What is an authentic Christian?

[Exaltist Ethan]

They estimate new denominations are formed at the rate of one every 10.5 hours (2.3 per day).

How do you not find this fact utterly ridiculous? I could believe that maybe a new church is made in that time span worldwide but not an entire denomination.

 

[ChristineM]

How do you not find this fact utterly ridiculous?

Because i know people, how do you find it utterly ridiculous?

 

[paradox]

If so, what makes an authentic Christian?

I think it's very simple, an authentic Christian will never misuse old testament.
An authentic Christian will use old testament only for moral judgement.

However "Christians" who in addition use old testament for ceremonial or judicial practices or promote the same aren't Christians since
ceremonial and judicial portion of the OT is what Christ nailed on the Cross once and for all.

Example:
Adultery is sin.

An authentic Christian will say it's sin and will condemn the sin (not an adulterer)

A non authentic one will claim that adulterer needs to be stoned
A non authentic one may also condemn the person who is adulterer which is wrong.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

On another debate a member who is a Christian dismissed some Christians, namely those Baptists of the Confederate South and Lutherans and Catholics of Nazi Germany, as "Christians in name only". That's interesting.
This implies and suggests that there are fake Christians, and thus by contrast, authentic Christians. So it got me to wondering if this is a common attitude among Christians, and if so, what is the profile of an "authentic Christian" versus "in name only".So, do you have this attitude and belief?If so, what makes an authentic Christian?Does this smack of judgment?

The Bible speaks of both the genuine ' wheat ' Christians and the fake ' weed/tares ' Christians.
Gospel writer Luke forewarned at Acts of the Apostles 20:29-30 to beware of apostates.
Wolves dressed in sheep's clothing - Matthew 7:15; 2 Peter 2:1 - false clergy - Matthew 15:9; 2 Timothy 4:3-4.
Jesus said how there would be many coming in his name but prove false - Matthew 7:21-23
As an ID Jesus gave a New commandment at John 13:34-35
Genuine Christians would have that same self-sacrificing love among themselves as Jesus has.- 1 John 4:20

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I think it's very simple, an authentic Christian will never misuse old testament. An authentic Christian will use old testament only for moral judgement.
However "Christians" who in addition use old testament for ceremonial or judicial practices or promote the same aren't Christians since ceremonial and judicial portion of the OT is what Christ nailed on the Cross once and for all.
Example:
Adultery is sin.
An authentic Christian will say it's sin and will condemn the sin (not an adulterer)
A non authentic one will claim that adulterer needs to be stoned
A non authentic one may also condemn the person who is adulterer which is wrong.

Yes, adultery and fornication too are sins but what is important is: repentance.
Is the person genuinely repentant or not __________

 

[wizanda]

If so, what makes an authentic Christian?

I understand a Christian by definition to be the followers of Paul & Simon petros; where you have to believe in the death (crucifixion), and resurrection of Christ to be saved.

In my opinion.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Except this is not Jesus judging, but some individual with questionable authority.
On the question of imperfect individuals judging others, I might also refer to the Sermon on the Mount, esp. Matthew 7:1.

As with the OT the imperfect judges were to use God's judgement on matters.
In other words, God's judgement is already recorded in Scripture for all to see or read.
Matthew 7 is Not about judicial matters (fornication/ adultery) but about a personal judgement of another.
We are Not to impute a bad or wrong motive to another's actions but try forgiving - Luke 6:37; James 2:13

 

[paradox]

I understand a Christian by definition to be the followers of Paul & Simon petros; where you have to believe in the death (crucifixion), and resurrection of Christ to be saved.

I suppose you've never read 1 Corinthians 1:10-13?

 

[Notthedarkweb]

Seems like a fairly quixotic question that's beholden by a very decisionistic theology reminiscent to me of Kierkegaard, honestly. The problem with this is that authentic Christianity is only determinable from a God's eye view of election and sanctifying grace, which is obviously unavailable to us. And it can be entirely possible to me that there are those who aren't members of the visible Church who might be elected to salvation (see Rahner's concept of the anonymous Christian, though this idea is as old as Augustine's metaphor of the wolf among sheep.)

The general guide for the Christian in his belief as sanctified agent of the Lord though is to simply sew who re-enacts the Word in the world as the criterion for his actions, though. Which would generally mean virtuous and Christ-like behavior, which in turn would mean, as Paul makes the case in Romans, following a phenomenology of absolute love.

 

[Ashoka]

A Christian is someone who follows Christ. Full stop.

"No true Christian" is just "No true Scotsman." Steve Anderson is a Christian. Greg Locke is a Christian. Paul Washer is a Christian. Hateful people in particular seem to be drawn to Christianity. No, that doesn't mean all Christians are monsters. But many of them are. And they are just as much a Christian as the super-progressive youth pastor down the street who likes fog machines and wears skinny jeans and is convinced Justin Bieber is the next Hillsong worship leader.

 

[Kenny]

On another debate a member who is a Christian dismissed some Christians, namely those Baptists of the Confederate South and Lutherans and Catholics of Nazi Germany, as "Christians in name only". That's interesting.

This implies and suggests that there are fake Christians, and thus by contrast, authentic Christians. So it got me to wondering if this is a common attitude among Christians, and if so, what is the profile of an "authentic Christian" versus "in name only".

So, do you have this attitude and belief?

If so, what makes an authentic Christian?

Does this smack of judgment?

Certainly we have what scripture says,

Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves

Notice that these definitely were Christians in name only.

Then you also have:

Matthew 25:32
And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

Obviously goats are not sheep although they were in the same coral (so to speak)

But it isn't as hard as you think...

Matthew 7:17
Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

However, ultimately, we let God sort those things out.

Hope that helped your understanding.

 

[paradox]

A Christian is someone who follows Christ. Full stop.

follow Christ, but how exactly?

Hateful people in particular seem to be drawn to Christianity. No, that doesn't mean all Christians are monsters. But many of them are.

According to which survey?

 

[blü 2]

On another debate a member who is a Christian dismissed some Christians, namely those Baptists of the Confederate South and Lutherans and Catholics of Nazi Germany, as "Christians in name only". That's interesting.

This implies and suggests that there are fake Christians, and thus by contrast, authentic Christians. So it got me to wondering if this is a common attitude among Christians, and if so, what is the profile of an "authentic Christian" versus "in name only".

So, do you have this attitude and belief?

If so, what makes an authentic Christian?

Does this smack of judgment?

I was told that the only thing you need to be a Christian is the belief that Jesus is your savior.

That's how I know I'm not a Christian.

On the other hand because my parents exposed me to Sunday School (until I worked out how to duck) and occasional church services, I could make a case for being a cultural Christian, not least since I know the words for a lot of hymns ─ handy at funerals, in particular.

Well, a cultural Pisco, anyway.

 

[Ashoka]

follow Christ, but how exactly?


According to which survey?

1. They follow him based upon their interpretation of the Bible. It's why we have so many denominations. Which one is true? How can you be sure?

2. According to the KKK, Christian identity movements, many of the people who stormed the capital, anti-semitic Christians, Hyper-Calvinists, Fundamentalist Christians, Christian nationalists...

 

[F1fan]

Well if it does then Jesus was judgmental.

There's always been fake Christians. How to recognize them?

You Will Know Them by Their Fruits
15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

That's a lot of symbolism. Why not explain it to us is real world examples. Is lying "good fruit" for example?

 

[F1fan]

What is an "authentic" rock star?

Dead at 27. Duh!!!

My point is that this kind of question demands a very specific criteria for assessing a very non-specific phenomenon. A "Christian" is someone that is choosing to adhere to the ideals represented by "Christ". Simple, and specific. But what is "Christ"? And what ideals does this "Christ" represent for the adherent? The answers to those questions are going to be varied and very subjective. Expecting otherwise would be foolish. So when we ask this kind of question, we need to be specific about what we're asking if we expect to get a specific answer. And that's going to depend on who we are asking.

If it is this heady then no wonder many less intelligent folks are way off the mark.

Basically you seem to be saying there is no definitive truth and it is whatever a believer wants it to be. How do you explain all the folks who have a very rigid ideology, often that targets others as an element of their dogma?

 

[paradox]

They follow him based upon their interpretation of the Bible. It's why we have so many denominations. Which one is true? How can you be sure?

But you don't follow Christ based on your own interpretation, nowhere does the bible or Jesus say to follow him based on your own interpretation.

According to the KKK, Christian identity movements, many of the people who stormed the capital, anti-semitic Christians, Hyper-Calvinists, Fundamentalist Christians, Christian nationalists...

None of which are Christian churches established by Jesus.

 

[Ashoka]

None of which are Christian churches established by Jesus.

Yet they claim to follow Jesus. They believe that Jesus saves. They believe in the Creed, they believe in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. Not established by Jesus? Every denomination thinks it's the one Jesus started. why should theirs be any different?

But you don't follow Christ based on your own interpretation, nowhere does the bible or Jesus say to follow him based on your own interpretation.

Yet that's exactly what Christians do. They all follow Christ based on how they interpret the Bible.

 

[F1fan]

No, but I do despise particular groups and find it very hard to visit with them. This problem is mine not theirs. It is on me.

It is what is called the spirit of the antichrist, and it is considered to be an internal enemy within people. Christ seeks the union of all of the various kinds of people. Anti christ therefore is what divides them. Defeating anti christ is the long term challenge within Christianity. Once that is accomplished nothing will be impossible.

So why isn't all this clearer? The Bible has over 60 books and lacks any sort of clarity that allows believers a coherent understanding of what it demands or requires. The Jesus teachings are basic liberal human attitudes but we see many Christian sects that largely ignore what jesus taught for an incoherent dogma that, to my mind, is anti-Christ. So an atheist can understand this, but some Christians can't?

 

[paradox]

Yet they claim to follow Jesus. They believe that Jesus saves. They believe in the Creed, they believe in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. Not established by Jesus? Every denomination thinks it's the one Jesus started. why should theirs be any different?

That's what they claim and you believe their claims and then attack Christians based on your groundless beliefs.
We all know these churches were established in past few centuries and none dates back to Jesus.

Yet that's exactly what Christians do. They all follow Christ based on how they interpret the Bible.

You're evading me now...
Therefore you realize they are not Christians but you blatantly claim they are?