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What is God's highest priority?

Don't you owe it to yourself to study the Whole Word of God yourself?
Jesus said I AM THE TRUTH.................and NOONE comes to the Father except thru Me!!
When one finally meets and KNOWS Jesus there is no need to chase after other gods, beliefs. You make the claim that you believe in Jesus Christ, and the God of the Bible (Yahweh). The truth according to the Bible and Jesus Christ is not compatible with any other religion or belief, and the commands from God leaves no hint of allowing us to believe in anyone else .i.e Allah, Hindu gods, (Krishna, Vishnu and the other 10,000 other gods,! Except God!
Mark 12:29
And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment

If you make any other claim you once again are picking and choosing (from the Bible) what you want to believe and clearly rejecting the warnings to Worship and serve other gods.

Is this a correct statement of the Baha' religion's belief?

The Baha’i teachings center around unity, and Baha’is believe in the essential unity of all religions. Baha’u’llah emphasized the importance of unity, oneness and harmony in all human interactions, and said that the collective maturation of the human race has now brought us to the stage in our development where we can recognize our interdependence. The successive prophets and messengers founded their Faiths at different times in history, and each of those religions, Baha’is believe, form part of one single meta-religion—a unified, systematic, progressive revelation, one school with many teachers.
 
For all who deny the Lord the Lord Jesus Christ........You are correct!

For those who accept the way of Salvation God has provided for any and all who would believe in his Name, he gives them the right to become Children of God!

Revelation 21:1-5
1 Then I saw “a new heaven and a new earth,” for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.
2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.
3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.
4 ‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’ or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”

5 He who was seated on the throne said, “I am making everything new!” Then he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.”
 

The Hammer

Skald
Premium Member
For all who deny the Lord the Lord Jesus Christ........You are correct!

For those who accept the way of Salvation God has provided for any and all who would believe in his Name, he gives them the right to become Children of God!

Revelation 21:1-5
1 Then I saw “a new heaven and a new earth,” for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.
2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.
3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.
4 ‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’ or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”

5 He who was seated on the throne said, “I am making everything new!” Then he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.”

None of that means anything to me.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Before I answer can you please tell me what is The Book of Revelation about?
Baha’is believe that the Book of Revelation foretells the coming of Baha’u’llah, the prophet and founder of the Baha’i Faith, and that Baha’u’llah has interpreted the major symbolic imagery of the Book of Revelation in his Book of Certitude, which he revealed in January of 1861.

Read more: The Book of Revelation, Chapter 20: A Baha’i Interpretation
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Baha’is have written entire books about it and the four Primary Figures of the Baha’i Faith have interpreted many of the verses in the Book of Revelation.

Apocalypse Secrets: Baha'i Interpretation of the Book of Revelation
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Revelation 21:1-5
1 Then I saw “a new heaven and a new earth,” for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.
2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.
3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.
4 ‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’ or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”

5 He who was seated on the throne said, “I am making everything new!” Then he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.”

Baha'is believe that the New Jerusalem is the Revelation of Baha'u'llah, including The Kitáb-i-Aqdas, which is Bahá'u'lláh's book of laws, the most Holy Book of the Baha’i Faith.

“The time foreordained unto the peoples and kindreds of the earth is now come. The promises of God, as recorded in the holy Scriptures, have all been fulfilled. Out of Zion hath gone forth the Law of God, and Jerusalem, and the hills and land thereof, are filled with the glory of His Revelation. Happy is the man that pondereth in his heart that which hath been revealed in the Books of God, the Help in Peril, the Self-Subsisting. Meditate upon this, O ye beloved of God, and let your ears be attentive unto His Word, so that ye may, by His grace and mercy, drink your fill from the crystal waters of constancy, and become as steadfast and immovable as the mountain in His Cause.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 12-13
Revelation 21:4
4 - He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.


Imagine Earth where there is no pain, crying etc. The only way to do that is to wipe everyone's memory. So what difference does it make?
You are interpreting that verse literally but it was not intended to be interpreted literally.
No more mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away means that on the new earth (after the earth has been transformed as noted above) people will be happy because the former things (painful and sorrowful things that used to exist on the old earth) will no longer exist. (From Post # #234)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
'There will be no more death’ does not mean there will be no more physical death. It means there will be no more spiritual death. There will always be physical death on earth since the human body is mortal,
 
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Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Jesus said I AM THE TRUTH.................and NOONE comes to the Father except thru Me!!
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus did not say, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man will ever come unto the Father, but by me."

It was true that during the Dispensation of Jesus Christ no man could come to the Father but by Jesus.
However, that verse only applied to the Dispensation of Jesus Christ. That Dispensation is over. We are now living in the Dispensation of Baha'u'llah.

Dispensation
  1. the divine ordering of the affairs of the world.
  2. an appointment, arrangement, or favor, as by God.
  3. a divinely appointed order or age:
e.g. the old Mosaic, or Jewish, dispensation; the new gospel, or Christian, dispensation.

Definition of dispensation | Dictionary.com

The divine ordering of the affairs of the world is through the latest Messenger of God and that Messenger is Baha'u'llah.
Baha’u’llah is the Messenger of God for the present dispensation and God wants us to recognize and follow Him.
Is this a correct statement of the Baha' religion's belief?

The Baha’i teachings center around unity, and Baha’is believe in the essential unity of all religions. Baha’u’llah emphasized the importance of unity, oneness and harmony in all human interactions, and said that the collective maturation of the human race has now brought us to the stage in our development where we can recognize our interdependence. The successive prophets and messengers founded their Faiths at different times in history, and each of those religions, Baha’is believe, form part of one single meta-religion—a unified, systematic, progressive revelation, one school with many teachers.
Yes, that is a correct statement.
 

The Hammer

Skald
Premium Member
For all who deny the Lord the Lord Jesus Christ........You are correct!

For those who accept the way of Salvation God has provided for any and all who would believe in his Name, he gives them the right to become Children of God!

Revelation 21:1-5
1 Then I saw “a new heaven and a new earth,” for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.
2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.
3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.
4 ‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’ or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”

5 He who was seated on the throne said, “I am making everything new!” Then he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.”

I will rise from the deep again. Reborn anew as always.

"137.
I trow I hung on that windy Tree
nine whole days and nights,
stabbed with a spear, offered to Odin,
myself to mine own self given,
high on that Tree of which none hath heard
from what roots it rises to heaven.

138.
None refreshed me ever with food or drink,
I peered right down in the deep;
crying aloud I lifted the Runes
then back I fell from thence.

139.
Nine mighty songs I learned from the great
son of Bale-thorn, Bestla's sire;
I drank a measure of the wondrous Mead,
with the Soulstirrer's drops I was showered.

140.
Ere long I bare fruit, and throve full well,
I grew and waxed in wisdom;
word following word, I found me words,
deed following deed, I wrought deeds.

141.
Hidden Runes shalt thou seek and interpreted signs,
many symbols of might and power,
by the great Singer painted, by the high Powers fashioned,
graved by the Utterer of gods.

142.
For gods graved Odin, for elves graved Daïn,
Dvalin the Dallier for dwarfs,
All-wise for Jötuns, and I, of myself,
graved some for the sons of men.

143.
Dost know how to write, dost know how to read,
dost know how to paint, dost know how to prove,
dost know how to ask, dost know how to offer,
dost know how to send, dost know how to spend?

144.
Better ask for too little than offer too much,
like the gift should be the boon;
better not to send than to overspend.
........
Thus Odin graved ere the world began;
Then he rose from the deep, and came again"
 
Baha’is believe that the Book of Revelation foretells the coming of Baha’u’llah, the prophet and founder of the Baha’i Faith, and that Baha’u’llah has interpreted the major symbolic imagery of the Book of Revelation in his Book of Certitude, which he revealed in January of 1861.

Read more: The Book of Revelation, Chapter 20: A Baha’i Interpretation
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Baha’is have written entire books about it and the four Primary Figures of the Baha’i Faith have interpreted many of the verses in the Book of Revelation.
So I asked the question what is Revelation about? I was alitte misleading in my question, but figured you would lknow that.

The question is WHO IS THE BOOK OF REVELATION ABOUT, well it tells us that.

My Friend, Please read the first verse!..............
The last book (Revelation) as is all of the Bible starting with Genesis is about Jesus Christ, whether it is prophetic about his coming and his purpose for coming or directly speaking of his time on earth, or HIS TRIUMPH Return to establish his Reign on earth and in Heaven.

By the way, "Revelation" definition:
a surprising and previously unknown fact, especially one that is made known in a dramatic way.

Revelation 1:1-2
The Revelation of Jesus Christ,
which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.


THEN THE LAST VERSES of Revelation!!

Revelation 22:16-21
16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches
. I am the root and the offspring of David,(The promised Messiah and King who will reign on the Throne of David forever) and the bright and morning star.

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

18 For I (Jesus) testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

21 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

I don't see how you or anyone else can claim these scriptures are speaking of anyone other than the ONE they very clearly say they are declaring.
There is no other prophet, messiah ,Christ, Eternal judge etc. that mankind is waiting for or hoping for, for Jesus Christ is the ONLY Son of God, Son of Man, and KING of KINGS, Lord of lords!
 
So I asked the question what is Revelation about? I was alitte misleading in my question, but figured you would lknow that.

The question is WHO IS THE BOOK OF REVELATION ABOUT, well it tells us that.

My Friend, Please read the first verse!..............
The last book (Revelation) as is all of the Bible starting with Genesis is about Jesus Christ, whether it is prophetic about his coming and his purpose for coming or directly speaking of his time on earth, or HIS TRIUMPH Return to establish his Reign on earth and in Heaven.

By the way, "Revelation" definition:
a surprising and previously unknown fact, especially one that is made known in a dramatic way.

Revelation 1:1-2
The Revelation of Jesus Christ,
which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.


THEN THE LAST VERSES of Revelation!!

Revelation 22:16-21
16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches
. I am the root and the offspring of David,(The promised Messiah and King who will reign on the Throne of David forever) and the bright and morning star.

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

18 For I (Jesus) testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

21 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

I don't see how you or anyone else can claim these scriptures are speaking of anyone other than the ONE they very clearly say they are declaring.
There is no other prophet, messiah ,Christ, Eternal judge etc. that mankind is waiting for or hoping for, for Jesus Christ is the ONLY Son of God, Son of Man, and KING of KINGS, Lord of lords!
Hi Saved by grace 2,

Who says Revelation is just about Jesus? Sure, there's Jesus stuff in there, but that book is wild! It's like a crazy dream with monsters and angels, all mixed with messages about the future. Some people, mostly Christians, see Jesus as the main character, the big hero coming back. That makes sense, right? But others see different meanings in the symbols. I remember going door to door and always had at the ready Revelations 21:4. Tip of the tongue and still think about it. (I know so many verses by heart and also commercials like Mr. Clean... )

I think the bible is open to interpretation, especially Revelations. I also was raised reading different versions of the bible and trying to grapple with the varied interpretations of some verses. (I have read a few versions but not my cup of tea. I like comparing verses but am happy to let AI do that for me)

I hope all is well.
 
Jesus did not say, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man will ever come unto the Father, but by me."

It was true that during the Dispensation of Jesus Christ no man could come to the Father but by Jesus.
However, that verse only applied to the Dispensation of Jesus Christ. That Dispensation is over. We are now living in the Dispensation of Baha'u'llah.
By saying this! It means you do not know why Jesus came to save mankind! And The absolute necessity to be Born Again.

The entire and only purpose Jesus declared in John 14:6 (TO ALL GENERATIONS) was to declare that (ALL MANKIND) need salvation. And that the purpose for Jesus dying for our sins was to establish:
THE ONLY WAY for us to be forgiven for restored to the FATHER. II Corinthians 5:21 He made Christ who knew no sin to [judicially] be sin on our behalf, so that in Him we would become the righteousness of God [that is, we would be made acceptable to Him and placed in a right relationship with Him by His gracious lovingkindness].
THE ONLY TRUTH concerning ALL THINGS, i.e., salvation, The Coming Kingdom, and the establishing of the New Jerusalem, judgement of mankind, etc.). Ephesians 1:1-23
1 Blessed and worthy of praise be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly realms in Christ, 4 just as [in His love] He chose us in Christ [actually selected us for Himself as His own] before the foundation of the world, so that we would be holy [that is, consecrated, set apart for Him, purpose-driven] and blameless in His sight. In love 5 He predestined and lovingly planned for us to be adopted to Himself as [His own] children through Jesus Christ, in accordance with the kind intention and good pleasure of His will— 6 to the praise of His glorious grace and favor, which He so freely bestowed on us in the Beloved [His Son, Jesus Christ]. 7 In Him (Jesus)we have redemption [that is, our deliverance and salvation] through His blood, [which paid the penalty for our sin and resulted in] the forgiveness and complete pardon of our sin, in accordance with the riches of His grace 8 which He lavished on us. In all wisdom and understanding [with practical insight] 9 He made known to us the mystery of His will according to His good pleasure, which He purposed in Christ, 10 with regard to the fulfillment of the times [that is, the end of history, the climax of the ages]—to bring all things together in Christ, [both] things in the heavens and things on the earth. 11 In Him also we have [d]received an inheritance [a destiny—we were claimed by God as His own], having been predestined (chosen, appointed beforehand) according to the purpose of Him who works everything in agreement with the counsel and design of His will, 12 so that we who were the first to hope in Christ [who first put our confidence in Him as our Lord and Savior] would exist to the praise of His glory. 13 In Him, you also, when you heard the word of truth, the good news of your salvation, and [as a result] believed in Him, were stamped with the seal of the promised Holy Spirit [the One promised by Christ] as owned and protected [by God]. 14 The Spirit is the [e]guarantee [the first installment, the pledge, a foretaste] of our inheritance until the redemption of God’s own [purchased] possession [His believers], to the praise of His glory.

15 For this reason, because I have heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all God’s people, 16 I do not cease to give thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers; 17 [I always pray] that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may grant you a spirit of wisdom and of revelation [that gives you a deep and personal and intimate insight] into the true knowledge of Him (JESUS) [for we know the Father through the Son]. 18 And [I pray] that the eyes of your heart [the very center and core of your being] may be enlightened [flooded with light by the Holy Spirit], so that you will know and cherish the [f]hope [the divine guarantee, the confident expectation] to which He has called you, the riches of His glorious inheritance in the [g]saints (God’s people), 19 and [so that you will begin to know] what the immeasurable and unlimited and surpassing greatness of His [active, spiritual] power is in us who believe. These are in accordance with the working of His mighty strength 20 which He [h]produced in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His own right hand in the heavenly places, 21 far above all rule and authority and power and dominion [whether angelic or human], and [far above] every name that is named [above every title that can be conferred], not only in this age and world but also in the one to come. 22 And He [i]put all things [in every realm] in subjection under Christ’s feet, and [j]appointed Him as [supreme and authoritative] head over all things in the church, 23 which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills and completes all things in all [believers].

NOTE:
THIS ENTIRE 1st Chapter is speaking of our TRIUNE ONE GOD! Father, Son, Holy Spirit!! All three persons in the Godhead taking part in: Creating us, choosing us, redeeming us, filling us with the seal of the Holy Spirit, and Planning for us to live Eternally in the Kingdom of Jesus Christ, who is and always will be far above ALL rule, authority, power and dominion and every NOT ONLY IN THIS AGE BUT IN THE AGE TO COME


THE ONLY LIFE for without believing in Jesus Christ, the Creator of all Life, We have NO (Eternal) life.

John 5:19-23
Jesus gave them this answer: “Very truly I tell you, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does. 20 For the Father loves the Son and shows him all he does. Yes, and he will show him even greater works than these, so that you will be amazed. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son gives life to whom he is pleased to give it. 22 Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son, 23 that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him.
 
All Christians say that Revelation is about Jesus because for them EVERYTHING is about Jesus, only in reality everything in the Bible is NOT about Jesus.
Hi Trailblazer

Hah, I get the callout. The bible is a pretty old book but there are older books. I wonder why god waited so long to inspire his scribes. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John tell remarkably similar tales but they differ in many important areas.

Perhaps a newer book like the Book of Mormon might have more details? (I'm not religious just pivoting on newer books might be more true than older books...)

I hope all is well.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Perhaps a newer book like the Book of Mormon might have more details? (I'm not religious just pivoting on newer books might be more true than older books...)
Well, regarding 'Books of God' the following explains what Baha'is believe.

In the context of the following passage, the City of God is the Revelation of God from God to humanity.

“They that valiantly labor in quest of God, will, when once they have renounced all else but Him, be so attached and wedded unto that City, that a moment’s separation from it would to them be unthinkable. They will hearken unto infallible proofs from the Hyacinth of that assembly, and will receive the surest testimonies from the beauty of its Rose, and the melody of its Nightingale. Once in about a thousand years shall this City be renewed and readorned….

That City is none other than the Word of God revealed in every age and dispensation.
In the days of Moses it was the Pentateuch; in the days of Jesus, the Gospel; in the days of Muhammad, the Messenger of God, the Qur’án; in this day, the Bayán; and in the Dispensation of Him Whom God will make manifest, His own Book—the Book unto which all the Books of former Dispensations must needs be referred, the Book that standeth amongst them all transcendent and supreme.”

Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 269-270
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
So I asked the question what is Revelation about? I was a litte misleading in my question, but figured you would lknow that.

The question is WHO IS THE BOOK OF REVELATION ABOUT, well it tells us that.
No, the BOOK does not tell us anything at all because the BOOK does not talk and say anything....
The BOOK needs to be interpreted by humans who assign meanings to the BOOK.
You assign one meaning, I assign another meaning. The same applies to the entire Bible.
I don't see how you or anyone else can claim these scriptures are speaking of anyone other than the ONE they very clearly say they are declaring.
I suggest you give it up for lost. Jesus Christ is not going to return to this earth. He said so.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more.

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.


What do you do with these verses? How do you explain them? I have been posting to Christians for 10 years and not one Christian has ever been able to explain why Jesus said these things IF Jesus is going to return.

I rest my case.
There is no other prophet, messiah ,Christ, Eternal judge etc. that mankind is waiting for or hoping for, for Jesus Christ is the ONLY Son of God, Son of Man, and KING of KINGS, Lord of lords!
Correction: There is no other prophet, messiah ,Christ, Eternal judge etc. that Christians are waiting for or hoping for.
Nobody except Christians are waiting and hoping for the same Jesus to return to earth.

But Christians are waiting for nothing, because Jesus is NEVER going to return to this world.

Jesus never promised to return to this world, not once in the New Testament. Jesus said His work was finished here and He was no more in the world. That means that the return of Christ has to be another Person. That Person was Baha'u'llah.

Jesus Christ is the Son of God and the Son of Man.
Baha'u'llah was the 'return' of the Son of Man and the KING of KINGS and the Lord of lords!

Christians believe that the following verses are about Jesus, but if Jesus was the Son of man, as Jesus claimed to be, the following verses cannot be about the Jesus.

Daniel 7:13-14 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Those verses are about Baha'u'llah who was one like Jesus, who was the return of the Son of man.

Jesus ascended into heaven. Baha’u’llah, one like the son of man, descended from the heaven of the Will of God, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. Those verses are about an earthly Kingdom, not a heavenly Kingdom. Jesus’ Kingdom is in heaven, Baha’u’llah’s Kingdom will be on earth, after it is built by humans.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
 
Hi Saved by grace 2,

Who says Revelation is just about Jesus? Sure, there's Jesus stuff in there, but that book is wild! It's like a crazy dream with monsters and angels, all mixed with messages about the future. Some people, mostly Christians, see Jesus as the main character, the big hero coming back. That makes sense, right? But others see different meanings in the symbols. I remember going door to door and always had at the ready Revelations 21:4. Tip of the tongue and still think about it. (I know so many verses by heart and also commercials like Mr. Clean... )

I think the bible is open to interpretation, especially Revelations. I also was raised reading different versions of the bible and trying to grapple with the varied interpretations of some verses. (I have read a few versions but not my cup of tea. I like comparing verses but am happy to let AI do that for me)

I hope all is well.
You are correct Seeking Balance! THERE IS A WHOLE LOT OF Spectacular EVENTS, GOOD AND BAD, HAPPENING IN REVELATION!

As for Revelation, Revelation says that! Please read the scriptures in Revelation 1:1-2 AND the end of the book to show that Revelation starts with Jesus and ends with it.
If One understands that, then it is very easy to see Jesus as the One appears in White,(RIGHTEOUS LORD) with fire in his eyes, and a sword coming out of his Mouth ( THE ONE WHO WILL JUDGE ALL MANKIND) Who has the seven Stars in his hand ( THE CHURCH who then in the next few chapters admonishes HIS Church and warns them to repent of certain ungodly acts).

Then you find all creation bowing before the Throne of God and the LAMB that WAS SLAIN

Revelation 5:13-14

Then I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them, saying:
“To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb
be praise and honor and glory and power,
for ever and ever!”
14 The four living creatures said, “Amen,” and the elders fell down and worshiped.

I could go on show that Jesus ( the Lamb) that was slain, is the only one worthy to open the scrolls that brings forth Judgement upon the earth.

Revelation 5:6-11
Then I saw a Lamb, looking as if it had been slain, standing at the center of the throne, encircled by the four living creatures and the elders. The Lamb had seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven spirits[a] of God sent out into all the earth. 7 He went and took the scroll from the right hand of him who sat on the throne. 8 And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of God’s people. 9 And they sang a new song, saying:

“You are worthy to take the scroll
and to open its seals,
because you were slain,
and with your blood you purchased for God
persons from every tribe and language and people and nation.
10 You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God,
and they will reign[b] on the earth.”

I could point out that in Chapter 7, that all creation are bowing before the Throne of God and the Lamb again worshiping the Father and the Son

Revelation 7:9-17
After this I looked, and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and before the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. 10 And they cried out in a loud voice:

Salvation belongs to our God,
who sits on the throne,
and to the Lamb.

11 All the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures. They fell down on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, 12 saying:

“Amen!
Praise and glory
and wisdom and thanks and honor
and power and strength
be to our God for ever and ever.
Amen!”
13 Then one of the elders asked me, “These in white robes—who are they, and where did they come from?”

14 I answered, “Sir, you know.”

And he said, “These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 Therefore,

“they are before the throne of God
and serve him day and night in his temple;
and he who sits on the throne
will shelter them with his presence.
16 ‘Never again will they hunger;
never again will they thirst.
The sun will not beat down on them,’[a]
nor any scorching heat.
17 For the Lamb at the center of the throne
will be their shepherd;
‘he will lead them to springs of living water.’[b]
‘And God will wipe away every tear from their eye
s.’[c

We can go on about Chapter 14 where the Lamb, seals protects the 144,000, which by the way are all those have been purchased by the Blood of the Lamb are redeemed from the earth.
And in CHapter 17 where Jesus (THE LAMB) is CALLED The KING of KINGS and the LORD of LORDS!! and rightfully so for he alone purchased those who would become the Firstfrutis of the Kingdom of God.
Rev. 17:
They will wage war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will triumph over them because he is Lord of lords and King of kings—and with him will be his called, chosen and faithful followers.”
( These are The 144,000, the Church, the redeemed, as those who were purchased by the Blood of the Lamb!)

As for the BIBLE!! The THEME and the ultimate purpose of Genesis to Revelation is the Prophesy, point to, direct and Glorify the Son of God, who ( Before the Foundations of the world (according to scripture) was pre-planned ( predestined to be crucified) I DO NOT MEAN EVERY VERSE , Neither I nor any Christian is claiming that.

Revelation 13:8
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him (Satan), whose names are NOT written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

This plan of God to provide salvation, and this salvation being available thru the Son of God coming to earth, taking on the form of a man, then dying for our sins was already established before God's creation ( mankind) would choose to reject God, and die (spiritually) per God's warning in Genesis 2:17
But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

In Genesis, after the fall, Jesus Christ is already prophesied to come, when God pronounced judgement on the Serpent ( Satan)
Genesis 3:15
And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; (Jesus)He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel.”
The woman can be easily understood as Israel, and even more specific Mary. The seed is Jesus Christ whom was also prophesied as being the seed that would fulfill the promise to Abraham.
Galatians 3:16
Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,” who is Christ.

But we also see the means by which God would provide forgiveness for mankind in Genesis 3:21
Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.

Here is another theme from Genesis to Revelation.......A life given for a life. In (typology, and by means of creating a temporary means of forgiveness for man's sins, the sacrifice of an animal was temporarily established BY GOD and was acceptable to forgive man and give him a temporary and limited, but not eternal ,relationship with GOD. But every animal sacrifice was meant to point us ALL to the ONE TIME sacrifice Jesus would provide for ALL MANKIND. Therefore animal sacrifices are NO LONGER acceptable.

There now (Forever) is no need and no other way for us to be restored to the Father. For Jesus, The ONLY BEGOTTEN SON of the FATHER
WHo took on the form of a man, came as the LAMB who takes away the sins of the world, that any who would Confess Jesus as Lord and accept the sacrifice he made for us, Will be forgiven of sins, Declared Righteous, and brought into the Family and Kingdom of God.

John 1:12
But to as many as did receive and welcome Him, He (Jesus) gave the right [the authority, the privilege] to become children of God, that is, to those who believe in (adhere to, trust in, and rely on) His name—


AKJV
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
By saying this! It means you do not know why Jesus came to save mankind! And The absolute necessity to be Born Again.
No, what I said does not mean that I do not know why Jesus came to save mankind which is an absolute necessity to be Born Again.
I know that, but THAT has nothing to do with what I said.

I said: Jesus did not say, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man will ever come unto the Father, but by me."

It was true that during the Dispensation of Jesus Christ no man could come to the Father but by Jesus.
However, that verse only applied to the Dispensation of Jesus Christ. That Dispensation is over. We are now living in the Dispensation of Baha'u'llah.


What you just did is called a red herring. Instead of responding to what I said you redirected the conversation and went off on another unrelated topic.

What is the fallacy of redirection?


What Is a Red Herring Fallacy? | Definition & Examples


A red herring fallacy refers to an attempt to change the subject and divert attention from the original issue. In other words, a seemingly solid but ultimately irrelevant argument is introduced into the discussion, either on purpose or by mistake.Apr 5, 2023

What Is a Red Herring Fallacy? | Definition & Examples - Scribbr
The entire and only purpose Jesus declared in John 14:6 (TO ALL GENERATIONS) was to declare that (ALL MANKIND) need salvation. And that the purpose for Jesus dying for our sins was to establish:
THE ONLY WAY for us to be forgiven for restored to the FATHER.
I already know that but that is not related to what I said above, the post you are responding to.

Now that we have the salvation conferred by Jesus it is time to build the kingdom of God on earth, which was the mission of Baha'u'llah.
NOTE: THIS ENTIRE 1st Chapter is speaking of our TRIUNE ONE GOD! Father, Son, Holy Spirit!! All three persons in the Godhead taking part in: Creating us, choosing us, redeeming us, filling us with the seal of the Holy Spirit, and Planning for us to live Eternally in the Kingdom of Jesus Christ, who is and always will be far above ALL rule, authority, power and dominion and every NOT ONLY IN THIS AGE BUT IN THE AGE TO COME
That is only YOUR interpretation of those verses. I categorically reject the belief that Jesus will rule on earth in the age to come.
That age is already here since it was ushered in by the Bab and Baha'u'llah.

Jesus rules in heaven, not on earth. Jesus will never rule on earth.

“The Throne upon which He sat is the Eternal Throne from which Christ reigns for ever, a heavenly throne, not an earthly one, for the things of earth pass away but heavenly things pass not away. He re-interpreted and completed the Law of Moses and fulfilled the Law of the Prophets. His word conquered the East and the West. His Kingdom is everlasting."
Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks

From: THE TRUE MEANING OF THE PROPHECIES CONCERNING THE COMING OF CHRIST
THE ONLY LIFE for without believing in Jesus Christ, the Creator of all Life, We have NO (Eternal) life.
I know, and that is why I believe in Jesus. Baha'u'llah also conferred eternal life, but Baha'is cannot believe in Baha'u'llah only, we have to also believe in Jesus.
 
I suggest you give it up for lost. Jesus Christ is not going to return to this earth. He said so.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more.

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.


What do you do with these verses? How do you explain them? I have been posting to Christians for 10 years and not one Christian has ever been able to explain why Jesus said these things IF Jesus is going to return.
So I have read and seen you post this several times, and I have posted several scriptures that Jesus spoke of and said "THE SON OF MAN" which clearly says the Son of Man will be coming in the clouds, and which you reject them as speaking of Jesus. You even agreed in Acts 1:10 this is speaking of Jesus but only his Spirit which makes no difference, it promises he is returning, It says he is coming back!! But we just keep going round and round.
Acts 1:10
This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”

. Jesus Christ and his return are not misunderstood by any Christian, as to who Jesus is referring to other than himself.
And all of Revelation when speaking of the LAMB, The King of Kings is speaking of Jesus Christ.

You have made a VERY TRUE statement though and it is Prophetic. Only the Christians believe Jesus is returning. ONLY Christians TRULY Believe him to be the Son of God, God the Son, who before time began was in Fellowship with the Father, and Before the Foundations of the Earth was Crucified (Pre-destined) to die for the Sins of the world. And for all who believe and are TRULY born again, The Holy Spirit was then and still is sent to Live in the Hearts of all who believe, teaching them all things and and conforming them into the image of the SON.

SO BY YOUR OWN WORDS ONLY THE CHRISTIAN KNOWS AND SEES THIS........

John 10:
Very truly I tell you Pharisees, anyone who does not enter the sheep pen by the gate, but climbs in by some other way, is a thief and a robber. 2 The one who enters by the gate is the shepherd of the sheep. 3 The gatekeeper opens the gate for him, and the sheep listen to his voice. He calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. 4 When he has brought out all his own, he goes on ahead of them, and his sheep follow him because they know his voice. 5 But they will never follow a stranger; in fact, they will run away from him because they do not recognize a stranger’s voice.” 6 Jesus used this figure of speech, but the Pharisees did not understand what he was telling them.
Therefore Jesus said again, “Very truly I tell you, I am the gate for the sheep. 8 All who have come before me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep have not listened to them. 9 I am the gate; whoever enters through me will be saved.[a] They will come in and go out, and find pasture. 10 The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full.

11 “I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep. 12 The hired hand is not the shepherd and does not own the sheep. So when he sees the wolf coming, he abandons the sheep and runs away. Then the wolf attacks the flock and scatters it. 13 The man runs away because he is a hired hand and cares nothing for the sheep.

14 “I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me— 15 just as the Father knows me and I know the Father—and I lay down my life for the sheep.


I really hope and pray that you could see this. But perceptions are Truth to us ALL. Even if they are not True!
 
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Bird123

Well-Known Member
I would like to pose a question for theists, namely: what is God's top priority? I cannot prove that no god exists, but there are many types of gods that I can prove do not exist.


I know that an omnipotent god whose top priority is preventing rape and murder cannot exist.
I know that an omnipotent god whose top priority is preventing childhood cancer cannot exist.
I know that an omnipotent god whose top priority is preventing starvation cannot exist.
I know that an omnipotent god whose top priority is preventing the extinction of 99% of the species he created cannot exist.
I know that an omnipotent god whose top priority is having a personal relationship with all of his human creations cannot exist.
I know that an omnipotent god whose top priority is having all humans believe in him cannot exist.


I could give many other examples, but I think the point has been made. If God exists, and he is omnipotent, his top priority cannot be any of the above things. So what is God's top priority? Since it seems like one of the items I listed above would be the top priority of the god of classical theism, it almost seems that if God does exist, then his top priority is to make it look like he doesn't exist.
God's greatest priority is the education of God's children. God educates the kiddies through their free will. One's choices and actions determine the lessons. Our actions and choices return, in time, not as punishment , but to teach us what our actions and choices really mean. This also teaches one to Love Unconditionally. After all, that is what everyone wants returning.

When times are good, one sits back and enjoys the ride. When adversity hits, one must think, analyze, study, plan, experiment and learn so much on the road to resolution. So often our challenges lead one forward to a Higher Level of Knowledge and Understanding.

This physical universe exists not for God but for God's children. The time-based causal nature of the universe is perfect for learning. God's Greatest moment is when that light bulb goes off over someone's head and they Understand. This can be about any subject!!

That's what I see (believe/feel/think Language). It's very clear!!
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
So I have read and seen you post this several times, and I have posted several scriptures that Jesus spoke of and said "THE SON OF MAN" which clearly says the Son of Man will be coming in the clouds, and which you reject them as speaking of Jesus.
I suggest you read what I wrote on this thread: Who is the Son of man who will come in the clouds of heaven?

Son of man coming with the clouds means that the return of Christ will appear in the form of another human being. The term “clouds” as used in the Bible means those things that are contrary to the ways and desires of men. Just like the physical clouds prevent the eyes of men from beholding the sun, these things hindered men from recognizing the return of Christ.

In other words, the judgment of most people was clouded when Christ returned and it is still clouded for most people.

One thing that clouds the judgment of Christians is their desire for the same Jesus to return to earth.
You even agreed in Acts 1:10 this is speaking of Jesus but only his Spirit which makes no difference, it promises he is returning, It says he is coming back!! But we just keep going round and round.
Acts 1:10
This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”
Acts 1:9 After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight. 10 They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. 11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”

The disciples (Men of Galilee) were staring up into the sky. The two men dressed in white (angels) came along and asked why they were staring up into the sky. The two men dressed in white then wondered why the disciples were staring up into the sky, and then they said that the same Jesus who was taken up to heaven will return as he went to heaven. The text does not say that the disciples saw a body go up to heaven.

It was the Christ Spirit that ascended, not a body, which is why the angels wondered why the disciples were staring into the sky, since there was nothing to look at that the disciples could see; but angels can see spirits, so the angels could see the spirit of Jesus ascend into the clouds.

"This same Jesus .... will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven"

That does not mean the same man Jesus who walked the earth 2000 years ago will come back to earth.

Jesus ascended as a spirit, not as a body. The spirit of Jesus returned in another person with another body.

This same Jesus means that the same spirit of Jesus (the Christ Spirit) will come down from heaven and will appear in the form of a human being who has the Christ Spirit. That was Baha'u'llah. Though delivered from the womb of Mary, the soul of Jesus came down from heaven. The soul of the man who has the Christ Spirit (Baha'u'llah, who was the return of Christ) came down from heaven in the same way that Jesus came down from heaven. He was sent by God.
Jesus Christ and his return and not misunderstood by any Christian as to who Jesus is referring to other than himself.
And all of Revelation when speaking of the LAMB, The King of Kings is speaking of Jesus Christ.
According to Baha'is, Baha'u'llah is the angel Michael in the Book of Revelation; the Bab is the Lamb in the Book of Revelation. Mar 19, 2002

Baha'i World Faith
https://goodfaithmedia.org/bahai-world-faith-cms-492/
Good Faith Media
https://goodfaithmedia.


The King of Kings is speaking of Baha'u'llah.

“Ye are but vassals, O kings of the earth! He Who is the King of Kings hath appeared, arrayed in His most wondrous glory, and is summoning you unto Himself, the Help in Peril, the Self-Subsisting. Take heed lest pride deter you from recognizing the Source of Revelation, lest the things of this world shut you out as by a veil from Him Who is the Creator of heaven. Arise, and serve Him Who is the Desire of all nations, Who hath created you through a word from Him, and ordained you to be, for all time, the emblems of His sovereignty.”

Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 211-212

I really hope and pray that you could see this. But perceptions are Truth to us ALL. Even if they are not True!
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Before I answer can you please tell me what is The Book of Revelation about?
Revelation is a revealing. A revealing about the happy future for Earth - Revelation 22:2; 21:4-5
From paradise lost in Eden to paradise regained for humble meek people - Psalms 37:9-11; 22:26; Matthew 5:5
Jesus coming to restore what was lost - 1st Corinthians 15:24-26; Isaiah 25:8; Isaiah chapter 35.
 
his same Jesus means that the same spirit of Jesus (the Christ Spirit) will come down from heaven and will appear in the form of a human being who has the Christ Spirit. That was Baha'u'llah. Though delivered from the womb of Mary, the soul of Jesus came down from heaven. The soul of the man who has the Christ Spirit (Baha'u'llah, who was the return of Christ) came down from heaven in the same way that Jesus came down from heaven. He was sent by God.
I want to make sure I don't jump to any conclusions based your claims, here. So correct me if I am wrong.

Jesus Christ who was born of a virgin, and died on the cross for all mankind, when after he arose from the grave he did not arise in a physical body, am I correct according to the Baha belief so far?
 
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