What is a Jew?

[MARCELLO]

Also, this thread is created deliberately to exploit jews,don't you think so? First of all ,it should be '' Who is a jew? ''

 

[roger1440]

Some one who either has a Jewish mother or has undergone a halachic conversion.

You cannot use the same term to define a term. If a child asked you what is a refrigerator would you tell him, “A refrigerator refrigerates”?

 

[rosends]

What?? Your avatar exactly tells opposite of your comments. Why did you choose shylock then?

On the other hand I am not judging what jews read further and deeper,I gave just an example of what a jew like according to a marvelous writer Shakespeare. The English literature cannot do without him.

My avatar is completely BECAUSE I sense a deeper meaning to the text. I don't think Shakespeare was necessarily writing anything significantly insulting to Jews so I am taking back the name and the character. I can send you to an essay I wrote on the subject if you'd like.

 

[rosends]

Also, this thread is created deliberately to exploit jews,don't you think so? First of all ,it should be '' Who is a jew? ''

No, I don't think so. I think that the question of "what is a Jew" might be significantly more complex and even, through its challenging nature, more interesting. The problem is that I'm not exactly sure what the OP is looking for in terms of approach. The "who is a Jew" question leads in a different direction.

 

[roger1440]

No, I don't think so. I think that the question of "what is a Jew" might be significantly more complex and even, through its challenging nature, more interesting. The problem is that I'm not exactly sure what the OP is looking for in terms of approach. The "who is a Jew" question leads in a different direction.

what is the difference?

 

[wizanda]

Yeah uhm no.

lol, well that answer has substance to it, to disprove it doesn't; where as can show countless prophetic similes that have.

Lviv/Lemberg was part of Austro-Hungary and thus not part of the Russian Pale.

Thank you wasn't aware it wasn't inside the Pale of Settlement, thought it was just on the border; yet still doesn't change the stats, and that my genealogy is possibly connected.
'Before the Holocaust about one third of the city's population was made up of Jews'

 

[Quintessence]

Do you suggest This thread be moved?

Yes, because this subforum is supposed to be used for debating Bible passages, specifically, and that doesn't seem to be the topic at hand unless you want people to define what it means to be a Jew using Bible passages only.

 

[rosends]

what is the difference?

For "who" I could use the personal characteristics that would conform to the strictures laid out by text (though we would have to decide if you meant the "Jew" meaning the descendant of someone who lived in the Kingdom of Judah, or the one who adheres to the theology exemplified by Naomi). For "what" I wonder if you are looking for some definition not of characteristics or lineage, but of transcendent quality (answered like "a Jew is spiritual"). It is always difficult answering about a human (a "who") when asked for a "what".

 

[Theweirdtophat]

An adherent to Judaism.

 

[MARCELLO]

My avatar is completely BECAUSE I sense a deeper meaning to the text. I don't think Shakespeare was necessarily writing anything significantly insulting to Jews so I am taking back the name and the character. I can send you to an essay I wrote on the subject if you'd like.

Why not? Grateful to receive it.

 

[rosends]

Why not? Grateful to receive it.

Here it is. When I teach the play, I try to open up meanings and, as I see it, there are four easy ways to read the play:
antisemitic because Shakespeare was either personally a hater, or was ignorant of Judaism, so he picked up anti-Semitism and just was an average guy
neutral because Shakespeare creates a universe and writes for an audience -- the text is not Shakespeare's personal thoughts, but what he thought his public wanted to see
anti everything because Shakespeare attacks other institutions and groups, including other religions as vehemently as he does Judaism. There are no heroes or good guys.
philo semitic becaue of what I present in that essay.

 

[roger1440]

For "who" I could use the personal characteristics that would conform to the strictures laid out by text (though we would have to decide if you meant the "Jew" meaning the descendant of someone who lived in the Kingdom of Judah, or the one who adheres to the theology exemplified by Naomi). For "what" I wonder if you are looking for some definition not of characteristics or lineage, but of transcendent quality (answered like "a Jew is spiritual"). It is always difficult answering about a human (a "who") when asked for a "what".

You label yourself as Jewish. What does that mean to you and what does that mean in the broader sense. I know very well this thread isn’t about you. I know “what is a Jew” is very complex.

 

[rosends]

You label yourself as Jewish. What does that mean to you and what does that mean in the broader sense. I know very well this thread isn’t about you. I know “what is a Jew” is very complex.

I label myself Jewish and this means a couple of things. First it means that my lineage conforms to the matrilineal requirement as set forth in texts by authorities whom I respect as authoritative. Second it means (to me) that I am bound by the rest of the laws as set down in the texts considered by (my branch of) Judaism to be normative and applicable. There might be a meaning on a more spiritual level (it means that I have a gift of a particular relationship with the divine and it is my job to cultivate that relationship every day), but that's a tougher level to capture in words.

 

[roger1440]

I label myself Jewish and this means a couple of things. First it means that my lineage conforms to the matrilineal requirement as set forth in texts by authorities whom I respect as authoritative. Second it means (to me) that I am bound by the rest of the laws as set down in the texts considered by (my branch of) Judaism to be normative and applicable. There might be a meaning on a more spiritual level (it means that I have a gift of a particular relationship with the divine and it is my job to cultivate that relationship every day), but that's a tougher level to capture in words.

Are you telling me the ""texts" created the Jews?

 

[rosends]

Are you telling me the ""texts" created the Jews?

I am telling you that texts created the standard requirements and definitions of membership in the group later known as "Jews."

 

[wizanda]

I am telling you that texts created the standard requirements and definitions of membership in the group later known as "Jews."

That was my original point, if a modern orthodox Jew is someone who accepts the Talmud, Mishnah, and other rabbinic literature, then are modem and ancient Jews the same thing?

 

[roger1440]

I am telling you that texts created the standard requirements and definitions of membership in the group later known as "Jews."

Your "law giver" who was "drawn out" had no texts, true?

 

[rosends]

Your "law giver" who was "drawn out" had no texts, true?

Not entirely. Orthodox Jewish tradition teaches that the torah predates creation and that the forefathers had access to parts of the law. Mo might have been cut off from some of that, being raised in a different household, but he might have gotten a bunch of that when he reunited with his people later on. Of course, the term "Jew" post-dates that era. Are you now asking about what makes something different?

 

[rosends]

That was my original point, if a modern orthodox Jew is someone who accepts the Talmud, Mishnah, and other rabbinic literature, then are modem and ancient Jews the same thing?

That depends on what you mean by "Jew" and "same thing." These terms are not so simple.

 

[RabbiO]

Why not? Grateful to receive it.

Are you aware that rosends is an Orthodox rabbi?