of Quran is that Satan would lead us astray without God's guidance and that we have to rely on God and his guidance or else we will rely on deceivers (sometimes it's the case they foremost deceive themselves). We can wish Satan is non-existent, that black magic does not blind people to the truth, etc, all of that won't make the reality change for what it is.

Getting use to God's vengeance was not easy for me, but once you become familiar with it, it's not so bad, you even begin to admire it. It's hard I know because of empathy towards people.

Today is my last day here for a while, school starts tomorrow. I wish you good luck and it was pleasant talking to you @Bird123 !

Universal unconditional love is unfortunately injustice towards good people and their oppressors. Empathy towards oppressed will make you see what I mean.

You do not understand. Unconditional Love always does what is Best for the other. There is a Big difference between Unconditional Love and ignoring everything. On the other hand, it's those choices that count.

If you Hate, Judge, Condemn and seek Revenge on others, what will they do? They will return the same garbage back to you. When does the cycle end? It ends when one has acquired enough knowledge to realize those petty things mankind holds so dear will never bring the best results. One must have the Wisdom to choose to end it. Once again, it comes down to free choices.

Satan does not exist. These are stories written by mankind. Mankind values Blame. Does one really need someone to blame for the bad choices one makes? I think not! Still, people insist and insist Satan exists. I tell them when you meet Satan, send Satan to me. I'd like to meet the guy! If Satan exists, Satan would be a wayward child of God. I would point the direction by which even Satan can learn to create a Heavenly state for himself and others. Never underestimate God's capabilities. All the kiddies are going to make it home.

So often, I hear people say justice justice. There must be justice!! Choose! What is more important, Fixing all the kids OR paying back and revenge their actions?? I say fixing the kids. Regardless of what mankind does, God will teach everyone just what their choices and actions really mean. It is the only way one can Discover what the best choices really are.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Ok, your school starts tomorrow. Feel free to comment anytime. You are always Welcome!!

 

[Bird123]

People make bad choices with empathy, caring and the best of intentions.

Anytime there is a lack knowledge and wisdom, it invites bad choices. On the other hand sometimes a bad choice can bring the most learning for all. Think Multi-angular.

In the end , each will decide for themselves whether their choice was good or bad.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Nakosis]

OK. God creates the universe and God creates you. What does God want from you?

If you are an atheist, speculate. If God really exists and creates the universe and God creates you. What does God want from you?

Before you just give a quick answer, consider a Being capable of creating the universe and you has to be very very smart. Consider High Intellect with your answers. Make God's answer High Intellect.

God wants us to do what we want, however we want, for as long as we want.
The only laws we have to obey are the physical laws of the universe while we are here.

We can return to the abyss whenever we want. Those that figure that out either leave, their essence absorbed back into the abyss, becoming one with God or choose to continue an existence separate from the abyss here in the physical universe.

 

[ppp]

Anytime there is a lack knowledge and wisdom, it invites bad choices. On the other hand sometimes a bad choice can bring the most learning for all. Think Multi-angular.

In the end , each will decide for themselves whether their choice was good or bad.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

That is both trivial and cliched.

 

[blü 2]

OK, give me your objective test for truth.

So you didn't even notice when I twice set it out for you previously? You need to get that ol' dyslexia seen to. I said

Truth is a quality of statements and a statement is true to the extent that it corresponds with / accurately reflects objective reality.

How about the objective test for truth is Math.

Maths is entirely conceptual. That's why you'll never see an uninstantiated 2 running round in the wild. Before there can be two real trees, some human has to decide first that what she wants to count is trees, and second that the field in which she wants to count them is that hillside there ─ or as the case may be.

Everything must add up perfectly or you do not have truth. Of course, truth must always be questioned. In the example of the atom, new knowledge turned old truth into a belief.

I'm not a mathematical Platonist. Roger Penrose and I may agree on many things, but that particular idea is pure woo.