Who IS "The Only TRUE God"- as Jesus put it?

[abysslightdarkness]

To URAVIP2ME
For your forgiveness issue ,there are many christian always asking for forgiveness for their wrong doings or sins. the fact that asking is not of any substance more like a license to sin more
There's a saying
"Seek not the salvation for your sin rather seek to redeem from sin itself" -- Gandhi.

If you can ,seek how not to sin from your sin itself ,then there won't be any need of seeking forgiveness and salvation.
Many christians have this notion in their head that they can actually sin again and again and still able to have forgiveness from god eventually. if this belief is true then what about the negative impact they gave in their social circle projected from your wrong doings? Your negative impact you beget from your sin is more detrimental.
Real forgiveness come from you. you must earn your own forgiveness same as respect. earn your forgiveness by gaining the trust again and forgiveness from the victim. and make sure the victim is no longer traumatize by your wrong doings in the past and future. A mental detachment from your negative impact would be best.
i will address your YHWH issues later

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Abysslightdarkness-

1st John [1v7] says Jesus blood cleanses us from all sin.
But all do not accept Jesus that is why his sacrifice is for 'many' not all.- Matt 20v28
Jesus paid the asking price for our sins. -Rom 6v23
As for the dead [except for those of Matt 12v32; Hebrews 6vs4-6] as Romans [6v7] says the dead are freed or acquitted from their sins. Doesn't that sound as if forgiven if freed or acquitted? Not saying innocent but like a governor can pardon a person so the crime [sin] charges no longer stick. Sin due to our inherited imperfection from Adam.
So 'death' stamps the price tag of sin as: Paid in Full.

How not to sin from your sin itself: Aren't there just two types of sin?
Sin is either intentional, on purpose, premeditated, willful, or by mistake.
We do not want to deliberately practice sin.
-Hebrews 10v26.

I would say, not Christians, but rather 'so-called Christians' have the wrong notion of willful practicing sin and still having forgiveness. Again, -Heb 10v26.
Didn't Jesus say what one must do to right the wrong or right damage done at Matthew
[5 vs23,24], then pray to God asking forgiveness on the basis of Jesus ransom sacrifice
Ephesians 1v7.

We would not have God's trust in us if we do not follow Jesus command asking to forgive us our debts [sins] as we also have forgiven our debtors, and repent- Matt 18v21.

I still feel trauma by wrongs long done, but I know God reads hearts, and all the sheep-like ones living on earth at the time of Jesus 'glory' [Matt 25vs31,32] can remain alive and keep on living right into the start of Jesus peaceful thousand -year reign over earth with the prospect of having everlasting life in view on a paradisaic earth.
Doesn't God promise at that time [Rev 21vs4,5] to make all things new,
and as Isaiah foretold [65v17;64v4] the former troubles are forgotten?
1st Cor 2v9

Since God's Word says [1st Cor 5vs11-13] to put away from among yourselves the wicked person, should we associate with such an unrepentant practicer of sin?
No, because agreed such wrongdoings have a negative impact......

 

[icebuddy]

the earth is not a ball is a sphere there is a hebrew word for that but is no where to be found in the bible.

im not sure where you want to go with this, but i have no problem with it.

Is 40:22 did mentioned 'circle' but didn't describe the earth as circle.

Again, i dont know what or where you are going with this. Do you not believe in God or are you of a different religion thats against the Bible that i read? (evolution or something of that measure) Your bias has you seeing from a different view than me. i have no problem with the text that says God sits upon the "Circle" of the earth.

if you don't see a problem you are really not of this solar system as the sun is moving around the earth instead (Ps 104:19 ;Ec 1:5 ;Jos 10:13).and if you still don't get it than you are really not from earth

Do you watch the News or read the papers? They all say the sun will rise and set. Do you have a problem with this too? Jesus words explain things to me in a way I dont expect you to understand, but I will try.

Jhn 3:12 "If I told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?

I posted this so you can see that there are things that we see from earth and precieve from our perspective that may be different from heaven. For example: The 5 oclock news telling us when the sun will set or rise the next day.

If you look closely and contextually at those verses i quoted they were not written as how you would described them to be

you did post a bible passage out of Ecclesiastes. Almost every passage until the last chapter is a view from under the sun or an earthly point of view. Taking this in mind, you can understand other parts of the bible with simalar phrases.

Conversely ,the astronomer discovered that was not true. He was arrested and later released on house arrest till his death. Incidentally ,after 400 to 500 years later the last pope issued a letter of apology (1993) to Galileo's family.

only 1 being that ever walked the earth is perfact according to the bible, his name is Jesus, known as Jesus Christ. I remember Science use to believe a unborn baby went through stages of evolution before becomming a human child, they where wrong too... We can go on and on, what are you looking for?

btw please improve your hebrew before your reply thank you

Next time please put what you desire as qualifications to restond to your posts.(put your qualifications as well) i dont remember you nor any of your post saying anything about being qualified in a certain area to respond. However, i do have a hebrew dictionary that agrees with my deffinitions of the Hebrew.

Gal 4:4 Paul uses the law in association of the corruptibility of the flesh 'made' of a woman nothing special about jesus birth.

Do you personaly think Jesus's birth was not special? What Religion or Faith base are you?

rather ,there won't any temptations at all

Thats your private interpitation. I dont claim to know everything. have you read.

Rom 12:16 Be of the same mind toward one another; do not be haughty in mind, but associate with the lowly. Do not be wise in your own estimation.

Having said that if satan knew jesus was god then why was satan still dare to approach jesus to tempt him knowing he was god & cannot be tempted in the first place ? the answer was obvious he was man inside out.

Again, you asume things you do not know. If Satan was so smart, then why did he go against God in the first place? I dont claim to understand evil or evil beings and how they think. Ask yourself a question: Would you have done the things Satan has done?

In Love,
Tom

 

[abysslightdarkness]

hi
To address the problem on the name of YHWH referring to URAVIP2ME posts i have gave a brief overview of how the god YHWH origin through the ancient times.
Again over here if jesus is really god why would he need to show the name of god and declare it if he was god in flesh he need not do all that. he was god he was there already !!??
i think i know what URAVIP2ME meant differences in the name of god to what jesus intended yeah there are some compromised in there ,really Jehovah is not really a translation.

Firstly ,We need to recognize that in the archaeology find in 1929 that before the Exile Yahweh was not worship alone ,there were other Canaanite gods like the goddess Anath ,Eshem & Herem to name a few , whether you like it or not that is a fact attested by a number of ancient artifacts & records. They were all worshipped together at that time. In Jer 44:15-28 showed that there were other gods in which they prayed to ,only that there were others who were prejudice against them also see Ez 8:14-16. Not until the Exile , the jews obviously did not see anything wrong in the other gods worship.

During the excavation of the archaeologists of the Palestine they came across the name Egeliah (bull-calf Yah) of Samaria, they dung up many other gods like the Astarte.
Its very obvious that Yahweh was only one of the popular gods they worship till the Exile
The name Egeliah (Bull-Calf Yah) . The Bull caves se up at Dan and Bethel by Jeroboam I is supported by the potsherd from Samaria marked Egaliag(Bull-Calf Yah)
In another words ,yahweh was personified by a bull-calf or young bull & those bulls are amount the common images in the Temple of Solomon. they had also some solar association too.

Fact is that in ancient Judah the name YHWH was Elephantine-ly written as YHW or Yahu. In Israel it is found written as YH read as Yo/Yah.
in another words in 1Kg 12:26-33those golden calves or young bulls were the representation of as aspect of Yahweh.
we can also notice to the spelling of great names to end with 'Yah' or 'Yahu' like Judah and the last king of israel titled 'the servant of Hoshea or Yahweh' ,king named as 'Abdiyo /Abadyahu' or 'Obadiah'.
therefore Yah is actually represented as a bull-calf & god of Israel was never solely worshipped,
however , Yah was worshipped outside israel like the inscription by Sagon II Of Assyrian (720BC) that he had captured the King of Hammath Ya-u-bi'di which means 'god Yah is my help'.
in Egypt there a list of ancient places of Edom which was a place of origin of worship of yahweh and Edom situated in the south of Israel dating (1417-1379 BC) had listed the name YHW (Yah-wi)
finally in 4th century BC there is a coin depicts an inscription of YHW plus a breaded man holding a hawk as we can see at that time the god depicted in human forms just like the greek gods.

Yahweh's worshipped had its orgastic aspects is not only tie to the Canaanite paganism. Yahweh is refer as El in the bible too. El means god or can also mean any specific deity. El was used by Melchizedek, the Canaanite priest-king of Salem. El was the sky god ,the creator and the gray-breaded patriarch of the Canaanite gods. El was also refer as 'Bull-El' in many ancient Canaanite texts. Therefore Bull-calf Yah = Bull-El > also there are many indications that is an variant of Baal who was also associated with bulls.

We need to accept the fact that in many ancient hebrew manuscripts like the Tanak don't include vowels on the hebrew letters thats why the romanized letters of god is YHWH ,the Tetragrammaton ,the sacred & unspeakable name of god. So when they compiled the Masoretic Text(MT) they wrote the vowel points of Adonai(my LORD) from YHWH But you see LORD in the bible is actually YHWH. but those christian translators of the MT misread the meaning of this and inserted the Adonai into YHWH which became Ya Ho WaiH or Je-ho-vah.
In fact ,during Abraham times they refer god as 'my lord' which is 'adonai' in Hebrew

YHWH is pronounced as Yahweh if the hebrew vowels are included. you only just named the letters of YHWH i quote "YHWH [Lod,He,Vau,He]".

The concept of Yahweh before the Exile is that there were many gods rivalries and Yahweh at that time was not the universal god they worshipped ,he was at most a very tribal god. Many at that time did not see Yahweh as having power outside Israel and they were most certainly not monotheistic. Yahweh was a special tribal god of Israel and Judah. There indications of the belief that Yahweh could only be effectively worshipped on Israel or Judah soil.see 2Kg 5 :17 Naaman asks that he allowed take 2 mule-loads of earth back to Syria so he could burnt offering to Yahweh.
The concept of henotheism is clear here see 2kg 3:4-27

As to how Yahweh became the more popular & universal than other gods ,there is a whole history behind it if you wanna know more you can do your own research for now.

thanks for reading.

i will rebut icebuddy latter

if the bible can't described our solar system right before man can discover it , refer to john I quote "Jhn 3:12 "If I told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things? " then how can we factually believe the bible are true most certainly i don't believe ice buddy are true too.

 

[abysslightdarkness]

you need to change your hebrew dic icebuddy

i think i have to spell it out to you that your biblical cosmology IS WRONG base on the verses i quote on my previous massages. bible is not factually describing correctly….our solar sun and earth. do you know why Galileo was prosecuted ? base on what ? and the Church is base on their biblical cosmology ? what biblical cosmology which is (Ps 104:19 ;Ec 1:5 ;Jos 10:13 'the sun moves round the earth' & the earth is not moving (Ps 93:1 ;96:10 ;104:5 ; I Chr 16:30)

and its not difficult to write 'the Earth move round the sun' in the bible

i quote "Again, you assume things you do not know. If Satan was so smart, then why did he go against God in the first place? I don't claim to understand evil or evil beings and how they think. Ask yourself a question: Would you have done the things Satan has done? "

we all know that satan knew god and jesus i'm not assuming that ,if not icebuddy are you saying that satan don't know god and jesus ?
because satan was once believed to be an angle he should know jesus was god.

i simply ask ,if satan knew jesus was god & he knew He can't be tempted then why tempt him ? unless jesus IS NOT GOD. this is a litmus test!!!

Satan is so smart & satan knows god and he knows him well enough to turn against him and lasted for 4000yrs or more … o so to speak… at least i know satan knew god & jesus more than you do ??

thanks for reading

 

[abysslightdarkness]

this for icebuddy good reading

Quote:
the earth is not a ball is a sphere there is a hebrew word for that but is no where to be found in the bible.
im not sure where you want to go with this, but i have no problem with it.
do you know why you don't know where i'm coming from you lack this area of knowledge to comprehend this argument you need at least a good knowledge of biblical history ,astronomy history ,astrophysics ,molecular biology ,archaeology , geography ,ancient world history ,and of course good ancient languages Sanskrit and hebrew ,greek ,hieroglyphs an so on Be hold i will touch on them as i go on…..so if you don't arm yourself with these at hand you will be at lose definitely you don't know what i'm talking about so please read up Icebuddy

Quote:
Is 40:22 did mentioned 'circle' but didn't describe the earth as circle.
Again, i dont know what or where you are going with this. Do you not believe in God or are you of a different religion thats against the Bible that i read? (evolution or something of that measure) Your bias has you seeing from a different view than me. i have no problem with the text that says God sits upon the "Circle" of the earth.
you obviously didn't read the complete passage in hebrew if somebody quote you a verse to understand the complete meaning you need to read least the verse before and after of the quoted verse if you don't you obviously don't get anything. please brush up your hebrew and please use an hebrew-english dic if you use just the hebrew ones obviously you don't get it.

if still don't get it then you must be blindly believe the it without any common sense.
the earth is not flat hello ???


Quote:
if you don't see a problem you are really not of this solar system as the sun is moving around the earth instead (Ps 104:19 ;Ec 1:5 ;Jos 10:13).and if you still don't get it than you are really not from earth
Do you watch the News or read the papers? They all say the sun will rise and set. Do you have a problem with this too? Jesus words explain things to me in a way I dont expect you to understand, but I will try.

Jhn 3:12 "If I told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?

I posted this so you can see that there are things that we see from earth and precieve from our perspective that may be different from heaven. For example: The 5 oclock news telling us when the sun will set or rise the next day.
that is the reason you watched too much news. that is why you catch no ball.

Quote:
If you look closely and contextually at those verses i quoted they were not written as how you would described them to be
you did post a bible passage out of Ecclesiastes. Almost every passage until the last chapter is a view from under the sun or an earthly point of view. Taking this in mind, you can understand other parts of the bible with simalar phrases.
YOU SEE its vital for the so called word of your god ,the bible ,to be able to address the basic facts accurately before homo sapiens sapiens can actually discover them by sending a Hubble satellite up to photo them. To know something factual before discovery by man is vital especially the bible claimed is from god ,the creator of the universe. Unfortunately ,your god or the bible fail to do just that. it's just simple capabilities of differentiating between facts and fable. nothing personal here.

and its not difficult to write 'the Earth move round the sun' in the bible. it is not? instead have us here having this obvious mistaken god of yours on Cosmology.

Quote:
Conversely ,the astronomer discovered that was not true. He was arrested and later released on house arrest till his death. Incidentally ,after 400 to 500 years later the last pope issued a letter of apology (1993) to Galileo's family.
only 1 being that ever walked the earth is perfact according to the bible, his name is Jesus, known as Jesus Christ. I remember Science use to believe a unborn baby went through stages of evolution before becomming a human child, they where wrong too... We can go on and on, what are you looking for?

you obviously don't know about molecular biology and genetics and very poor knowledge of the church history and the holy inquisition. your biblical Cosmology at that time is the universally accepted from the biblical verses saying that the disc-like flat earth is fixed and was the centre of the universe and the sun and rest of the planets move round the earth. ring a bell now if you still don't please redo your education.


Quote:
btw please improve your hebrew before your reply thank you
Next time please put what you desire as qualifications to restond to your posts.(put your qualifications as well) i dont remember you nor any of your post saying anything about being qualified in a certain area to respond. However, i do have a hebrew dictionary that agrees with my deffinitions of the Hebrew.
well must i ? i don't have to ,from here i know your level of calibre . qualifications don't tell much of your knowledge of this kind. and if you have very high qualification all of this should be a breeze on understanding & besides ,even if you are highly qualify doesn't mean what you believe is factually right ok?

Quote:
Gal 4:4 Paul uses the law in association of the corruptibility of the flesh 'made' of a woman nothing special about jesus birth.
Do you personaly think Jesus's birth was not special? What Religion or Faith base are you?
well i don't think that ,it is the bible said so please do check it in greek...

Quote:
rather ,there won't any temptations at all
Thats your private interpitation. I dont claim to know everything. have you read.

Rom 12:16 Be of the same mind toward one another; do not be haughty in mind, but associate with the lowly. Do not be wise in your own estimation.

Quote:
Having said that if satan knew jesus was god then why was satan still dare to approach jesus to tempt him knowing he was god & cannot be tempted in the first place ? the answer was obvious he was man inside out.
Again, you asume things you do not know. If Satan was so smart, then why did he go against God in the first place? I dont claim to understand evil or evil beings and how they think. Ask yourself a question: Would you have done the things Satan has done?

yes Satan so smart & satan knows god and he knows him well enough to turn against him and lasted for 4000yrs or more … o so to speak… at least i know satan knew god & jesus more than you do ??

we all know that satan knew god and jesus & i'm not assuming that ,because satan was once believed to be an angle he should know jesus was god.if not icebuddy are you saying that satan don't know god and jesus ? you are the one who needs polishing i think you better off polish the ice floor with you ice buddies make sure ice are smoother than your rebuts i'm sure its a breeze for you.

i simply asked ,if satan knew jesus was god & he knew He can't be tempted then why tempt him ? unless jesus IS NOT GOD. this is a litmus test!!! there are more of this kind later.

thanks for reading

 

[abysslightdarkness]

To URAVIP2ME

1st John [1v7] says Jesus blood cleanses us from all sin.
But all do not accept Jesus that is why his sacrifice is for 'many' not all.- Matt 20v28
Jesus paid the asking price for our sins. -Rom 6v23
As for the dead [except for those of Matt 12v32; Hebrews 6vs4-6] as Romans [6v7] says the dead are freed or acquitted from their sins. Doesn't that sound as if forgiven if freed or acquitted? Not saying innocent but like a governor can pardon a person so the crime [sin] charges no longer stick. Sin due to our inherited imperfection from Adam.
So 'death' stamps the price tag of sin as: Paid in Full.


below are some of the verses that say we should not be punish for someone else's sins...

Deuteronomy 24:16
The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

2 Kings 14:6
But the children of the murderers he slew not: according unto that which is written in the book of the law of Moses, wherein the LORD commanded, saying, The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, nor the children be put to death for the fathers; but every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

Jeremiah 31:29-30
In those days they shall say no more, The fathers have eaten a sour grape, and the children's teeth are set on edge. But every one shall die for his own iniquity.

Ezekiel18:20
The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.


How not to sin from your sin itself: Aren't there just two types of sin?
Sin is either intentional, on purpose, premeditated, willful, or by mistake.
We do not want to deliberately practice sin.
-Hebrews 10v26.

we all make choices and those sometimes are with negative outcomes we may not intended it but just end that way can't be help but there are those who did it with a motive. In another words ,we all make choices regardless the outcome but what shape the choice we make is another whole school of study and research. How ever whatever action we take we had a motives now with that saying

"Seek not the salvation for your sin rather seek to redeem from sin itself" -- Gandhi.

It could help us to constant check on our motives i hope.

I would say, not Christians, but rather 'so-called Christians' have the wrong notion of willful practicing sin and still having forgiveness. Again, -Heb 10v26.
Didn't Jesus say what one must do to right the wrong or right damage done at Matthew
[5 vs23,24], then pray to God asking forgiveness on the basis of Jesus ransom sacrifice
Ephesians 1v7.

We would not have God's trust in us if we do not follow Jesus command asking to forgive us our debts [sins] as we also have forgiven our debtors, and repent- Matt 18v21.

do you know about Emperor Constantine ? please read about his crimes because he knew this way around it by committing treacherous crimes and then confess during his death bed and still be granted a place in heaven.
I came across someone who is a fanatic christian still very promiscuous always looking for women to sex with even look for prostates. one day i asked him do you know its a sin to commit adultery ? he said yeah but i know god will forgave me at the of the day not matter how many times.. goodness think of the negative impact he produce to others.

I still feel trauma by wrongs long done, but I know God reads hearts, and all the sheep-like ones living on earth at the time of Jesus 'glory' [Matt 25vs31,32] can remain alive and keep on living right into the start of Jesus peaceful thousand -year reign over earth with the prospect of having everlasting life in view on a paradisaic earth.
Doesn't God promise at that time [Rev 21vs4,5] to make all things new,
and as Isaiah foretold [65v17;64v4] the former troubles are forgotten?
1st Cor 2v9

Since God's Word says [1st Cor 5vs11-13] to put away from among yourselves the wicked person, should we associate with such an unrepentant practicer of sin?
No, because agreed such wrongdoings have a negative impact......

To me i think this is a very dangerous belief system because at the end of the day you are still doing wrong and don't learn from it and still able to get away with it and go heaven that why some say christianity is a license to sin your way up to heaven ????

very good man at least you do your home work much better than ice buddy
keep up the research cheers
thanks for reading

 

[icebuddy]

you need to change your hebrew dic icebuddy

Why? It also agrees with the Strongs Dictionary. Still waiting to see what religion you are ot what belief system you follow...

and its not difficult to write 'the Earth move round the sun' in the bible

Its not difficult for the 5 oclock news to say the earth will move us into the sunligth at 6am, but instead they say the Sun will Rise and set at certain times. Do you think the news casters believe the earth is the center and the sun moves around us?

The Bible is interpited by men and as you will agree, many interpit the bible wrong. I believe thats the case with anyone who reads the bible and came to the conclussion that the earth is flat and the sun moving around it...

we all know that satan knew god and jesus i'm not assuming that ,if not icebuddy are you saying that satan don't know god and jesus ?

i believe the Word and God created Satan and Satan knew God and the Word of Life.

because satan was once believed to be an angle he should know jesus was god.

What makes you think he didnt? The Word of Life(Jesus) created Satan.

i simply ask ,if satan knew jesus was god & he knew He can't be tempted then why tempt him ? unless jesus IS NOT GOD. this is a litmus test!!!

Satan did not Tempt Jesus until he emptied himself. We can sit here day and night debating what Jesus exactly emptied himself of, but we really will never know until Jesus explains it to us. However, Satan thought he was God or could defeat God and we cannot begin to say we understand Satans thoughts. What do you believe Statans plan was by going against God in the first place?

at least i know satan knew god & jesus more than you do ??

I love The Father and Jesus. i dont think Satan would say the same. Are you a religous person? Do you believe in Jesus? Im beginning to wonder where you are going with this stuff? Anyone who claims to understand satan is crazy to me...

In Love,
tom

abysslightdarkness Offline
Title:Freshman Member

 

[icebuddy]

To abysslightdarkness

i have read your posts and you may believe what you want, but you are comming off as rude. i have never claimed to have all the answers and I always wonder why people like yourself loose your personal connection to other people. i do know that reading words alone do not give the temper of them, but i read yours a few times and they seem very negative towards me. Again, i never claimed to have all the answers...

I do play hockey and have thick skin, but like the guy in hockey that keeps high sticking everyone, i feel you have become.

As for that I will pray that the love of Jesus touches your heart and hope that someday it will. Remember that the bible says "No one is perfact" and that includes the people the wrongly accused Galileo

Conclusion (based on reading some web pages)
It must be admitted outright that SOME of the items listed here COULD be interpreted as giving a false cosmology - but it is also possible to interpret them other ways. The Bible lacks specifics in this regard (i.e., precise distances and descriptions - as were often offered up by the pagans), and so leaves the answer, "Does the Bible teach bad cosmology?", quite ambiguous in a few places. But for the majority of the passages I have seen, there is no such ambiguity, merely misinterpretation by skeptics and poetry. I feel justified in my assertion that there is no proof that the Bible teaches a false cosmology.


in Love,
Tom

 

[URAVIP2ME]

hi
To address the problem on the name of YHWH referring to URAVIP2ME posts i have gave a brief overview of how the god YHWH origin through the ancient times.
Again over here if jesus is really god why would he need to show the name of god and declare it if he was god in flesh he need not do all that. he was god he was there already !!??
i think i know what URAVIP2ME meant differences in the name of god to what jesus intended yeah there are some compromised in there ,really Jehovah is not really a translation.
Firstly ,We need to recognize that in the archaeology find in 1929 that before the Exile Yahweh was not worship alone ,there were other Canaanite gods like the goddess Anath ,Eshem & Herem to name a few , whether you like it or not that is a fact attested by a number of ancient artifacts & records. They were all worshipped together at that time. In Jer 44:15-28 showed that there were other gods in which they prayed to ,only that there were others who were prejudice against them also see Ez 8:14-16. Not until the Exile , the jews obviously did not see anything wrong in the other gods worship.
During the excavation of the archaeologists of the Palestine they came across the name Egeliah (bull-calf Yah) of Samaria, they dung up many other gods like the Astarte.
Its very obvious that Yahweh was only one of the popular gods they worship till the Exile
The name Egeliah (Bull-Calf Yah) . The Bull caves se up at Dan and Bethel by Jeroboam I is supported by the potsherd from Samaria marked Egaliag(Bull-Calf Yah)
In another words ,yahweh was personified by a bull-calf or young bull & those bulls are amount the common images in the Temple of Solomon. they had also some solar association too.
Fact is that in ancient Judah the name YHWH was Elephantine-ly written as YHW or Yahu. In Israel it is found written as YH read as Yo/Yah.
in another words in 1Kg 12:26-33those golden calves or young bulls were the representation of as aspect of Yahweh.
we can also notice to the spelling of great names to end with 'Yah' or 'Yahu' like Judah and the last king of israel titled 'the servant of Hoshea or Yahweh' ,king named as 'Abdiyo /Abadyahu' or 'Obadiah'.
therefore Yah is actually represented as a bull-calf & god of Israel was never solely worshipped,
however , Yah was worshipped outside israel like the inscription by Sagon II Of Assyrian (720BC) that he had captured the King of Hammath Ya-u-bi'di which means 'god Yah is my help'.
in Egypt there a list of ancient places of Edom which was a place of origin of worship of yahweh and Edom situated in the south of Israel dating (1417-1379 BC) had listed the name YHW (Yah-wi)
finally in 4th century BC there is a coin depicts an inscription of YHW plus a breaded man holding a hawk as we can see at that time the god depicted in human forms just like the greek gods.
Yahweh's worshipped had its orgastic aspects is not only tie to the Canaanite paganism. Yahweh is refer as El in the bible too. El means god or can also mean any specific deity. El was used by Melchizedek, the Canaanite priest-king of Salem. El was the sky god ,the creator and the gray-breaded patriarch of the Canaanite gods. El was also refer as 'Bull-El' in many ancient Canaanite texts. Therefore Bull-calf Yah = Bull-El > also there are many indications that is an variant of Baal who was also associated with bulls.
We need to accept the fact that in many ancient hebrew manuscripts like the Tanak don't include vowels on the hebrew letters thats why the romanized letters of god is YHWH ,the Tetragrammaton ,the sacred & unspeakable name of god. So when they compiled the Masoretic Text(MT) they wrote the vowel points of Adonai(my LORD) from YHWH But you see LORD in the bible is actually YHWH. but those christian translators of the MT misread the meaning of this and inserted the Adonai into YHWH which became Ya Ho WaiH or Je-ho-vah.
In fact ,during Abraham times they refer god as 'my lord' which is 'adonai' in Hebrew
YHWH is pronounced as Yahweh if the hebrew vowels are included. you only just named the letters of YHWH i quote "YHWH [Lod,He,Vau,He]".
The concept of Yahweh before the Exile is that there were many gods rivalries and Yahweh at that time was not the universal god they worshipped ,he was at most a very tribal god. Many at that time did not see Yahweh as having power outside Israel and they were most certainly not monotheistic. Yahweh was a special tribal god of Israel and Judah. There indications of the belief that Yahweh could only be effectively worshipped on Israel or Judah soil.see 2Kg 5 :17 Naaman asks that he allowed take 2 mule-loads of earth back to Syria so he could burnt offering to Yahweh.
The concept of henotheism is clear here see 2kg 3:4-27
As to how Yahweh became the more popular & universal than other gods ,there is a whole history behind it if you wanna know more you can do your own research for now.
thanks for reading.
i will rebut icebuddy latter
if the bible can't described our solar system right before man can discover it , refer to john I quote "Jhn 3:12 "If I told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things? " then how can we factually believe the bible are true most certainly i don't believe ice buddy are true too.

What Scripture says Jesus is God?

The heavenly resurrected Jesus says he is the beginning of the creation by God at Rev 3v14 b. That is also why Col 1vs15,16 can refer to Jesus as being the 'firstborn' in the heavens helping in creation.

Jesus still considers himself to be the Son of God at Rev 2v18.
Even the heavenly Jesus still has a God over him -Rev 3v12.

 

[abysslightdarkness]

in reply to icebuddy

Of course we all can believe whatever we want and wish but when your belief claim is way over the facts. that is a whole different matter. like the biblical creationists and you. Facts has its own right they don't need believers like you & your christianity ,always are craving for them as usual. facts are things that are factual even before or after biblical times. there are consistent i hope you know that.

Interpretation is already done for us when the scripture was under translation because you can't translate something and not interpret them at the same time. if you say expounding the contents of the bible then that is totally depending on what contents its written. NOT all passages in the bible requires further expounder many are just very straight forward. besides , those verses i quoted pertaining to the earth and cosmology is not verses of parables or metaphor or figure of speech or simile ;not even idioms. and what makes you think your interpretation of my verses is right ,icebuddy ? don't be so sure yet.

so again.i have to spell to you lets say
scenario 1
say now in biblical times BC ….the bible word of god. at that time the sun and earth position is not proven yet or known. there may be some postulation of cosmology but yet to take form or proven and accepted.
say i and you was having a debate on the biblical cosmology. i refer to the verses like (Ps 104:19 ;Ec 1:5 ;Jos 10:13 'the sun moves round the earth' & the earth is not moving (Ps 93:1 ;96:10 ;104:5 ; I Chr 16:30)
at that time we have no idea of how our solar system is arranged. and we were having this conversation
you say this is the word of god the bible say the earth is fixed and the stars and sun revolving round us. i say maybe because i suspect that there is something else to it could be the reverse is correct….
you say 'the word of god is facts you can't doubt it you see the sun above is moving & we aren't moving right ?
i say ok
(At that time i must accept it as fact whether i believe it or not 1) because this is word of god at that time is the most powerful thing in that country both political and social. 2) At that time ,we all don't know nuts about the things in the sky. do you thing we know anything in space ? at that time we don't even know there is space beyond the sky &#8230

scenario 2
AS what had happened up till today and now.
now we know things better i hope you do too.

icebuddy please remember the bible is not like 'a man watching news castor' ,the scripture requires very complex treatment … seems like whenever you read something that don't make sense like these verses 'the sun moves round the earth' (Ps 104:19 ;Ec 1:5 ;Jos 10:13) & the earth is not moving (Ps 93:1 ;96:10 ;104:5 ; I Chr 16:30) you interpret it as something what the news caster meant (man's perspective)
but icebuddy you need know in biblical times like scenario 1 ,the bible is believed to be 'what god says' and those ancient common people viewed the bible as "Facts" at that time. they don't view them as what you did today like 'the 6am news castor (man's perspective)' ????? & they have no idea that the sun don't move round the earth…and have no idea the earth is moving. most certainty they have no idea that the earth is a sphere. they have no idea for sure..
if you think god wrote the bible in man's perspective then you are wrong again because of scenario 1 and i have to ask you which part then is written in god's perspective & how do you know which men's perspec or god's ? where do you draw the line ? only when it make sense to you ? or only when you feel the holy spirit ? how do you know what you feel is what you feel ?
& then who are you to judge on those words ? mat 7:1

Because ,the bible is believed to be word of god thats why its vital for the so called word of your god ,the bible ,to be able to address the basic facts accurately before homo sapiens sapiens can actually discover them by sending a Hubble satellite up to photo them. To know something factual before discovery by man is vital especially when the bible claimed is from god ,the creator of the universe. Unfortunately ,your god or the bible fail to do just that. it's just simple capabilities of differentiating between facts and fable. nothing personal here.

Unfortunately , christians believe the bible is the word of god if the bible is the words of man. you would have been right. the book was from a different age is an ancient age and they had ancient thinking and knowledge to know the book you must know these ancient stuff which is very much differ with us now. therefore , this my approach to know the book as original as i possibly can

To understand the philosophy of the authorship behind the bible you need to put yourself at biblical times then view its contents and
to know whether its contents are true or factual you need to make comparison the mentioned biblical contents with today's facts and ask yourself what do we now know and then do the deductions.

Icebuddy your inability to see the bible in biblical times has failed you. i'm not interested of how man think in the bible. i'm interested in what god thinks and what he thinks he knows in the bible. Now seems like is what christians think 'HE knowns' situation. clearly the bible is not from god.

Quote:
because satan was once believed to be an angle he should know jesus was god.
What makes you think he didnt? The Word of Life(Jesus) created Satan.

i' m not saying satan didn't know jesus i just said satan did (see previous message)
sorry to say god knew satan will be against god himself and the world . God still create satan. how kind ???? god sure do know how the devil thinks and he is the Creator it how bloody kind your jesus is ? this is your god ?sorry i don't want this kind of god. i think he is the biggest devil than satan….why? because he created evil (see Is 45:7) use the dead sea scroll bible for accuracy.

Quote:
i simply ask ,if satan knew jesus was god & he knew He can't be tempted then why tempt him ? unless jesus IS NOT GOD. this is a litmus test!!!
Satan did not Tempt Jesus until he emptied himself. We can sit here day and night debating what Jesus exactly emptied himself of, but we really will never know until Jesus explains it to us. However, Satan thought he was God or could defeat God and we cannot begin to say we understand Satans thoughts. What do you believe Statans plan was by going against God in the first place?

he may had emptied himself (frankly i don't think 'emptied himself' can apply to temptations in the previous message i just showed how that is not applicable) but his divine nature can't be emptied because it was innate in him how can you lose something that you born with especially something to do with the mind of divine nature.

Quote:
at least i know satan knew god & jesus more than you do ??
I love The Father and Jesus. i dont think Satan would say the same. Are you a religous person? Do you believe in Jesus? Im beginning to wonder where you are going with this stuff? Anyone who claims to understand satan is crazy to me...

YHWH ,the omniscience (the all-knowing ,the one who knew the minds of satan) ,the omnipresent (the all-powerful ,the one who know what satan can or cannot do) and the omnipresent (the one who is all-present who knows the where about of satan in all eternity). & most certainly the creator of satan ,god ,knowing all that he did and will do) still YHWH created satan. Is this your god ? sorry i don't want this kind of god. Because your YHWH[Bull-Calf Yah ,Bull-El ,Adonai(my LORD) ,Ya Ho WaiH or Je-ho-vah] created evil (see Is 45:7 use dead sea scroll bible for accuracy). Bottom-line your YHWH is the real ORIGINATOR of EVIL not that yHWH is oblivious over satan He knew all his evil ways. therefore he created all his evil ways too. please don't put all the blame on satan he is only ,the result of his creator YHWH[Bull-Calf Yah ,Bull-El ,Adonai(my LORD) ,Ya Ho WaiH or Je-ho-vah]

how kind ???? your god ,sure do know how the devil thinks and he is the Creator of it ,how bloody kind your jesus is ? please don't say he did it out of love and tests of our humankind He can safe it for Himself think all the negative impact that the creator jesus generated. i rather he keep his evil creation to himself.

therefore icebuddy,your god surely do understands how satan thinks ,your god must be crazy to you icebuddy ?


this one ,you don't need to understand satan ,you just to need to deduce it from different info parts in the bible. i think your love for them is too much till your sense of linking ,relating and deducing info is very much extinct.

base on all the available info and research the god jesus is absolutely not a full god (the creator of evil and universe) the bible is far from being the word of god , i won't conclude now because this amount of info here just pinch of salt in the ocean. there are more ,you ain't see nothing yet….

For everyone reading this site
Having said all that ,for more than 2000 years christianity and jesus had landed on earth ,ask ourselves is there any positive impact & outcome on our earth ,look at our earth history now full off wars and tragedies especially over the mid-east israel region the land of YHWH. well ,christians believe its the work of satan ? but the SOURCE of all these is none other than your YHWH (the creator of evil and universe)

thanks for reading feel free to rebut i'm waiting and welcome….

 

[abysslightdarkness]

To URAVIP2ME

in my past massages already demonstrated that jesus is not a god of course there will be passages in that bible of yours will not agree and still believe in a 'godly jesus' but you must bear in mind that book was written in the minds of an ancient age. but now we know much more and better
The verses

Jesus still considers himself to be the Son of God at Rev 2v18.
Even the heavenly Jesus still has a God over him -Rev 3v12.

if you look closely ,if jesus as a full god would he say '...considers himself to be the Son of God....? he would have said "i am god" instead....
for the second it should written as "...jesus is god & is over all" right?

thanks for reading

 

[URAVIP2ME]

RE:"... jesus is god & is over all"

Psalm 2 vs11,12 says to serve the LORD [God]......Kiss the Son, lest he [God] be angry...

Doesn't that make God over all including being God over his Son?

 

[abysslightdarkness]

To URAVIP2ME

For those who angry see Mt 5:22

pretty much all over but they say jesus is god then why still mentioned as a son of god. if he is god then should have say he's god ,then why the book had many intension occasions to address jesus as a very much inferior to god.
i will expand the issue on the 'emptied himself' issue further later.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

RE: Matt 5v22

There is a difference between hell [common grave of mankind]
Acts 2vs27,31; Ecc 9vs5,10 Psalm 6v5; 13v3; 115v17; 146v4]
and the word Gehenna [hellfire]. Gehenna was a garbage dump outside of Jerusalem where things were destroyed. So Hellfire [Gehenna] is a fitting symbol of: destruction.
The ones of Psalm 92v7 are annihilated or destroyed forever.

Those of Matt 12v32;Hebrews 6vs4-6 are in danger of Gehenna or everlasting destruction. Or as 2nd Thess 1v9 says: punished with everlasting destruction.

Who says Jesus is God, at least who in Scripture says such a thing?
No one in Scripture [including Jesus] says that Jesus is God.

Even the resurrected heavenly Jesus still thinks he is: God's Son [Rev 2v18]
Jesus still thinks he has a God over him [Rev 3v12]
Jesus believes, according to Rev [3v14b], that he [Jesus] is the beginning of the creation by God.

Luke wrote us [Acts 20vs29,30] that after the end of the first century that false wolf-like clergy, dressed in sheep's clothing, would fleece the flock.
Clergy often have their own agenda, often political, and are not teaching what Jesus actually teaches or what the Bible really teaches.
For example: Jesus was neutral in the affairs of state. Jesus nor his followers got involved with political issues between the Jews and Romans but remained politically neutral.
Matt 26v52; Rev 13v10.
On the other hand, the clergy to further their political agenda use the pulpit as a recruiting station to convince parents to sacrifice their sons on the alter of war instead of following Jesus and the apostles example of being politically neutral in the affairs of state.

Matthew wrote us that genuine wheat Christians would grow together with fake weed Christians until the time of Matthew chapter 25 or harvest time of separation.

Matthew chapter 7 also shows many would come in Jesus' name but prove false.

Even the United Nations sees a dangerous religious climate brewing in the world today and with backing the UN can be strengthened to turn on the world's religious sector that has run afoul playing false to God and his Word. In ancient times when the Israelites turned their back on God, then God allowed the political 'ax', so to speak, to turn on them.
So it should come as no surprise that this is what will happen but on a global scale.

 

[icebuddy]

icebuddy please remember the bible is not like 'a man watching news castor' ,the scripture requires very complex treatment … seems like whenever you read something that don't make sense like these verses 'the sun moves round the earth' (Ps 104:19 ;Ec 1:5 ;Jos 10:13) & the earth is not moving (Ps 93:1 ;96:10 ;104:5 ; I Chr 16:30) you interpret it as something what the news caster meant (man's perspective)
but icebuddy you need know in biblical times like scenario 1 ,the bible is believed to be 'what god says' and those ancient common people viewed the bible as "Facts" at that time.

abyss,
If you go back to the times of Jesus the Jewish leaders where in charge of "Gods Word" and Jesus points out that they understood it wrongly in many cases. This is well before the events you are talking about. My point being that men misunderstand Gods word even before Jesus was born a man. So to say Christianity has had a 100% accurate understanding of it is odd to me.

Take the "right to bare arms" for example. Republicans think it means the right for every person to own a gun and Democrats believe we should only have this right within the army. Of course the writers had a particular meaning involved, but as time passes people missunderstand, use their own interpitations, or whatever to conclude differently. I see the Bible as simalar to this. I believe Gods Holy Spirit can help with interpitation, but we all have a bias at some point.

Its not like Moses came down from the hill and said, "The Earth is Flat". We dont even know if we are spose to even think the bible was writen to aid in astronimy. What we know is that some Christians in high places probably thought the earth was flat (Why not, everyone else did too) and read the passages and concluded the "Earth is flat". Just as I read the same verses today and conclude the earth is round like a ball.

if you think god wrote the bible in man's perspective then you are wrong again

What i do know is some parts of the bible are writen in poetry, some from a secular, humanistic, materialistic viewpoint. Take the book of Eccleiastes for example, it says when we die there are no rewards, no reward no nothing. Yet the whole bible points to rewards and a afterlife. Some of the writers are writing from their viewpoint. Even Paul in some of his writings say that This isnt a direct commandment of God, but he believed some things to be pure on his own merrit.

i have to ask you which part then is written in god's perspective & how do you know which men's perspec or god's ?

Usualy when we read, "Thus says the LORD(YHWH)" we can conclude this is from God. If its peotry, then i would not conclude hard core facts out of peotry writings. Read the whole book of Eccleiastes for example, they are the words of a person who calles himself a teacher. This whole book is from "HIS" viewpoint.

icebuddy please remember the bible is not like 'a man watching news castor' ,the scripture requires very complex treatment … seems like whenever you read something that don't make sense like these verses 'the sun moves round the earth' (Ps 104:19 ;Ec 1:5 ;Jos 10:13) & the earth is not moving (Ps 93:1 ;96:10 ;104:5 ; I Chr 16:30) you interpret it as something what the news caster meant

i dont know what religion or non-religion you are, but just to show you your own mistakes read Ecclesiastes and see that this is a certain mans point of view. He even says his view is from "Under the Sun" (Mans point of view). With this as a fact, i cant see how you still use ECC 1:5 to validate your claims. Just read this book alone and you will see that it is not Gods view and the teacher changes his mood and tone only in the last chapter.

Icebuddy your inability to see the bible in biblical times has failed you.

You sound like Darth Vader I think Luke said: And your weakness is your confidence. :0

Unfortunately ,your god or the bible fail to do just that.

What are your intentions? Why are you here? What do you believe or follow? Why have you ignored my questions on this?

i'm interested in what god thinks and what he thinks he knows in the bible. Now seems like is what christians think 'HE knowns' situation. clearly the bible is not from god.

i sorry you feel that way. Pray for God to touch your heart and he will as long as you mean it. My relationship with Jesus is real and although you may not understand it, I understand where you are comming from for I too was a unbeliever. I personaly think God has things just as they are to see how strong ones faith is. You are still trusting mans thoughts and mans ability to understand. Only until you let go and let Jesus(GOD) take over will you truely understand. I know you probably think this is all horse crap, but how else am I to explain it?

God still create satan. how kind ???? god sure do know how the devil thinks and he is the Creator it how bloody kind your jesus is ? this is your god ?sorry i don't want this kind of god. i think he is the biggest devil than satan….why? because he created evil (see Is 45:7) use the dead sea scroll bible for accuracy.

God Created Free will, as you have expressed tons of it. You should know that out of this free will does evil exist. God didnt create robots and he wants us to love him back. Yet we can chose as you have as well. What gets me is that you dont believe this bible is from God, yet you post from it as if it where. I view this simalar as I see lawers that say I lie is not a lie unless you are under oath.

but his divine nature can't be emptied because it was innate in him how can you lose something that you born with especially something to do with the mind of divine nature.

What happens when you put a lamp shade over a lamp. It becomes less bright. i agree that Jesus always had divine nature, but he put it aside or covered it with flesh so he could experiance exactly what me and you do today.

For everyone reading this site
Having said all that ,for more than 2000 years christianity and jesus had landed on earth ,ask ourselves is there any positive impact & outcome on our earth ,look at our earth history now full off wars and tragedies especially over the mid-east israel region the land of YHWH. well ,christians believe its the work of satan ? but the SOURCE of all these is none other than your YHWH (the creator of evil and universe)

i hope everyone can see who the angry one is as well. You act as if you want peace, but you are here for the opposite. Hope you do find peace, maybe if you can destroy all of us Christians then we can be as you are. What a dream

Ps - Thats how wars are started. i thought you knew history?

Tom

 

[abysslightdarkness]

for icebuddy

i'm not angry from the start of course nothing personal just mere comparison of facts and fable(bible) and
of course i have no intension of destroying christianity because its already self-destructible after all the research ,
look at your bible is full of discrepancies and can't even be consistence in itself. In a book. even a human can at least write in consistency.
& i am most certainly not as angry you christian are ,that need such dangerous belief system to abate your temper.
besides i'm allowed to be angry but christian cannot why see Mt 5:22

i hope the rest of the readers ,you do understand that god being omniscience also means god knows all your freewill even before you start to WILL it. ok?
bad excuse & god still guilty. in fact you had just made god even more evil than previously believed.

i recalled i quoted more verses than just limited in the book of Ecc why always use that ,i know you can do better than that or can you ?
Any how the church still believe in that wrong cosmology mentioned in the bible in the 16th century. which cause a real embarrassing godly omniscience characteristics.
biblical poetry are written based on the age of thinking and belief pertaining at that biblical time. and if the bible claims that was written by YHWH
than it is obvious & will again cause a real embarrassing godly omniscience characteristics.

Anyways
i had checked the greek word 'κενόω' in the Strong's Exhaustive Concordance

From 'κενόω' (kenos) to make empty, i.e. (figuratively) to abase, neutralize, falsify -- make (of none effect, of no reputation, void), be in vain.

Philippians (62AD) was a letter written below is a portion of a Christian hymn that Paul quoted. The letter was written to the church at Philippi. one of the earliest churches to be founded in Europe

Phil 2;5-8
5 For let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus,
6 who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God,
7 but he emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, having been born in the likeness of men; and found in fashion as a man,
8 he humbled himself, having become obedient even to death, and the death of the cross.
having this is a hymn in mind the passage written very clearly that asking the readers to follow or learn to have a mind like jesus who was in a human god form and he didn't take granted of the his status to be equal with god.

verse 7 actually say that he had "emptied" is figurative expression like detachment of his godly status, in another words he was a god in a man's body. being in that body he was same the level of men or as low as a servant of men. and he was obedient even till his death on the cross. The word 'κενόω' in this context is not to be taken literally as in literally emptied the body. Therefore ,his divine nature still intact in jesus mind which comes back as to how he was able to be tempted with that divine nature in mind ? base on james 1:!3 unless jesus was all man inside out.

For temptation issues which bring me to Job god had sent satan to tempt job Job 1:9 if you read further down the passage god allowed satan to destroy everything job had as shown satan is still a god servant. over here god actually asked satan to do things that very negative.
if jesus was god that why sent satan to tempt himself ? hmmmmm i knew what you want say ……
Anyway ,my point is clear in my previous missive.
but Mentioning Job is to highlight satan is actually not a name of an evil entity. satan is actually a Hebrew word untranslated by the christian scholars as usual.

In fact the full hebrew word is הַשָּׂטָ֔ן (ha-satan) the 'ha-' means 'the/a' and satan means 'Adversary'. your opponent. your obstacles/conflict which denotes a more neutral in tone than devilish in meaning
read 'Origin of Satan' by Elaine Pagels.

With this in mind ,.
and with this passage below i find god more devilish than previously believe.
YHWH ,the omniscience (the all-knowing ,the one who knew the minds of satan) ,the omnipotent (the all-powerful ,the one who know what satan can or cannot do) and the omnipresent (the one who is all-present who knows the where about of satan in all eternity). & most certainly the creator of satan ,god ,knowing all that he did and will do) still YHWH created satan. Is this your god ? sorry i don't want this kind of god. Because your YHWH[Bull-Calf Yah ,Bull-El ,Adonai(my LORD) ,Ya Ho WaiH or Je-ho-vah] created evil (see Is 45:7 use dead sea scroll bible for accuracy). Bottom-line your YHWH is the real ORIGINATOR of EVIL not that YHWH is oblivious over satan He knew all his evil ways. therefore he created all his evil ways too. please don't put all the blame on satan he is only ,the result of his creator YHWH.

how kind ???? your god ,sure do know how the devil thinks and he is the Creator of it ,how bloody kind your jesus is ? please don't say he did it out of love and tests of our humankind He can safe it for Himself think all the negative impact that the creator jesus generated. i rather he keep his evil creation to himself.

i hope the rest of the readers ,you do understand that god being omniscience also means god knows all your freewill even before you start to WILL it.
Hence ,god knows the freewill of satan and therefore ,
Unfortunately god created satan; god started it ,god allows it therefore god WILL it ,& then satan did it,

Needless to say the biggest piece blame cake belongs to god(jesus). SAD isn't it ?

thanks for reading

 

[Misty]

I doubt there is one true god as I suspect all deities are creations of the human mind.

 

[abysslightdarkness]

hi misty

welcome
i need to ask how 's that so you said " ....all deities are creations of the human mind." ?
how does the human mind pertain to deities as such? please elaborate thanks

 

[icebuddy]

i have no intension of destroying christianity because its already self-destructible after all the research ,

Abyss, You see through a different set of eyes. Christianity is the most accurate religion both in history and spititualy. Every time you write todays date you ackolledge Jesus and his existance that he did something earth shattering.

you do understand that god being omniscience also means god knows all your freewill even before you start to WILL it. ok?

what every you believe, you still have a free will. So what if God already knows or doesnt know... Its your Life and you dont know...

i recalled i quoted more verses than just limited in the book of Ecc why always use that ,i know you can do better than that or can you ?

Im just showing you that in ECC we read that "Under the Sun" (Mans View) of how man sees it. That means its from mans view that the sun rises and sets and so forth. The other passages you listed have to be taken out of context and with certain bias to read as you do.

in fact you had just made god even more evil than previously believed.

You are a gem.

god actually asked satan to do things that very negative.

Satan told God that Job trusted him because of all the Good things. Satan said if Job didnt have such good fortune, that job wouldnt love God. God then allowed satan to take away jobs things but not to hurt job. See it how youd like, but you put words into the bible and believe as you want.

Emptied Himself

i dont even know why you want to discuss other parts of the bible. You dont believe the God of Christianity even exist and i see no value in going beyond this anymore. We will never know what exactly happen, but you seem to know everything. Please tell me your belief before we move on...

i hope the rest of the readers ,you do understand that god being omniscience also means god knows all your freewill even before you start to WILL it.
Hence ,god knows the freewill of satan and therefore ,
Unfortunately god created satan; god started it ,god allows it therefore god WILL it ,& then satan did it,

You are bizzare. Your thoughts are way different from mine. God created everything, even satan, but Satan had a free will. Yes God may have known this, but no one knows for sure what God knows and doesnt know or when he knew it. To think we all know God and what he knows is bizzare to me. Paul writes about this in his book about people who sin and blame God. You seem to be no different.

Tom