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WHERE IS THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS GOD'S 4th COMMANDMENT IS ABOLISHED?

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
And yet another sermon that does not present a single verse that states scripture only...
Sorry I do not believe you. For me I prefer the scriptures you choose not to believe with your words that are not Gods Word. I guess Isaiah 6:9-10 is applicable here. So I will leave this between you and God to work through and we will agree to disagree.
 

McBell

Unbound
The fact of the matter is that you have not present even one verse that states scripture only.

My belief (or lack of belief) concerning the source of said verse you have not presented is completely irrelevant.

You simply have not presented that which you claim.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
The fact of the matter is that you have not present even one verse that states scripture only.
Fact of the matter is that I have already posted scripture for you but you did not believe them. Lets be honest now. There is no scripture that teaches we are saved by faith in Gods Words and something else right? We are saved by Gods grace that we receive through faith that comes from Gods Word (Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 10:17) that Jesus says we are to live by in Matthew 4:4 and that is the only standard of what is true and what is not true in John 17:17 and Romans 3:4. There is no scripture that teaches we are saved by faith and something else or you would have already posted that scripture but instead you post your words in disagreement with Gods Word that teaches there is no salvation outside of believing and obeying what Gods Word says.
My belief (or lack of belief) concerning the source of said verse you have not presented is completely irrelevant.
Our believe in Gods Word is directly relevant according to the scriptures and the very point of this OP. If we do not believe and obey Gods Word according to the scriptures we are still in our sins because we do not believe and obey what Gods Word says.
You simply have not presented that which you claim.
Sorry I do not believe you. For me I prefer the scriptures you choose not to believe with your words that are not Gods Word. So I will leave this between you and God to work through and we will agree to disagree.
 
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McBell

Unbound
Fact of the matter is that I have already posted scripture for you but you did not believe them. Lets be honest now.
Yes.
You have posted a lot of scripture.
Unfortunately, none of them stated scripture only.

There is no scripture that teaches we are saved by faith in Gods Words and something else right?
Which has absolutely nothing to do with presenting a verse that states scripture only.

We are saved by Gods grace that we receive through faith that comes from Gods Word (Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 10:17) that Jesus says we are to live by in Matthew 4:4 and that is the only standard of what is true and what is not true in John 17:17 and Romans 3:4. There is no scripture that teaches we are saved by faith and something else or you would have already posted that scripture but instead you post your words in disagreement with Gods Word that teaches there is no salvation outside of believing and obeying what Gods Word says.
You are now bearing false witness.
I never made any such claim.
I have merely stated the fact that you have not presented a single verse that states scripture only.

Our believe in Gods Word is directly relevant according to the scriptures and the very point of this OP. If we do not believe and obey Gods Word according to the scriptures we are still in our sins because we do not believe and obey what Gods Word says.

Sorry I do not believe you. For me I prefer the scriptures you choose not to believe with your words that are not Gods Word. So I will leave this between you and God to work through and we will agree to disagree.
You really do seem to enjoy chasing your own tail
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
Yes. You have posted a lot of scripture. Unfortunately, none of them stated scripture only.
Sorry I do not believe you. For me I prefer the scriptures you choose not to believe with your words that are not Gods Word. So I will leave this between you and God to work through and we will agree to disagree.
Which has absolutely nothing to do with presenting a verse that states scripture only.
It has everything to do with our discussion. Fact of the matter is that I have already posted scripture for you but you did not believe them. Lets be honest now. There is no scripture that teaches we are saved by faith in Gods Words and something else right? We are saved by Gods grace that we receive through faith that comes from Gods Word (Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 10:17) that Jesus says we are to live by in Matthew 4:4 and that is the only standard of what is true and what is not true in John 17:17 and Romans 3:4. There is no scripture that teaches we are saved by faith and something else or you would have already posted that scripture but instead you post your words in disagreement with Gods Word that teaches there is no salvation outside of believing and obeying what Gods Word says.
You are now bearing false witness.
No. Posting scriptures in disagreement with you is not bearing false witness about you. It is tell you the truth (see John 17:17)
I never made any such claim.
Lets be specific. You never made what claim?
I have merely stated the fact that you have not presented a single verse that states scripture only.
Sorry I do not believe you. You did not state any facts and your claims that the bible does not teach our salvation is through scripture alone is unbiblical as demonstrate to you already through the scriptures you choose not to believe (see Ephesians 2:8 comp. Romans 10:17; John 3:36; Matthew 7:21-23; 1 John 2:3-4; 2 Timothy 3:16 and Matthew 4:4)
You really do seem to enjoy chasing your own tail
Well aren't you the funny one. Here I was thinking this is what you are doing which is why I said I do not believe you and we will agree to disagree. I will leave it between you and God to work through.
 

jimb

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
The sabbath is nothing more than a day off. It was unknown in ancient agricultural societies, so God said that His people should observe a day of rest. -> Not absolute rest <- but a day when only necessary work should be performed.

However, as Jesus clearly showed, it is not an iron-clad rule. One's behavior should be modified according to the circumstances: hunger, need for healing, etc.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
The sabbath is nothing more than a day off. It was unknown in ancient agricultural societies, so God said that His people should observe a day of rest. -> Not absolute rest <- but a day when only necessary work should be performed. However, as Jesus clearly showed, it is not an iron-clad rule. One's behavior should be modified according to the circumstances: hunger, need for healing, etc.
Actually that is not true. The Sabbath is one of Gods 10 commandments which is repeated in the old and new covenants as the standard for Christian living and right and wrong doing (Exodus 20:8-11; 1 John 3:4). Jesus taught us how to keep the Sabbath and that it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath day (see Matthew 12:1-12) and that He is the Lord even of the Sabbath day and that God made it originally for all mankind (Mark 2:27-28).
 

jimb

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Actually that is not true. The Sabbath is one of Gods 10 commandments which is repeated in the old and new covenants as the standard for Christian living and right and wrong doing (Exodus 20:8-11; 1 John 3:4). Jesus taught us how to keep the Sabbath and that it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath day (see Matthew 12:1-12) and that He is the Lord even of the Sabbath day and that God made it originally for all mankind (Mark 2:27-28).

I assume that you're familiar with Jesus' disciples eating grain on the Sabbath and Jesus healing on the Sabbath. In both cases, the Pharisees criticized Jesus and in both cases He showed them that they didn't understand the Sabbath.

So either you are lacking understanding of the Sabbath or Jesus didn't understand it. Guess whom I believe!
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
I assume that you're familiar with Jesus' disciples eating grain on the Sabbath and Jesus healing on the Sabbath. In both cases, the Pharisees criticized Jesus and in both cases He showed them that they didn't understand the Sabbath.

So either you are lacking understanding of the Sabbath or Jesus didn't understand it. Guess whom I believe!
Yes they were not breaking the Sabbath in Jesus eye. They were not working on the Sabbath by just eating corn directly from the field. It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath day. You are lacking understanding about the Sabbath. It is one of Gods 10 commandments that gives us the knowledge of what sin is when broken, just like lying or stealing. You do not believe God if you think you can continue in known unrepentant sin against God and enter His Kingdom.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
They were not working on the Sabbath by just eating corn directly from the field
You are incorrect. Harvesting is work, no matter what way you slice it. And you really can't use the "it is lawful to do good" because absolutely nothing stopped them from picking the grain the day before. And even though they were lazy bones and didn't bother to prepare, Jewish culture is very big on hospitality. All they had to do was find a family to help them out. It is the norm in close knit Jewish communities and synagogues to make sure that everyone has a place to go for Shabbat Table. In fact, picking that grain was so totally unnecessary, that I suspect the entire story to be a fabrication.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
You are incorrect. Harvesting is work, no matter what way you slice it. And you really can't use the "it is lawful to do good" because absolutely nothing stopped them from picking the grain the day before. And even though they were lazy bones and didn't bother to prepare, Jewish culture is very big on hospitality. All they had to do was find a family to help them out. It is the norm in close knit Jewish communities and synagogues to make sure that everyone has a place to go for Shabbat Table. In fact, picking that grain was so totally unnecessary, that I suspect the entire story to be a fabrication.
Wrong! They were not harvesting. Seems someone does not know the scriptures. Go read them.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
What do you think picking grain is called? Harvesting.
Go read the scriptures (Matthew 12:1-12). They were not harvesting or working. They were hungry and eating grain directly from the field. Do you know what the difference is between harvesting grain and eating some grain directly from plants in the field not taking anything more because you are hungry? The law of Moses so expressly allowed the plucking ears of corn as one passed through a field (see Deuteronomy 23:25,) but the Scribes and Pharisees were perverse enough to think this action forbidden on the sabbath. This prohibition is a Pharisaic rule not found in the Mosaic Law. It was a principle with the Pharisees to extend the provisions of the Law and make minute regulations over and beyond what Moses commanded, in order to avoid the possibility of transgression. Jesus responds to His accusers and gives two examples: (1.) a case of David and his companions doing something of which he comments 'which was not lawful' by eating the shew bread in the temple; and (2.) a case of Priests doing what he describes as 'desecrating the sabbath' by doing Gods work ministering to the people on the Sabbath day. His argument teaches us that God regards "mercy not sacrifice" and that He is Lord the Sabbath day and it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath. Lets not strain at the gnat to swallow a camel. Eating a grain of corn in the field because of hunger is not harvesting or working on the Sabbath. God desires mercy not sacrifice and it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath day.
 
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IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Go read the scriptures (Matthew 12:1-12). They were not harvesting or working. They were hungry and eating grain directly from the field. Do you know what the difference is between harvesting grain and eating some grain directly from plants in the field not taking anything more because you are hungry? The law of Moses so expressly allowed the plucking ears of corn as one passed through a field (see Deuteronomy 23:25,) but the Scribes and Pharisees were perverse enough to think this action forbidden on the sabbath. This prohibition is a Pharisaic rule not found in the Mosaic Law. It was a principle with the Pharisees to extend the provisions of the Law and make minute regulations over and beyond what Moses commanded, in order to avoid the possibility of transgression. Jesus responds to His accusers and gives two examples: (1.) a case of David and his companions doing something of which he comments 'which was not lawful' by eating the shew bread in the temple; and (2.) a case of Priests doing what he describes as 'desecrating the sabbath' by doing Gods work ministering to the people on the Sabbath day. His argument teaches us that God regards "mercy not sacrifice" and that He is Lord the Sabbath day and it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath. Lets not strain at the gnat to swallow a camel. Eating a grain of corn in the field because of hunger is not harvesting or working on the Sabbath. God desires mercy not sacrifice and it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath day.
They harvested grain.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
They harvested grain.
They were not harvesting grain. They were hungry and eating grain directly from the field as a meal (read Matthew 12:1-12). Do you know what the difference is between harvesting grain and eating some grain directly from plants in the field not taking anything more because you are hungry? The law of Moses so expressly allowed the plucking ears of corn as one passed through a field (see Deuteronomy 23:25) but the Scribes and Pharisees were perverse enough to think this action forbidden on the sabbath.

This prohibition is a Pharisaic rule not found in the Mosaic Law. It was a principle with the Pharisees to extend the provisions of the Law and make minute regulations over and beyond what Moses commanded, in order to avoid the possibility of transgression. Jesus responds to His accusers and gives two examples: (1.) a case of David and his companions doing something of which he comments 'which was not lawful' by eating the shew bread in the temple; and (2.) a case of Priests doing what he describes as 'desecrating the sabbath' by doing Gods work ministering to the people on the Sabbath day.

His argument teaches us that God regards "mercy not sacrifice" and that He is Lord the Sabbath day and it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath. Lets not strain at the gnat to swallow a camel. Eating a grain of corn in the field because of hunger is not harvesting or working on the Sabbath. God desires mercy not sacrifice.
 

jimb

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Yes they were not breaking the Sabbath in Jesus eye. They were not working on the Sabbath by just eating corn directly from the field. It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath day. You are lacking understanding about the Sabbath. It is one of Gods 10 commandments that gives us the knowledge of what sin is when broken, just like lying or stealing. You do not believe God if you think you can continue in known unrepentant sin against God and enter His Kingdom.

The fourth commandment reads: “Remember the Sabbath day to set it apart as holy. For six days you may labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God; on it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, or your male servant, or your female servant, or your cattle, or the resident foreigner who is in your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all that is in them, and he rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy." Exodus 20:8-11

The Pharisees criticized Jesus because, in their opinion, Jesus was violating the Sabbath. Picking grain heads and eating them was a violation of the Sabbath according to the Pharisees, because they took as an iron-clad commandment: "... on it you shall not do any work".

Unlike yourself, I believe God's word in its entirety. I do not need to rationalize or twist the meaning.
 

jimb

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
You are incorrect. Harvesting is work, no matter what way you slice it. And you really can't use the "it is lawful to do good" because absolutely nothing stopped them from picking the grain the day before. And even though they were lazy bones and didn't bother to prepare, Jewish culture is very big on hospitality. All they had to do was find a family to help them out. It is the norm in close knit Jewish communities and synagogues to make sure that everyone has a place to go for Shabbat Table. In fact, picking that grain was so totally unnecessary, that I suspect the entire story to be a fabrication.

Which other parts of God's word to you consider to be fabrications???
 

jimb

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
They were not harvesting grain. They were hungry and eating grain directly from the field as a meal (read Matthew 12:1-12). Do you know what the difference is between harvesting grain and eating some grain directly from plants in the field not taking anything more because you are hungry? The law of Moses so expressly allowed the plucking ears of corn as one passed through a field (see Deuteronomy 23:25) but the Scribes and Pharisees were perverse enough to think this action forbidden on the sabbath.

This prohibition is a Pharisaic rule not found in the Mosaic Law. It was a principle with the Pharisees to extend the provisions of the Law and make minute regulations over and beyond what Moses commanded, in order to avoid the possibility of transgression. Jesus responds to His accusers and gives two examples: (1.) a case of David and his companions doing something of which he comments 'which was not lawful' by eating the shew bread in the temple; and (2.) a case of Priests doing what he describes as 'desecrating the sabbath' by doing Gods work ministering to the people on the Sabbath day.

His argument teaches us that God regards "mercy not sacrifice" and that He is Lord the Sabbath day and it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath. Lets not strain at the gnat to swallow a camel. Eating a grain of corn in the field because of hunger is not harvesting or working on the Sabbath. God desires mercy not sacrifice.

Can you spell "legalism"???
 
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