Where Is Jesus PHYSICALLY Right Now?

[Windwalker]

I know I'm not a Christian, but wouldn't it make sense that it would be like just any other physical body? All physical things follow the same proponents?

I think some thoughts that may help with this quandary of what exactly is this "resurrected" body, may be to consider that in the Vedic traditions they speak of the various sheaths or "bodies" surrounding the soul. You have the gross body, or the physical material body; the subtle body - or the body of mind and dreams; and the causal body - or the body of dreamless, eternal consciousness. (I know I'm not explaining these well). In other words, even as we are in our physical form, there are other 'bodies' for all these other aspects of ourselves. When Jesus 'rose', what rose? What appeared? What was seen? It clearly is described as beyond mere physical form. It certainly has the appearance of subtle form, and doubtless casual.

Where is God? Is God any "where"? Yet God can appear in all forms, and itself be no form. You see, I think ruminating over heaven as a "place" like France or Jupiter, or some "other realm", a certain material dimension like the 9th dimension or something, misses the point. It's still stuck thinking in materialistic, gross-body forms. I think its a whole lot beyond that sort of thinking.

 

[Katzpur]

I know I'm not a Christian, but wouldn't it make sense that it would be like just any other physical body? All physical things follow the same proponents?

They do if they are mortal, but that's because they are mortal, not because they are physical. Mortal and physical, in other words, do not mean the same thing.

 

[Katzpur]

Where is God? Is God any "where"? Yet God can appear in all forms, and itself be no form. You see, I think ruminating over heaven as a "place" like France or Jupiter, or some "other realm", a certain material dimension like the 9th dimension or something, misses the point. It's still stuck thinking in materialistic, gross-body forms. I think its a whole lot beyond that sort of thinking.

What I've never understood is why people have such issues with the physical. It's like they think that everything physical is somehow inferior to everything non-physical. Why is that?

 

[savagewind]

What I've never understood is why people have such issues with the physical. It's like they think that everything physical is somehow inferior to everything non-physical. Why is that?

I am probably wrong but I think a physical thing has to be somewhere. Spiritual does not dwell in space. It is above and beyond space. I believe God can be anywhere and everywhere at the same time. I can't imagine something physical doing that.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

I know there is a similar thread, but I wanted to specify the question more.

If Jesus's body rose from the dead, where exactly does his body physically exist presently?

I've heard he is physically in heaven, but how is that so? It would imply heaven is physical, for only physical things exist in an area and thus take up space and thus have mass.

Where is his body currently?

I'm not really sure if I agree with the following myself, but it's an answer, from Dr William Lane Craig:

So how should we conceive of Jesus' resurrection body today? Christ in his exalted state still has a human nature; he did not "enter back into God's own existence." But Christ has exited this four-dimensional space-time continuum. Therefore, perhaps we might say that his human nature does not now manifest itself corporeally. Compare a tuning fork which is plucked and begins to hum. If the vibrating fork is placed in a vacuum jar, though it continues to vibrate, it does not manifest itself by a humming noise because there is no medium to carry its vibrations. Similarly, Christ's human nature, no longer immersed in spacetime, does not manifest itself as a body. But someday Christ will return and re-enter our four-dimensional space-time continuum, and then his body will become manifest. In the new heavens and the new earth Christ will be corporeally present to his people. Christ, then, has a human nature which is manifested as his physical resurrection body when he exists in a spatio-temporal universe.

Philosophers have a tendency to go into much detail to explain things. The tuning fork analogy is nice, but I'm also content to say that Christ's body exists in heaven because it just does, it is a glorified body.

 

[Windwalker]

What I've never understood is why people have such issues with the physical. It's like they think that everything physical is somehow inferior to everything non-physical. Why is that?

Because the spiritual transcends the physical, but yet is able to include it in that transcendence. It's not that the physical is "bad" in a value sense of the word. It is simply a 'lower' rung on the ladder, not the upper rungs. To call it 'inferior' in a values sense, would be like saying my cells are inferior to my body and can be done away with. Clearly that's not the case. But to say 'inferior' in a natural hierarchical sense, as in lower in position or subordinate to the higher stages, this is true.

The reason I balk at the notions of heaven, or God, being physical entities is because it doesn't truly move beyond dualistic thinking itself. God isn't transcendent at all, but merely a super-human like 'person', and heaven a really special "place" to go to, a lot like here, just better! That's not truly seeing an order beyond the physical. It's still hanging out on rung three of the ladder which goes several million miles up. It's imagining the upper rungs as just a 'better' version of itself, an idealized rung three on which they stand currently, rather than stepping up to rung four, then five, then six, then seven, etc, where each new altitude offers a radically altered perception and understanding of reality. In other worlds, this 'idealized' physical, is 'stuck' seeing out of those eyes only, and not transcending anything truly. It is still thinking in terms of itself.

But to add here, those that in fact do and have climbed as it were to the higher rungs to see the world 'beyond the physical', do in fact deeply value the physical, even more so than when that was the dominant stage of their perception of reality. They can do so, because they can see it objectively, from above as it were, and not stuck in it as the present set of eyes. I other words, they 'transcend and include' the lower rungs into the higher. Whereas they are no higher rungs visible yet in the physical only. It only imagines 'heaven' to be a 'superior' version of itself, like imagining the future just like the present except with everyone wearing silver clothes. Make sense?

 

[Katzpur]

I am probably wrong but I think a physical thing has to be somewhere. Spiritual does not dwell in space. It is above and beyond space. I believe God can be anywhere and everywhere at the same time. I can't imagine something physical doing that.

Try thinking of it this way, then:

Imagine a sheet of paper that had sixteen tiny holes in it. How many needles would be needed to simultaneously fit through all sixteen separate holes? If you said, “sixteen,” you are thinking in terms of “ontological omnipresence.” Fold the paper in such a way that the needle can be inserted through all sixteen holes at once. This represents “functional omnipresence.” God’s power can extend everywhere throughout the universe simultaneously, even though He is physically in heaven. Even though He occupies physical space, He is functionally omnipresent because He has the power to do so.

Interestingly, the Bible consistently refers to God as being "in Heaven." That's where Jesus Christ always referred to Him as being. There in nowhere in which He (Jesus) describes, mentions or alludes to His Father as being anywhere else. In the Lord's Prayer, He begins, "Our Father who art in Heaven..." After His resurrection, He talks about going to His Father "in Heaven." The fact that God's power extends throughout the universe at all times has nothing to do with where He is physically.

There is a difference between ontological and functional omnipresence. The Bible never actually refers to God being "omnipresent." It describes his power, knowledge, and influence as being everywhere at once, but He is always said to be "in Heaven."

 

[Windwalker]

God has warp drive technology? Or is it a "Spirit" drive? The Spirit Drive 12,000, complete with flaming tongue cooling coils?

 

[Katzpur]

Because the spiritual transcends the physical, but yet is able to include it in that transcendence.

Do you want to dumb this statement down for me with an example of some sort? Thanks.

 

[roger1440]

I know there is a similar thread, but I wanted to specify the question more.

If Jesus's body rose from the dead, where exactly does his body physically exist presently?

I've heard he is physically in heaven, but how is that so? It would imply heaven is physical, for only physical things exist in an area and thus take up space and thus have mass.

Where is his body currently?

The Church is the body of Christ. The trick is finding the right church.

 

[Windwalker]

Do you want to dumb this statement down for me with an example of some sort? Thanks.

The mental transcends the physical in that thoughts and ideas are not bound to the range of physicality. Yet it includes the physical in its transcendence. When you say something is mental, you are looking at its dominant mode of being. When you say something is physical you are looking at its dominant mode of being. When you say something is spiritual, in transcends the physical, and the mental. It is 'higher' in order of being. Yet, it can be seen and felt in the physical, though it itself is not defined by the physical.

The problem I have is not with saying God, or Spirit exists in physical form, which I believe is true in that God is in ALL physical forms, but the notion that imagines God literally and exclusively existing in an individual form separate from all other forms. That notion may be useful in some anthropomorphic picture of God as a deity form, but God ceases to be Absolute at that point, and hence our realization of God stops at a dualistic image, or worse that Sunday School book anthropomorphic image. God is reduced down to little more than a graphic novel image of Superman, rather than wholly transcendent and immanent Infinite and Absolute Spirit.

Having experienced transcendent Spirit, I can tell you it's not Superman. God doesn't live on another planet.

 

[Katzpur]

The mental transcends the physical in that thoughts and ideas are not bound to the range of physicality. Yet it includes the physical in its transcendence. When you say something is mental, you are looking at its dominant mode of being. When you say something is physical you are looking at its dominant mode of being. When you say something is spiritual, in transcends the physical, and the mental. It is 'higher' in order of being. Yet, it can be seen and felt in the physical, though it itself is not defined by the physical.

The problem I have is not with saying God, or Spirit exists in physical form, which I believe is true in that God is in ALL physical forms, but the notion that imagines God literally and exclusively existing in an individual form separate from all other forms. That notion may be useful in some anthropomorphic picture of God as a deity form, but God ceases to be Absolute at that point, and hence our realization of God stops at a dualistic image, or worse that Sunday School book anthropomorphic image. God is reduced down to little more than a graphic novel image of Superman, rather than wholly transcendent and immanent Infinite and Absolute Spirit.

Having experienced transcendent Spirit, I can tell you it's not Superman. God doesn't live on another planet.

I can agree with you that God isn't Superman and that He doesn't live on another planet. But I don't believe He is just some force which fills the universe, either. I believe He's in Heaven and that His Son, Jesus Christ, is there, too. God's power, knowledge and influence, on the other hand, can and do exist throughout the universe simultaneously. (Obviously, this means that I believe Heaven is a real place.)

 

[Windwalker]

But I don't believe He is just some force which fills the universe, either.

I don't believe God is "just some force" either. I don't believe God is dark matter or gravity, or electromagnetism, electrostatic forces, etc. God is the Ground of all Being, which includes all forces material and spiritual. God itself, not being any object at all, but rather the subject of all objects. Not a thing, not an object, not a being, not an entity, not a force. None of those, but rather transcends and includes all of those. Not only transcends, but precedes.

I believe He's in Heaven and that His Son, Jesus Christ, is there, too.

But heaven is a metaphor, not a locale like Spain or Italy. Jesus said clearly the Kingdom of Heaven is inside you. (Yes, that is the correct translation). Furthermore Paul speaks of Christ in you. You mean he's either really small and exists in my atoms, or is somehow otherwise inside of my physical body? The only way this is true is for the Kingdom of Heaven to exist not materially, but spiritually within everything and everyone. The kingdom of heaven, or 'heaven' if you will is a condition of being, and manifested through the material form. It's not a place you go, its a condition you inhabit, and which inhabits you.

God's power, knowledge and influence, on the other hand, can and do exist throughout the universe simultaneously. (Obviously, this means that I believe Heaven is a real place.)

Does it exist in us?

 

[029b10]

But heaven is a metaphor, not a locale like Spain or Italy. Jesus said clearly the Kingdom of Heaven is inside you. (Yes, that is the correct translation).

Some might disagree since:

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis 1:1

The heavens are thine, the earth also is thine: as for the world and the fulness thereof, thou hast founded them. Ps 89:11

And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. John 8:23

Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
Matt 24:35 Mark 13:31 Luke 21:33

 

[Windwalker]

Some might disagree since:

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Genesis 1:1

The heavens are thine, the earth also is thine: as for the world and the fulness thereof, thou hast founded them. Ps 89:11

And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. John 8:23

Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
Matt 24:35 Mark 13:31 Luke 21:33

What's interesting is that in all my years as a Christian, never once, even as a child, did I interpret those above passages to be referring to Heaven in the sense of where God and the angels live. I always, and still do, understand those as referring to the sky; the place where clouds float, where stars and the moon hang, and so forth. It's really clear from the context it's referring to them.

Psalm 19, for instance cleary expresses this exactly that way

The heavens are telling of the glory of God;
And their expanse is declaring the work of His hands.
2 Day to day pours forth speech,
And night to night reveals knowledge.
3 There is no speech, nor are there words;
Their voice is not heard.
4 Their [a]line has gone out through all the earth,
And their utterances to the end of the world.
In them He has placed a tent for the sun,
5 Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber;
It rejoices as a strong man to run his course.
6 Its rising is from one end of the heavens,
And its circuit to the [c]other end of them;
And there is nothing hidden from its heat.
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This is glaringly obvious it's referring to the sky. It's speaking about our sun that we see and gives us our heat moving across it. Unless you believe when we die, we literally go to the clouds and the stars like astronauts? Do you believe my great grandfather is living on Jupiter?

Now it should be clearly obvious that "Heaven" when referred to as the spiritual abode, is speaking metaphorically, borrowing the term for the sky to express a place "above", without it being a literal, physical place. The sky actually is of this world.

 

[Thief]

So I thought the ascension was contrived....to satisfy the belief that heaven is just above our heads in the clouds.
Two thousand years ago....that's what people thought!

No one knew about the stars as we do now.
No one knew that five miles up the air is thin.
No one knew the Earth to be round and the environment only a surface event.

It was all flat and endless.
You could travel in any direction forever.
And if you ascend, you could do the same....forever.

No one journeyed far enough to know.
Those that did went too far to make it back!

So did He really go UP?
If He did His body failed after the first five miles.
Unless you are fond of the Green Lantern movie and you think it could be like that!

In reality, I think His followers moved the body.
They would not want any defilement of His grave.
To insure this....the burial site would need be a secret.....unto death.

 

[029b10]

So I thought the ascension was contrived....to satisfy the belief that heaven is just above our heads in the clouds.
Two thousand years ago....that's what people thought!

No one knew about the stars as we do now.
No one knew that five miles up the air is thin.
No one knew the Earth to be round and the environment only a surface event.
It was all flat and endless.
You could travel in any direction forever.
And if you ascend, you could do the same....forever.

Isa 40:21-22
21 Have ye not known? have ye not heard? hath it not been told you from the beginning? have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?
22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:
KJV

No one journeyed far enough to know.
Those that did went too far to make it back!

So did He really go UP?
If He did His body failed after the first five miles.
Unless you are fond of the Green Lantern movie and you think it could be like that!

In reality, I think His followers moved the body.
They would not want any defilement of His grave.
To insure this....the burial site would need be a secret.....unto death.

I hear tale that Jesus is risen and dwells in NU

 

[Thief]

Isa 40:21-22
21 Have ye not known? have ye not heard? hath it not been told you from the beginning? have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?
22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:
KJV



I hear tale that Jesus is risen and dwells in NU

Are you attempting to affirm He lives....in body?
Or just attempting to believe He does?

 

[chinu]

Imo, the body of Jesus merged into earth, and his soul merged into God, like a drop into sea. Physically he isn't anywhere. But his soul is everywhere.

 

[029b10]

Are you attempting to affirm He lives....in body?
Or just attempting to believe He does?

:sw: If He didn't wouldn't all His innards fall out....:guitar1:

but really, what did you think about that circle of earth thing, does two great lights
really create the sensation like the earth is spinning​

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