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Where do the Jews believe they are going...
- Thread starter Jonathan Bailey
- Start date
Lionel Refson
Member
Jews believe they go to God, when they die. God will judge them God will be angry with them, God will forgive them as with Adam and cain and Noah etc etc, That is what I believe and I was born Jewish
susanblange
Active Member
I learned all of this from Herbert W. Armstrong. He wrote a little book called "The United States and Britain in Prophecy". Ephraim, the youngest son of Joseph had the birthright and blessing and was to become a "multitude of nations". Genesis 48:19. In the Hebrew Bible, they are represented as ten toes, and ten horns. Queen Elizabeth is sitting on the throne of David. Originally, the USA was the melting pot of northwestern Europe and we are called "Israel" in the Bible.
Terry Sampson
Well-Known Member
Ahhh, then you and I are in total agreement on that matter. For the record, I have undertaken two common DNA tests and have no knowledge of any Jewish ancestry whatsoever. Moreover, my DNA test results do not yield even the slightest indication that I had any. Consequently, I have no personal vested interest in the issue of DNA evidence for Jewish ancestry. However, because (1) I am a passionate genealogy addict, (2) am a great fan of DNA testing, and (3) and have herded kin and friends through DNA testing, I am acquainted with several folks whose DNA estimates have indicated some genetic descent from Jewish ancestors. Ergo my question to you about the range of your dispute.
As far as I am aware, I am not Jewish either; tests cost a lot though I would like to try one.
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
@Terry Sampson
From my understanding, excluding Levi, knowledge of which tribe an individual belongs to was lost long ago. Part of the prophecy of the Jewish Messiah is that the Messiah will be able to determine each individual's tribal affiliation.
If @susanblange believes that people are able to find out their tribal affiliation, then that is not mainstream Judaism. I'm not saying whether or not it is accurate. Maybe it's possible? Maybe not? It could be that Susan is operating on new information that is not yet accepted into mainstream Judaism. I don't honestly know.
From my understanding, excluding Levi, knowledge of which tribe an individual belongs to was lost long ago. Part of the prophecy of the Jewish Messiah is that the Messiah will be able to determine each individual's tribal affiliation.
If @susanblange believes that people are able to find out their tribal affiliation, then that is not mainstream Judaism. I'm not saying whether or not it is accurate. Maybe it's possible? Maybe not? It could be that Susan is operating on new information that is not yet accepted into mainstream Judaism. I don't honestly know.
Terry Sampson
Well-Known Member
Curious-er and curious-er ... you use the Hebrew portion of the KJV and get your British Israelite doctrine from Herbert W. Armstrong. Are you one of a kind or are there others that share similar beliefs that you fellowship with?
Terry Sampson
Well-Known Member
I leave any assessment of any person's claim to descend from one of the 12 tribes of Israel to orthodox Jewish authorities. But, like Rival, I would seriously doubt and dispute the claim of anyone to be affiliated with a specific tribe on the grounds of DNA evidence. As far as I know, while DNA testing can suggest an estimate of quantity of Jewish ancestry, there is no DNA test that I have ever heard of (nor do I believe that any will ever exist) that can tell us which tribe they descend from, for at least one good reason: the 12 tribes descend from Abraham, through Isaac, through Jacob. The DNA of Jacob and Leah's children may have differed somewhat from that of the children of Jacob and Leah's sister, Rachel, but not so much that the sons of Jacob and Leah were completely different genetically than the sons of Jacob and Rachel.
I'll go farther than you.
(a) I agree that Susan's claim is not mainstream Judaism.
(b) In my not-so-humble opinion, Herbert W. Armstrong's British Israelite doctrine was complete and utter hogwash with as much possibility of being true as the Flat Earth theory.
I believe predominately the Jews believe they are going . . .
I like the simple answer "Judaism is famously ambiguous about what happens when we die."
See: Is There a Jewish Afterlife? | My Jewish Learning
The mythology makes these options unlikely.
The Baha'i Faith believes in a journey through many worlds beyond ours ultimately at the will of God, but not defined from the fallible human perspective.
The Qur'an says there will be no vain talk in Jannah.
Terry Sampson
Well-Known Member
And? I am on earth
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Oh my, not been on a bus for 25 years. I am betting the fair is beyond my means now.
The whispering you described with the laughter sounds like vain talk. You also assumed the virgins are very young and vain. There is no age differences in Jannah. No vanity, no secrets, nothing bad is there.
I specifically stated houris.
No age difference, so everyone could be a vain and giggling inhabitant.
You do seem to know a lot about a place that, as far as i am aware, no one has ever returned to tell about it.
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
I am 100% ignorant of this person or their doctrine. FWIW. Never heard of it before today.
susanblange
Active Member
I do have a number of followers, but we are in the minority. The true Messiah will cause the Temple to be rebuilt. Isaiah 28:16. "...he that believeth shall not make haste". On Judgment Day 97% of earth's inhabitants will be cut off by fire. Isaiah 24:6. This will leave about 210 million people. Jesus has been kicked out of Heaven and reincarnated. Isaiah 14:12-15. He will be the leader of the "sons of darkness" as opposed to the "sons of light". At the end, Christians will execute the true Messiah and all Christians and other idolaters will be cut off also by fire. Joel 3. Zechariah 14:12. Salvation will come down to belief and about 100 million people will survive this and live to witness the resurrection. Daniel 7:10.
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
It's a good point... what happens when people die is a very complicated question.
However, I think it's important that the OP asks 'where' not 'what'.
Vanity is a negative thing. There is no vanity in Jannah.