What will the Second Coming of Christ look like?

[sooda]

I see the delema your facing you say the second coming has taken place yet here you are not able to prove it with the scriptures.

Well, the tribulation was 42 months after... ending in August of 70 AD during the grape harvest. Christ's followers fled to Pella.. For everyone else it was hell on earth according to Josephus.

 

[3rdAngel]

Which translation of the scriptures?
Matthew 24:3.......

I prefer the KJV and some of the other versions but any and all of them are ok with me and I will explain why after this post…

MATTHEW 24:3

New Living Translation
Later, Jesus sat on the Mount of Olives. His disciples came to him privately and said, “Tell us, when will all this happen? What sign will signal your return and the end of the world?”

King James Bible
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Contemporary English Version
Later, as Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, his disciples came to him in private and asked, "When will this happen? What will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the world?"

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
And when Yeshua sat onTur d'Zaytay, his disciples came and they were saying among themselves and to him: “Tell us when these things will be and what will be the sign of your advent and of the end of the world.”

GOD'S WORD® Translation
As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, his disciples came to him privately and said, "Tell us, when will this happen? What will be the sign that you are coming again, and when will the world come to an end?"

King James 2000 Bible
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of your coming, and of the end of the world?

American King James Version
And as he sat on the mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of your coming, and of the end of the world?

American Standard Version
And as he sat on the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what'shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Douay-Rheims Bible
And when he was sitting on mount Olivet, the disciples came to him privately, saying: Tell us when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the consummation of the world?

English Revised Version
And as he sat on the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Webster's Bible Translation
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, Tell us, when will these things be? and what will be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Wycliffe 1395
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Tyndale 1525
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Coverdale 1535
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Bishops' Bible 1568
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Geneva Bible 1599
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

John Wesley 1755
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Revised Version 1881
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

American Standard Version 1901
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Spanish Reina Valera 1909 (el fin del mundo)
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Italian Diodati (fin del mondo)
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Lamsa's 1936 translation of the Syriac Pe****ta
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Alford's translation
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Bible in Basic English 1960
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Phillips translation
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Douay Version 1950
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

New Life Bible 1969
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

New American Bible 1970
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Living Bible 1981
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

New Jerusalem Bible 1985
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

New Century Version 1988
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Contemporary English Version 1991
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

World English Bible
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Hebrew Names Version
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

God's Word Translation 1995
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

New Living Bible 1998
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Third Millenium Bible 1998
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Easy to Read Version 2001
And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Hope this helps

 

[3rdAngel]

Continuing...

GREEK word used in Matthew 24:3 is αιωνος noun - genitive singular masculine aion ahee-ohn': an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; a Messianic period (present or future)

Strong's Concordance
aión: a space of time, an age
Original Word: αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: aión
Phonetic Spelling: (ahee-ohn')
Definition: a space of time, an age
Usage: an age, a cycle (of time), especially of the present age as contrasted with the future age, and of one of a series of ages stretching to infinity.

Our world is connected to time. It is not outside of time, so MATTHEW 24:3 αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ; Transliteration: aión means; END OF AGE; END OF TIME; END OF WORLD which is the reason some bible translations translate aión as END OF AGE (TIME) and others END OF THE WORLD.

NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from a prim. root appar. mean. continued duration
Definition
a space of time, an age
NASB Translation
age (20), ages (6), ancient time (1), beginning of time (1), course (1), eternal (2), eternity (1), ever* (2), forever (27), forever and ever (20), forevermore (2), long ago (1), never* (1), old (1), time (1), world (7), worlds (1).

The above times αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ; aión is translated as worlds, time, forevermore, forever and ever, ever, eternal, eternity etc is not consistant and varies with every translation used.

………

CONCLUSION: In regards to MATTHEW 24:3, if the Greek word aión is translated as “END OF AGE”, “END OF WORLD” or “END TIMES” it does not matter to the context of MATTHEW 24:3 which links “END OF AGE”, “END OF WORLD” or “END TIMES” to the “SECOND COMING” and what happens at the second coming because our world is connected to time. It is not outside of time, so MATTHEW 24:3 αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ; Transliteration: aión means; END OF AGE; END OF TIME; END OF WORLD which is the reason some bible translations translate aión as END OF AGE (TIME) and others END OF THE WORLD.

 

[3rdAngel]

Let's dig a little deeper...

WHAT MUST TAKE PLACE BEFORE THE END OF THE WORLD/AGE (Matthew 24)?

MATTHEW 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

1. Destruction of Juresalem *Matthew 24:15-22 (fulfilled)

2. False teachers, messengers, false Christs and false prophets *Matthew 24:4-5; 11; 24 (Being fulfilled and continues to be fulfilled 40,000 Christian denominations today)

3. Nations will rise againse nations and wars and rumours of wars *Matthew 24:6-7; 10 (being fulfilled)

4. God’s people will be persecuted for sharing God’s Word *Matthew 24:9 (Being fulfilled and continues to be fulfilled)

5. The gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness to all nations; and then shall the end come (needs to be fulfilled in a generation yet to be fulfilled). *Matthew 24:14

6. Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken *Matthew 24:29-30.

7. So likewise you, when you shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors *Matthew 24:33

8. It will be as it was in the days that were before the flood *Matthew 24:38-39

.............

CONCLUSION: In other words, the annihilation of this world, era, age, and so on, will not be triggered by the collapse of a single sign listed in Matthew 24, but, all the signs of this aion (world) will converge together to bring the end and the second coming which will be a public event. ALL the signs have not been fulfilled and therefore no "SECOND COMING". Next we will look at what the scriptures say happens at the second coming and how "THE LAST DAYS", "END OF THE AGE" or "END OF THE WORLD connect to "THE SECOND COMING"...

More to come...

 

[sooda]

Continuing...

GREEK word used in Matthew 24:3 is αιωνος noun - genitive singular masculine aion ahee-ohn': an age; by extension, perpetuity (also past); by implication, the world; a Messianic period (present or future)

Strong's Concordance
aión: a space of time, an age
Original Word: αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: aión
Phonetic Spelling: (ahee-ohn')
Definition: a space of time, an age
Usage: an age, a cycle (of time), especially of the present age as contrasted with the future age, and of one of a series of ages stretching to infinity.

Our world is connected to time. It is not outside of time, so MATTHEW 24:3 αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ; Transliteration: aión means; END OF AGE; END OF TIME; END OF WORLD which is the reason some bible translations translate aión as END OF AGE (TIME) and others END OF THE WORLD.

NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from a prim. root appar. mean. continued duration
Definition
a space of time, an age
NASB Translation
age (20), ages (6), ancient time (1), beginning of time (1), course (1), eternal (2), eternity (1), ever* (2), forever (27), forever and ever (20), forevermore (2), long ago (1), never* (1), old (1), time (1), world (7), worlds (1).

The above times αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ; aión is translated as worlds, time, forevermore, forever and ever, ever, eternal, eternity etc is not consistant and varies with every translation used.

………

CONCLUSION: In regards to MATTHEW 24:3, if the Greek word aión is translated as “END OF AGE”, “END OF WORLD” or “END TIMES” it does not matter to the context of MATTHEW 24:3 which links “END OF AGE”, “END OF WORLD” or “END TIMES” to the “SECOND COMING” because our world is connected to time. It is not outside of time, so MATTHEW 24:3 αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ; Transliteration: aión means; END OF AGE; END OF TIME; END OF WORLD which is the reason some bible translations translate aión as END OF AGE (TIME) and others END OF THE WORLD.

Perpetuity means forever.

 

[3rdAngel]

What we will look at now are other scriptures that show that MATTHEW 24:3 is in relation to “THE SECOND COMING” and that “THE SECOND COMING is in relation to “THE END OF THE WORLD” which renders the “CONTEXT of MATTHEW 24:3 to “THE END OF THE WORLD

.............

DID THE APOSTLES BELIEVE THEY WERE LIVING IN THE LAST DAYS BEFORE THE SECOND COMING OR THE TIME OF THE END?

1 JOHN 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as you have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; by which we know that it is the last time. (reference to Matthew 24:24)

JUDE 1:17-18 [17], But, beloved, remember you the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ; [18], How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.

2 PETER 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts.

1 PETER 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith to salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

JAMES 5:1-3 1, Go to now, you rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come on you. 2, Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are moth-eaten. 3, Your gold and silver is corroded; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. You have heaped treasure together for the last days.

2 TIMOTHY 3:1-5 1, This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2, For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3, Without natural affection, truce breakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, 4, Traitors, heady, high minded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; 5, Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

Yep the Apsotles certainly belived they were living in the last days

WHAT HAPPENS AT THE SEOCOND COMING (MATTHEW 24:3) ?

MATTHEW 13:37-42 37, He answered and said to them, He that sows the good seed is the Son of man; 38, The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; 39, The enemy t1hat sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. 40, As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. 41, The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42, And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

The second coming is the harvest and the end of the world

Acts 1:9-11 9, And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. 10, And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 11, Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

REVELATION 1:7 Behold, he comes with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

MATTHEW 24:27, For as the lightning comes out of the east, and shines even to the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

MATTHEW 24:30-31 [30], And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. [31], And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

The second coming will be a public event and every eye shall see him coming in great glory…

2 PETER 3:10 [10], But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

The second coming will come as a theif in the night and people will not expect it at which time the heavens shall pass away with a great noise and the elements shall melt with fervent heat and the earth shall be burnt up

1 CORINTHIANS 15:50-54 50, Now this I say, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither does corruption inherit incorruption. 51, Behold, I show you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53, For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54, So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

1 THESSALONIANS 4:16-17 16, For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:17, Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The second coming is a public event where the trump of God is sounded and the dead in Christ shall rise the wicked are put to death and God’s people will meet the Lord in the air and forever be with the Lord…

................

CONCLUSION: The second coming is linked to the end of the world and the time of the end of all things and the end of the age of mankind. It is linked with the destruction of the wicked and the gathering of God’s faithful people; It is a public event and every eye shall see him coming in the clouds of heaven. The second coming will come as a theif in the night and people will not expect it at which time the heavens shall pass away with a great noise and the elements shall melt with fervent heat and the earth shall be burnt up.

Therefore MATTHEW 24:3 “END OF THE AGE” and “THE SECOND COMING” according to the scriptures is linked through the scriptures to THE END OF THE WORLD”, “THE LAST DAYS”; “END OF TIME” and the “TIME OF THE END” of mankind.

Hope this helps

 

[sooda]

Let's dig a little deeper...

WHAT MUST TAKE PLACE BEFORE THE END OF THE WORLD/AGE (Matthew 24)?

MATTHEW 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

1. Destruction of Juresalem *Matthew 24:15-22 (fulfilled)

2. False teachers, messengers, false Christs and false prophets *Matthew 24:4-5; 11; 24 (Being fulfilled and continues to be fulfilled 40,000 Christian denominations today)

3. Nations will rise againse nations and wars and rumours of wars *Matthew 24:6-7; 10 (being fulfilled)

4. God’s people will be persecuted for sharing God’s Word *Matthew 24:9 (Being fulfilled and continues to be fulfilled)

5. The gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness to all nations; and then shall the end come (needs to be fulfilled in a generation yet to be fulfilled). *Matthew 24:14

6. Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken *Matthew 24:29-30.

7. So likewise you, when you shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors *Matthew 24:33

8. It will be as it was in the days that were before the flood *Matthew 24:38-39

.............

CONCLUSION: In other words, the annihilation of this world, era, age, and so on, will not be triggered by the collapse of a single sign listed in Matthew 24, but, all the signs of this aion (world) will converge together to bring the end and the second coming which will be a public event.

More to come...

Gospel of Matthew
At a Glance
Gospel
Genre:
(4/5) ****
Reliability of Dating:
(3/5) ***
Length of Text:
Greek
Original Language:
Ancient Translations:

Modern Translations:
English

Estimated Range of Dating: 80-100 A.D.

Gospel of Matthew


Information on Gospel of Matthew

It is the near-universal position of scholarship that the Gospel of Matthew is dependent upon the Gospel of Mark. This position is accepted whether one subscribes to the dominant Two-Source Hypothesis or instead prefers the Farrer-Goulder hypothesis.

It is also the consensus position that the evangelist was not the apostle Matthew. Such an idea is based on the second century statements of Papias and Irenaeus. As quoted by Eusebius in Hist. Eccl. 3.39, Papias states: "Matthew put together the oracles [of the Lord] in the Hebrew language, and each one interpreted them as best he could." In Adv. Haer. 3.1.1, Irenaeus says: "Matthew also issued a written Gospel among the Hebrews in their own dialect while Peter and Paul were preaching at Rome and laying the foundations of the church." We know that Irenaeus had read Papias, and it is most likely that Irenaeus was guided by the statement he found there. That statement in Papias itself is considered to be unfounded because the Gospel of Matthew was written in Greek and relied largely upon Mark, not the author's first-hand experience.

 

[Aupmanyav]

God is not going to punish man unless he has done something terribly wrong.

I thought Bahai Allah is all-loving, but it seems he is not. He seems to be just like other guys, e.g., the YHWH of Jews, who would not forget a wrong for three generations and punish the children of those who did the wrong, or the God of the Christians who destroyed Chorazin, Bethsaeda and Capernaum. That of Muslims would pour hot oil on the head till the brain melts. Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Mohammad are all manifestations of the Bahai Allah.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Seriously for one of the closest to enlightenment on the forum, you're being slow, when I've even posted a better picture on here.

That is a very nice photo, Wizanda.

 

[Aupmanyav]

6. Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken *Matthew 24:29-30.

Now, that is not true. Sun would get hotter and hotter, brighter and brighter, and in a billion year's time would sear all life on Earth.

After about 8 billion years, sun would turn into a nebula like this.
Future of Earth - Wikipedia

 

[loverofhumanity]

I thought Bahai Allah is all-loving, but it seems he is not. He seems to be just like other guys, e.g., the YHWH of Jews, who would not forget a wrong for three generations and punish the children of those who did the wrong, or the God of the Christians who destroyed Chorazin, Bethsaeda and Capernaum. That of Muslims would pour hot oil on the head till the brain melts. Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Mohammad are all manifestations of the Bahai Allah.

God’s punishment is as a result of turning against His teachings.

God asks us to love each other but we hate and show prejudice towards each other and start wars and conflicts. It’s called God’s punishment but in reality it is us who inflict the punishment upon ourselves by going against what God has taught.

So obedience to God’s law of love and harmony will reap rich rewards such as peace but acting in the opposite manner will bring disaster.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Once again what has your post here have to do with the post you are quoting from and how does it address it? It doesn't

No matter the Pharisees were told that Jesus was their awaited Messiah, neither Jesus Himself nor Christians were able to convince them Who He was although there were over 300 prophecies regarding Him. They didn’t want to see.

If you believe we are wrong then fine. God bless.

 

[sooda]

No matter the Pharisees were told that Jesus was their awaited Messiah, neither Jesus Himself nor Christians were able to convince them Who He was although there were over 300 prophecies regarding Him. They didn’t want to see.

If you believe we are wrong then fine. God bless.

Jesus wasn't a Christian... What are you talking about?

The Messiah expected by the Jews was an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Jesus wasn't a Christian... What are you talking about?

The Messiah expected by the Jews was an anointed warrior king who would vanquish the enemies of the Jews.

I said Jesus wasn’t able to prove to the priests that He was the Messiah they were awaiting. That is what I meant.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Why should people accept God or someone from him if no proof is provided; just talk, talk and talk? Claiming a vision of the 'Maid of Heaven' is hardly a proof.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Why should people accept God or someone from him if no proof is provided; just talk, talk and talk? Claiming a vision of the 'Maid of Heaven' is hardly a proof.

What would you consider proof?

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I see the delema your facing. You say the second coming has already taken place yet here you are not able to prove it from the scriptures.

I do not need to prove it to anybody else, the proof given by Baha'u'llah, was to me what all people are looking for, in one way or another.

Verses such as these are guidance;

2 Corinthians 13:5 "Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates"

Romans 12:3 "For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith."

Jesus the Christ fulfilled Prophecy, Jesus as Christ brought a new heaven and a new earth, the stars fell from heaven and the mountains moved, the list goes on.

Waiting fo a literal fulfilment of prophecy, means waiting as the Jews still do for a literal Messiah sitting on a throne.

Regards Tony

 

[3rdAngel]

Perpetuity means forever.

I do not need to prove it to anybody else, the proof given by Baha'u'llah, was to me what all people are looking for, in one way or another.

Verses such as these are guidance;

2 Corinthians 13:5 "Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates"

Romans 12:3 "For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith."

Jesus the Christ fulfilled Prophecy, Jesus as Christ brought a new heaven and a new earth, the stars fell from heaven and the mountains moved, the list goes on.

Waiting fo a literal fulfilment of prophecy, means waiting as the Jews still do for a literal Messiah sitting on a throne.

Regards Tony

When I am referring to proof I am referring to proof from the scriptures. You simply have none for your claims and your cliams are not supported by the scriptures. The scriptures are made up of both spiritual and literal prophecies in God's Word. For example when God says he will give us a new heart to love and follow him we are not getting a heart transplant yet in a way we are *EZEKIEL 36:26-27. When God prophesied to Abraham that his people would be in Egypt 400+ years before deliverence it was literal. When Daniel was given the prophecy of the abomination of desolation and the destruction of the temple that JESUS refers to in Matthew 24 it was literal. When God's Word tells us that at the second coming, it is the end of the world and EVERY EYE shall see him, I believe God's Word that it will be as it says. Then I guess the JEWS had the same problem when they ignored God's Word and rejected the scriptures that prophesied of the Messiah. They had God's Word. They had the 300+ prophecies. Yet they choose to close their eyes and ears to hearing God's Word and rejected the very literal Messiah that the scriptures pointed to. Pehaps they believed at the time as you do that it was a spiritual coming? According to the scriptures the new heaven and no new earth happens after the second coming that everyone will see, but I see you do not believe these scriptures that have only been shared as a help to you. For me only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow it over the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God. I see what you are teaching though as a fulfillment of the scriptures in Matthew 24:24

 

[CG Didymus]

No matter the Pharisees were told that Jesus was their awaited Messiah, neither Jesus Himself nor Christians were able to convince them Who He was although there were over 300 prophecies regarding Him. They didn’t want to see.

If you believe we are wrong then fine. God bless.

This thread is about what the second coming will look like, but for the Jews, they are looking for the first coming. And what should that first coming look like? So many "prophecies" are too vague to be meaningful. And, like the "virgin" birth, are from verses that are taken out of context. And then some prophecies attributed to Jesus, Baha'is say don't apply to Jesus at all but to Baha'u'llah.

Then the greatest proofs. God spoke from heaven and said that Jesus was his beloved Son. Jesus walking on water and raising the dead. Angels appearing and declaring that Jesus had risen from the dead. Greatest proofs? No. Wouldn't Baha'is say these are all symbolic? Only literal believing Christians think these things really happened. So why should any Jew believe that Jesus was their Messiah? Because he saved them from their sin? Because he saved them from the wiles of the devil? Because he saved them from being condemned to hell? Still, more stuff that Baha'is say isn't true.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

When I am referring to proof I am referring to proof from the scriptures. You simply have none for your claims and your cliams are not supported by the scriptures. The scriptures are made up of both spiritual and literal prophecies in God's Word. For example when God says he will give us a new heart to love and follow him we are not getting a heart transplant yet in a way we are *EZEKIEL 36:26-27. When God prophesied to Abraham that his people would be in Egypt 400+ years before deliverence it was literal. When Daniel was given the prophecy of the abomination of desolation and the destruction of the temple that JESUS refers to in Matthew 24 it was literal. When God's Word tells us that at the second coming it is the end of the world and when JESUS returns EVERY EYE shall see him I believe God's Word that it will be literal. Then I guess the JEWS had the same problem when they ignored God's Word and rejected the scriptures that prophesied of the Messiah. They had God's Word. They had the prophecies. Yet they choose to close their eyes and ears to hearing God's Word and rejected the very literal Messiah that the scriptures pointed to. According to the scriptures the new heaven and no new earth happens after the second coming that everyone will see, but I see you do not believe them. For me only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow it over the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God. I see what you are teaching though as a fulfillment of the scriptures in Matthew 24:24

Thus you will literally see what you have decided you have to see and wait until that happens.

For me I have seen the 'Glory of God' come via the way of the 'Gate' facing East.

I see the law going forth from ZION.

I see a New Jerusalem has come down from the heaven of God's Command and the Promised Temple built.

I see the limbs of mankind have quaked, the stars fallen from heavenand a new heaven and a new earth as the old passes away.

I see the end of the Age was AD1844, foretold in Daniel and then confirmed in Revelation as AH1260.

The list goes on, all the while people stay firm in a literal fulfilment.

"... As they have literally interpreted the Word of God, and the sayings and traditions of the Letters of Unity, and expounded them according to their own deficient understanding, they have therefore deprived themselves and all their people of the bountiful showers of the grace and mercies of God...."

Regards Tony