What does God want from you?

[Bird123]

You can state only what you believe is God's system, but you don't know what God's system is.

What you believe about Discovery is a belief system. You don't know anything except what you have discovered by living life, but anyone who has lived life can say they have made discoveries. The difference between them and you is that they do not claim that they Discovered the Truth about God by living life. That is your belief system.

By choosing to limit yourself by the belief that God is unknowable, aren't you really preventing yourself from really knowing God? Why must you have a middleman between you and God? What are you really afraid of?

Did you know you already know God whether you know you know now or not. There is really nothing to be afraid of. You are going to really really like God. God doesn't have the baggage or the garbage so many people choose to carry around with them. God really does care for His children. Nothing will ever be said to hurt you. Each will hurt badly enough when each chooses to judge themselves. Still, there are always more opportunities to do Great things. Learning along the journey just makes that easier.

So often, people value those petty things mankind holds so dear, then judge, hate and condemn others. This is a multilevel classroom. It is a mosaic of so many. Each is important being who they are and making their free choices as they will. The system works so much better that way. If you ever feel not good enough, Remember. You are a Wonderful Work of Art. There is no one in the Universe like you nor will there ever be. I say that makes each and everyone priceless. I say. Be who you Must! It's a part of the Plan!! Share that which is Special about yourself with the world. If you can see nothing Special, share yourself and that Special will change things as they should.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

I can't believe how this Baha'i says she believes in all the Baha'i approved messengers yet doesn't believe the Scriptures that tell us about those messengers and what they taught. The way she answers me is as if I believe those stories, but I agree with her. I think those stories are probably fabricated or in the least embellished.

So, what's to be believe about the past messengers? Krishna, Buddha, Zoroaster, Abraham and all the rest of the people Baha'is say were God's messengers? Nothing. They don't look to what they said, because they don't trust what was said, except Muhammad and their prophets, the Bab and Baha'u'llah.

But again, like you said, actions speak louder than words. And the actions of too many Baha'is are not bringing people together in unity. It is just another organized religion that tells people how they should believe and live. And most don't live by it. But they sure can talk a good message.

Do as I say and not how I do seems to be common among many. If a person can find absolutely nothing wrong in their holy book, I would say they no longer question or think for themselves. WE were all meant to THINK!!

Religions are mankind's attempt to understand God. Since they were all created by mankind, that is who they reflect.

The base one should not fall below is Math. Everything about God will add up regardless of how many questions. If it doesn't add up, one wanders from the Real Truth. Of course, if one refuses to question, how can one ever hope to Discover the Real Truth?

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Trailblazer]

Your Gleanings from the writings of baha p216 prove they do not come from God. They have no clue what God is doing. They are blind to the Masterpiece!!!

You are the one who is blind to what is going on in the world.

What they say is what you want to hear. That is why you do not question them.

You have NO IDEA what I want to hear because you are not a mind-reader. I do not believe what was revealed by Bahaullah because I WANT to believe it. I believe it because I believe it is the truth.

Ok, let me attempt to expand your thinking. Do you really think a Being capable of creating universes would create a mess? Look around you at God's actions. Do you see any other messes???????

God created everything good.
Genesis 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

God did not create the mess we now see in the world. Humans created it.
What we see in the world today is not the result of God's actions, it is the result of human actions.

Much more knowledge lives beyond the mere surface. How can you ever Discover it limiting yourself to only what you want to see?

That is what you do, I do not do that. You limit yourself to what you WANT to see.

In your mind, you choose to limit yourself in so many ways.

I do not limit myself at all. You are the one who is ,limited. You are limited to your own beliefs about what is.

You also limit yourself by trying to place limits on God. This is only in your mind. These are your choices.

I place no limits on God, God limits Himself as He chooses.

There is virtually limitless amount of knowledge surrounding you just waiting to be Discovered. Are you so satisfied with your beliefs that you refuse to ponder other possibilities?

I do not limit myself just because I believe in a religion. That is a straw man you created.

Does limiting yourself really make you happy?

I do not limit myself just because I believe in a religion. That is a straw man you created.

Look how well mankind has progressed since caveman days. The direction is ever forward. The more knowledge mankind acquires; the faster the moving forward and growth will be.

That's true. Man advances ever forward, propelled by the revelations from God brought by the Messengers. Without them, the world would be cold and dead. Whether you believe in them or not doesn't matter, the effect they have eon the world is still the same.

“One who does not know God’s Messengers, however, is like a plant growing in the shade. Although it knows not the sun, it is, nevertheless, absolutely dependent on it. The great Prophets are spirits suns, and Bahá’u’lláh is the sun of this “day” in which we live. The suns of former days have warmed and vivified the world, and had those suns not shone, the earth would not be cold and dead, but it is the sunshine of today that alone can ripen the fruits which the suns of former days have kissed into life.”​

Bahá’u’lláh and the New Era, p. 72​

Are you Happy??? I am always Happy. Even in the midst of great turmoil and challenges, I will be Happy. Can you say the same living in a box of beliefs and valuing so many of the petty things mankind holds so dear??

I do not live in a box of beliefs, you do. You put yourself in a box of your own beliefs and you are too self-absorbed to realize that.

Whether you are happy or not is no determinant of reality. Anyone can be happy living a delusion, but reality does not always bring happiness.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Trailblazer]

Do I really tell anyone what to believe?

Yes, constantly. You tell them to 'believe' in your self-proclaimed religion called Discovery. You do it so coyly, without threats, but you do it just the same.

I do not want anyone to Believe.

If you don't want anyone to believe why do you continually promulgate your belief system called Discovery?

You must be confused. Religion wants people to Believe. Religion teaches people to Believe above all else. When one doesn't believe, religion uses fear, threats, intimidation in order to coerce people into following. That is why they created Hell. Without followers they have nothing.

You are talking about Christianity but that is only ONE RELIGION or many. The Baha'i Faith does not want anyone to believe, we believe that belief must always be a free choice. The Baha'i Faith does not use fear, threats, or intimidation in order to coerce people into following.

Get your head out of the sand. All religions are not like Christianity.

The Real Truth is in the world. It will still waits for those to Discover it. They will only when they are ready. Clearly, you are not ready.

The Real Truth is revealed by the Messengers of God. It still waits for everyone to Discover it. They will only when they are ready. Clearly, you are not ready.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Trailblazer]

By choosing to limit yourself by the belief that God is unknowable, aren't you really preventing yourself from really knowing God?

I do not prevent myself from knowing God, God prevents me from knowing Him by BEING unknowable.

Why must you have a middleman between you and God? What are you really afraid of?

I need a middleman between myself and God because that is God's System.
There can never be any direct intercourse between God and man.

“Every attempt which, from the beginning that hath no beginning, hath been made to visualize and know God is limited by the exigencies of His own creation—a creation which He, through the operation of His own Will and for the purposes of none other but His own Self, hath called into being. Immeasurably exalted is He above the strivings of human mind to grasp His Essence, or of human tongue to describe His mystery. No tie of direct intercourse can ever bind Him to the things He hath created, nor can the most abstruse and most remote allusions of His creatures do justice to His being. Through His world-pervading Will He hath brought into being all created things. He is and hath ever been veiled in the ancient eternity of His own exalted and indivisible Essence, and will everlastingly continue to remain concealed in His inaccessible majesty and glory.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 318​

God sends Messengers as middlemen because that is the only way humans can have any connection to God. Since Messengers have a twofold nature, one human and one spiritual, they can understand God's communication and relay it to humans in a form that they can understand.

“And since there can be no tie of direct intercourse to bind the one true God with His creation, and no resemblance whatever can exist between the transient and the Eternal, the contingent and the Absolute, He hath ordained that in every age and dispensation a pure and stainless Soul be made manifest in the kingdoms of earth and heaven. Unto this subtle, this mysterious and ethereal Being He hath assigned a twofold nature; the physical, pertaining to the world of matter, and the spiritual, which is born of the substance of God Himself. He hath, moreover, conferred upon Him a double station. The first station, which is related to His innermost reality, representeth Him as One Whose voice is the voice of God Himself.” Gleanings, p. 66​

Did you know you already know God whether you know you know now or not.

What I know about God is very limited and it came by way of the Messenger of God.

 

[Bird123]

I do not prevent myself from knowing God, God prevents me from knowing Him by BEING unknowable.

I need a middleman between myself and God because that is God's System.
There can never be any direct intercourse between God and man.

“Every attempt which, from the beginning that hath no beginning, hath been made to visualize and know God is limited by the exigencies of His own creation—a creation which He, through the operation of His own Will and for the purposes of none other but His own Self, hath called into being. Immeasurably exalted is He above the strivings of human mind to grasp His Essence, or of human tongue to describe His mystery. No tie of direct intercourse can ever bind Him to the things He hath created, nor can the most abstruse and most remote allusions of His creatures do justice to His being. Through His world-pervading Will He hath brought into being all created things. He is and hath ever been veiled in the ancient eternity of His own exalted and indivisible Essence, and will everlastingly continue to remain concealed in His inaccessible majesty and glory.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 318​

God sends Messengers as middlemen because that is the only way humans can have any connection to God. Since Messengers have a twofold nature, one human and one spiritual, they can understand God's communication and relay it to humans in a form that they can understand.

“And since there can be no tie of direct intercourse to bind the one true God with His creation, and no resemblance whatever can exist between the transient and the Eternal, the contingent and the Absolute, He hath ordained that in every age and dispensation a pure and stainless Soul be made manifest in the kingdoms of earth and heaven. Unto this subtle, this mysterious and ethereal Being He hath assigned a twofold nature; the physical, pertaining to the world of matter, and the spiritual, which is born of the substance of God Himself. He hath, moreover, conferred upon Him a double station. The first station, which is related to His innermost reality, representeth Him as One Whose voice is the voice of God Himself.” Gleanings, p. 66​

What I know about God is very limited and it came by way of the Messenger of God.

Go ahead. Keeping believing. There will come a time when you Discover differently.

That's what I see. It's very very clear!!

 

[Trailblazer]

Go ahead. Keeping believing. There will come a time when you Discover differently.

That's what I see. It's very very clear!!

Go ahead. Keep believing. I doubt there will come a time when you believe differently.

That's what I see. It's very very clear!!

 

[Aupmanyav]

But as you said, you find no religion that confirms your views.

Confusion of thought, denial of truth, brings about this condition.

Is sending books through mankind really Intelligent?

Someone saying that he / she has the book is intelligent. It gets them fame, power, money. There is no dearth of gullible people.
Scammers are intelligent, more intelligent than the populace.

I am one who must know. I am not one to believe. If I form a belief, I will work to Discover the truth. Beliefs are never the end of the journey.
God has confirmed what I have Discovered.

You believe in existence of God. I do not see any evidence of that. I agree with your first line disagree with the second.

 

[Aupmanyav]

You can state only what you believe is God's system, but you don't know what God's system is.

There is no God and no Godly system. What evidence do you have for it other than rants of ignorant people.

Krishna, Buddha, ..

Krishna is Hindu mythology. Buddha was a very wise person who said contemplation about God is not relevant for living.

Do you know what all the Baha'is are doing all over the world? I don't know, I only know what I see in my own Baha'i community, and I don't really know what they are doing to bring people together in unity. I also don't know how they live or how well they live by the teachings if the Faith. So who am I to judge them?

I live in peace with my neighbors and with life without being a Bahai.

 

[CG Didymus]

Krishna is Hindu mythology. Buddha was a very wise person who said contemplation about God is not relevant for living.

Last I heard, Baha'u'llah didn't mention anything about Krishna and maybe Buddha also. So, why did Baha'is add them in later? I would guess that they needed someone to point to in Hinduism to try and complete their theory of "progressive" revelation. But they don't include any of the other incarnations. And they ignore that not all Hindus believe in Krishna.

Then they also added Buddha into their "official" grouping of manifestations sent by their one and only God. But they had to search far and wide to find any Buddhist Scriptures that could tie the Buddha in with a belief of God.

But with both of them, they really don't care all that much about what they supposedly taught. In fact, they have a disclaimer on all the Scriptures of the other religions and say that we can't really know what was true and authentic. Great. So, all the Baha'is needed and wanted was a name. That way they could say, "See, God always sent a manifestation. And all their teachings are true and good. Unfortunately, people misinterpreted them and added things in, so we really can't trust the Scriptures of those other religions. But, the good news, you can trust what we, the Baha'i Faith, tells you about them and what is true."

For me, it's hard to see any connection between Hinduism and Buddhism and the Baha'i Faith. Very little with Christianity also. It has a lot of laws like Judaism. But, for sure, it has a lot in common with Islam. Imagine that. So, could it be Islam-lite? A liberal, more universally acceptable form of Islam? Actually, so far, it's not being accepted. And I can see why... too many rules and top-down authoritarian leadership. What can they do, if they should ever become the majority, but get a "holy" police force to make sure everyone obeys the rules. And haven't a few religions done that already?

 

[Trailblazer]

I live in peace with my neighbors and with life without being a Bahai.

I am happy for you. Your fate was just better than mine.
Certainly everyone does not need to be a Baha'i, nor does that bring a guarantee of happiness.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I am happy for you. Your fate was just better than mine.
Certainly everyone does not need to be a Baha'i, nor does that bring a guarantee of happiness.

Yeah, what Baha offer is after death, a paper promise like other Abrahamic religions.
In Hinduism, it all depends on your 'karma', no divine interference.

 

[muhammad_isa]

In Hinduism, it all depends on your 'karma', no divine interference.

It boils down to the same thing..
Divine justice is absolute.

 

[Aupmanyav]

It boils down to the same thing.. Divine justice is absolute.

How come? You say "O Allah, forgive me my sins".
Hindus cannot say that. None can forgive their sins.
They are responsible for what they do. That is justice.
If they have sinned, there will be a punishment.

 

[muhammad_isa]

How come? You say "O Allah, forgive me my sins".
Hindus cannot say that. None can forgive their sins.
They are responsible for what they do. That is justice.
If they have sinned, there will be a punishment.

Ah, but you were talking about karma..
..and that involves a judgement.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Ah, but you were talking about karma..
..and that involves a judgement.

No judgement. It is 'karma account', just like a bank account.
The accountant (Chitragupta) brings up the account, good and bad deeds listed separately, like deposits and withdrawals.
The person gets what he deserves for good deeds (heaven) and so too for bad deeds (hell).
Yama is the God officer overseeing this. He too cannot interfere, reduce or increase the sentence.
That is what theist Hindus believe. However, I am an atheist Hindu. I do not believe in this.

 

[muhammad_isa]

The person gets what he deserves for good deeds (heaven) and so too for bad deeds (hell).

..and you think that "Allah" has different ideas?
Divine justice is absolute .. not one soul will escape from what it deserves.

..and only G-d knows what that exactly is .. karma is no different.

Yama is the God officer overseeing this. He too cannot interfere, reduce or increase the sentence..

..well, all will be revealed, as "time goes by".

One thing though .. if we can't forgive others, then why should we expect forgiveness for ourselves?

 

[Aupmanyav]

.. and you think that "Allah" has different ideas?
Divine justice is absolute .. not one soul will escape from what it deserves.
..and only G-d knows what that exactly is .. karma is no different.

..well, all will be revealed, as "time goes by".
One thing though .. if we can't forgive others, then why should we expect forgiveness for ourselves?

That is your belief, friend. As an atheist, I neither believe in existence of God, nor in existence of soul.
I do not think there is anything to be revealed. It is already clearly visible. After death disintegration of flesh and bones, and nothing more.
Somethings can be forgiven, somethings not. I do not need to be forgiven by anyone. Don't try to frighten me with hell, that is a fail.

 

[muhammad_isa]

That is your belief, friend..

..and I was just saying how karma is of the same principle, when it comes
to a judgement.

..and now you are saying that you don't believe in karma, after all?

 

[Aupmanyav]

..and I was just saying how karma is of the same principle, when it comes
to a judgement.
..and now you are saying that you don't believe in karma, after all?

I do believe in affects of karma in this life, but I do not believe in reincarnation or life in heaven or hell.
What we do affects us and others, materially and psychologically (bad deeds may have their psychological effects).
For a peaceful and prosperous society, we have to follow its rules.