What Happens When You Die?

[mainliner]

Someone said above but i cant find it " when in dreamsleep your real body is still here on earth in bed asleep at the same time" ............untrue!!!

iv had lucid dream that lasted hours yet only been asleep 10 mins.

very complicated to understand.......but in my dream the real world outside ......time stops .( in my mind)
but in reality the worlds cogs keep turning ????? And the time never stopped....but did and i proved it did for me


ps....i woke up 15mins before my alarm went off and fell asleep for ten mins and woke up 5mins before my alarm was due......2-3 hours had pasted in my dream.......this is true

 

[godnotgod]

Very much enjoying your posts..i have used 'realms' thinking to explain to myself the separation in man's views of reality but for the last year or so have become aware of the dual view in this. 'Time' keeps pulling (for lack of a better discription) in my life but as i get older i sense it is losing it's hold on me, perhaps the transition of no transition you speak of. Your knowledge intrigues me..thank you.

I think you might find the following video valuable:

Once the inevitable is accepted, death becomes inconsequential. Then you are free.

 

[Thief]

You say you understand Genesis, but your comment here is proof positive that you fail to understand the connection between Genesis and what happens after you die, from the Christian point of view.

Goodbye, Thief. Don't need the hot air.

Hello again....I'm not yours to dismiss.
I have a Lord and you're not Him.

Your objection is infantile and lacks content.
Care to expand?

 

[Thief]

are you talking about what happens to your real body?

In part....
The body is designed to intake all that you can learn
That's why we are here.

You become a unique spirit.
You can do little else.

Then we go back to Something Greater.
(see book of Job)

 

[Thief]

Someone said above but i cant find it " when in dreamsleep your real body is still here on earth in bed asleep at the same time" ............untrue!!!

iv had lucid dream that lasted hours yet only been asleep 10 mins.

very complicated to understand.......but in my dream the real world outside ......time stops .( in my mind)
but in reality the worlds cogs keep turning ????? And the time never stopped....but did and i proved it did for me


ps....i woke up 15mins before my alarm went off and fell asleep for ten mins and woke up 5mins before my alarm was due......2-3 hours had pasted in my dream.......this is true

Ah....so you would agree?...time does not exist.

 

[mainliner]

Ah....so you would agree?...time does not exist.

that impossible to answer

 

[Thief]

that impossible to answer

No....I can do it.
Time is not a force....or a substance.
It is only a method of measure.(of motion)
As such it is a quotient on a chalkboard.
A cognitive device created by Man to serve Man.

 

[mainliner]

No....I can do it.
Time is not a force....or a substance.
It is only a method of measure.(of motion)
As such it is a quotient on a chalkboard.
A cognitive device created by Man to serve Man.

time in the wake world stopped for me.....but it didnt for you .

you could watch me sleep in realtime....yet i can be dreaming much long or shorter.

two seperate conscious worlds with to seperate timelines.

 

[godnotgod]

Hello again....I'm not yours to dismiss.
I have a Lord and you're not Him.

One Lord, many faces of the Lord, even yours.

Your objection is infantile and lacks content.
Care to expand?

You don't get it because you haven't learned to use your intuitive mind yet. You still cling to belief, and lack faith.

Belief clings.

Faith lets go.

It'll be over your head, but in a nutshell, Genesis is not what you have been indoctrinated to stubbornly believe. It is about the gift of divine union that is beyond ordinary life and death. It is NOT about disobedience to God's Law and the punishment of Death. Divine Union is the key that frees man from the illusion of Death.

 

[Indira]

I think you might find the following video valuable:

Once the inevitable is accepted, death becomes inconsequential. Then you are free.

Thank you..i have heard videos of Adyashanti's retreats before and i can appreciate his views.
I follow the Tibetan Buddhism form of practice and psychological studies. I have had a few near death experiences since my 20's and do not fear death but grasping for control in daily life has been an issue. Western life is a bit oxymoronic for cultivating a state of mind of letting go of control, lol. For the most part i can pass on the reflex to act on it's influence and let it pass but occasionally it does get a hold and negative behavior is of course the result. This creates impatience and disappoint in myself. I'm supposing my 'fear' is not wanting to let go of family so the awakening process can progress..it is a conundrum when love and compassion is the focus of spiritual practice and that love is causing fear.
A query for you..is isolation necessary for complete spiritual evolution?

 

[Gambit]

What do you think Chopra means when he says:

"What happens when you die, is you return to where you always are."

Consciousness (God).

 

[Aupmanyav]

A query for you..is isolation necessary for complete spiritual evolution?

allow me to offer a reply. Of course not. You do not have to let go of your affection towards your family. Your 'dharma' is tied to them, i.e., you have responsibilities towards them. You also have responsibilities towards humanity as a whole and towards the rest of the world. Just try to fulfill your responsibilities (dharma) to the best of your ability. Whatever then happens (karma-phala, result of your actions), does not matter. Lord Krishna in Gita:

"Karmanyevadhikaras te, ma phaleshu kadacana;
ma karma-phala-hetur bhuh, ma te sango'stvakarmani." BhagawadGita 2.47

You have a right to perform your duty, the fruits of action are not in your domain;
Never consider yourself the cause of the results of your activities*, and never be attached to inaction.
* since many other factors may be involved.

 

[godnotgod]

....grasping for control in daily life has been an issue. Western life is a bit oxymoronic for cultivating a state of mind of letting go of control, lol. For the most part i can pass on the reflex to act on it's influence and let it pass but occasionally it does get a hold and negative behavior is of course the result. This creates impatience and disappoint in myself. I'm supposing my 'fear' is not wanting to let go of family so the awakening process can progress..it is a conundrum when love and compassion is the focus of spiritual practice and that love is causing fear.

Your description must be a profile for most of us. I know the feelings exactly, except I'm not sure what you meant by that last statement. But I think most of the issues you raise have to do with the notion of an existing self in operation at every turn: 'I' control; 'I' think; etc. Even in release, the 'i' wants control! One of the things Zen has taught me is to always question: 'Who is it that controls?' 'Who is it that releases?' 'Who is it that lives?' 'Who is it that dies?', etc. With increasing mindfullness about the seeming activities of 'I', one soon gets glimpses that there is no such 'I'; there is only the action itself. The more this is practiced, the more 'i' will put up a fight to continue it's illusory existence as the controller of everything. But persistence in observation slowly begins to give you real control over the 'controller' by simply passing on the reflex, as you have said. Stay the course.

A query for you..is isolation necessary for complete spiritual evolution?

Certainly time away from the noise and drama of everyday life is necessary for spiritual growth. I live alone as it is, and try to devote as much time as I can to being attentive to those needs. Currently for me, my focus is on making things manageable in my life in order to create as much balance as possible, a sort of 'squaring' with the reality I find myself in, pulling in loose ends, and ultimately creating more 'prime time' for myself. But your suggestion may be the ultimate choice for those who have given themselves wholeheartedly to the effort toward their Enlightenment. Phillipe Kapleau, author of 'The Three Pillars of Zen', stamped the book ends with the beautiful image of a salmon leaping upstream to reach its 'home', using every last ounce of its energy to get there. And I remember the words of 'grasshopper' when asked about the spiritual life: 'I can think of none better'. Just depends on how much you want it and how much energy you are willing to put into it. It's called 'The Master Game', and is the most difficult of all life games to play, and probably the most rewarding, from the glimpses I've had.

The Zen series of woodcuts called 'Ten Bulls', portraying the stages of Enlightenment with commentary, shows as the last image, the Buddha returning to the world of men. If you are not familiar with them, here is a link for you:

Ten Bulls - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Rick O'Shez]

In other words, death (and life) are illusory.

But people get born and die all the time, so what does this actually mean?

 

[godnotgod]

But people get born and die all the time, so what does this actually mean?

Who is it that is born? Who is it that dies?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Who is it that is born? Who is it that dies?

This sounds like a Zen riddle and I'm no good at those. What do you think? What do you think it means to say that birth and death are illusory? In what sense are they illusory?

 

[godnotgod]

This sounds like a Zen riddle and I'm no good at those. What do you think? What do you think it means to say that birth and death are illusory? In what sense are they illusory?

Not actually a Zen koan, just a question.

There must exist a self in order for birth and death to occur. Where is this self to be found? Who is it that lives? Who is it that dies? IOW, the self called 'I' is an illusion. There is no one called 'I' that lives and dies. There is only 'living/dying itself'. There is no river that flows; there is only flowing water.

The Human Route
by Zen Master Seung Sahn

Coming empty-handed, going empty-handed — that is human.
When you are born, where do you come from?
When you die, where do you go?
Life is like a floating cloud which appears.
Death is like a floating cloud which disappears.
The floating cloud itself originally does not exist.
Life and death, coming and going, are also like that.
But there is one thing which always remains clear.
It is pure and clear, not depending on life and death.

Then what is the one pure and clear thing?

In the strictly biological sense, the body during 'death' is being consumed by macrophages and other bacteria. That is life. When alive, we consume dead organic matter in order to sustain life. Life and Death are inextricably tied one to the other, so the line between them is blurred. But is the temporal, physical body who you really are?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

There must exist a self in order for birth and death to occur.

All living organisms are subject to birth and death, there doesn't have to be a self. Sure, it's all a process, but I'm not sure that really answers the question.

Maybe the self is an illusion, maybe it isn't. Maybe we have a soul, maybe we don't. What's your view on these questions?

 

[`mud]

Like birth and later death, the inner being within one's knowing comes forth.
It is there before existance, and lingers shortly, and goes forward into another form.
It will greet the surrounding realities of the new emergence with it's own being.
And it goes, forward and ever into infinity and beyond.
~
Many religions follow this way of thinking, not exactly, but close.
May the memories of you amongst others be the best of you.
~
hey GNG....some good thinking there...likeable...in a lot of ways.
~
'mud

 

[Indira]

This sounds like a Zen riddle and I'm no good at those. What do you think? What do you think it means to say that birth and death are illusory? In what sense are they illusory?

Perhaps 'cyclic' as a discription would help with understanding.