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Why be muslim?

Smart_Guy

...
Premium Member
Hey Smart_Guy,

I respect you, and I appreciate our conversations. I'm afraid you would be very unhappy with my interpretation of about 99% of the Quran. (BTW, Christians would be equally unhappy with my interpretations of 99% of the Bible :) ).

But in this case, I think I could say that this message is not violent - hooray - but that it's hardly original.

No problem if I'm not happy with your interpretations. It is just a thought that does not hurt! You only gave your opinion and view and whither I like it or not, I respect it and who gave it.

I thought I'd ask you about the specific verse I gave because it is in the post you commented on/after.

Don't worry about it man. Differences in thoughts do not hurt friendliness and respect :)
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
Islam has never attacked Jews or Christians. Some Muslims have.
First -Thank you , because dialogue beautiful -
When I tire out sorry for you -
1. This is not true Mohammed attacked the Jews and Christians
The verse that says ( fought who do not believe in God, the last of the Jews and the Christians , today, and the end of the verse )
This is a declaration of war and the constant attack does not end it will not end
This is because of the teachings of the Koran fixed
Islam didn't exist when the Bible was written.
That's right
But Christ told us
( You will recognize them by their fruits )
The Buddha did not advocate violence, but Muhammad didn't advocate wholesale violence either.
Muhammad used violence in his life and also wrote that in the Koran
The Koran attack any human being does not believe in the message Mohammed
Because the idolaters general word , Buddhists , Hindus, atheists
These infidels must fight
As the Quran says.
The context of this would be very useful. Can you say which ayah this is from?
This talk Muhammad moved historians Muslims 1400 years ago
This talk is written in the books of Bukhari and Muslim and Sahih Muslim Algerian and Ibn Taymiyyah and others
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
This a combination of conspiracy theories and tarring 1.6 billion people with the same brush.

I think it would be helpful for you to drop the preconceptions, and actually go out and meet some Muslims in the real world.
You are right -
Prior theories are not good at dialogue
But I speak from experience , and experience
It also study
There is a difference between man
And between human thought
I respect as a human being Muslim
But do not respect the thought which holds
Our experience with historic Muslims
I was considered a Muslim brother and friend
This was in light of the state during the reign of Saddam Hussein
We have forgotten the pain ancestors
But after that came the Islamists after the fall of Saddam Hussein
Returned tusks Islam
And I did a lot
And you do not know this suffering well
Excuse me
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
I'll admit to being surprised. @mahasn ebn sawresho I retract that part of my statement.
Good question -
And made a part of the answer
Yes I'm from Iraq
I also studied Islamic law
It was me old Islamic books left in Iraq
But I was not able to accept Islam intellectually
This is a personal position
I am here to write from the heart of the Quran and its teachings as they are the oldest
This is useful dialogue
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
It's easy to miss because it's so rare. Sadly him and so many others didn't even have a choice to not be educated on Islam. Compared to most Muslims in the U.S. there's no competition in how much has been pounded in. People generally mistake the negative stance and strong words for lack of info.
I apologize -
I did not understand this very well
1. I am the oldest teachings of Islam as it is
2. Many people do not know these teachings
3. who preach Islam in America Bstkhaddmon certain methods are
Sh Altkaah
J money -
(B) sex by allowing polygamy
C- young people in those countries problems
N economic conditions
 

Kirran

Premium Member
First -Thank you , because dialogue beautiful -
When I tire out sorry for you -

Well thanks very much, I'm also appreciating the discussion.

1. This is not true Mohammed attacked the Jews and Christians
The verse that says ( fought who do not believe in God, the last of the Jews and the Christians , today, and the end of the verse )
This is a declaration of war and the constant attack does not end it will not end
This is because of the teachings of the Koran fixed

I believe there's a good deal of other interpretations of such passages. This can be seen by looking at all the Muslims who aren't at war with Christians.

So which is right? We don't know, so we might as well encourage the peaceful interpretations.

That's right
But Christ told us
( You will recognize them by their fruits )

Fair enough. I'm not a Christian, myself. But I believe this echoes the line from the Bhagavad Gita 'The sum total of the habits of a man is his nature.' In both cases, I think it's talking about individuals.

Muhammad used violence in his life and also wrote that in the Koran
The Koran attack any human being does not believe in the message Mohammed
Because the idolaters general word , Buddhists , Hindus, atheists
These infidels must fight
As the Quran says.

He was violent during his life, but it was a warlike time, it was tough to not be violent.

You are right -
Prior theories are not good at dialogue
But I speak from experience , and experience
It also study
There is a difference between man
And between human thought
I respect as a human being Muslim
But do not respect the thought which holds
Our experience with historic Muslims
I was considered a Muslim brother and friend
This was in light of the state during the reign of Saddam Hussein
We have forgotten the pain ancestors
But after that came the Islamists after the fall of Saddam Hussein
Returned tusks Islam
And I did a lot
And you do not know this suffering well
Excuse me

Certainly, I don't know what you've been through and what your personal involvement in these issues is. I can only take your points at face value.

Good question -
And made a part of the answer
Yes I'm from Iraq
I also studied Islamic law
It was me old Islamic books left in Iraq
But I was not able to accept Islam intellectually
This is a personal position
I am here to write from the heart of the Quran and its teachings as they are the oldest
This is useful dialogue

Were you raised a Muslim?
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
I'll continue to play along, but honestly I dunno for how long I can take it. You say you know Arabic AND you say you studies the Quran. Tell me then what do you understand from these two verses:
4_29.png

4_30.png


Translation:
And do not kill yourselves [or one another]. Indeed, Allah is to you ever Merciful.
And whoever does that in aggression and injustice - then We will drive them into Fire.


The above only proves that killing one's self is forbidden Islam. Anyone, even the worst English users, can understand that.

Please stop claiming you know everything about Islam.
This verse especially for Muslims only
The rule does not apply to non-Muslims
This verse abrogated and canceled from the following verse
( Fight those who believe not in Allah and the last day)
2. You have the meaning of the copyist and copied in the Koran know
3. You have to know the public and private sectors in the Koran
4. murder is not prohibited in Islam
5. Mohammed killed ( CRFH )
6. The provisions of the fighting in the Holy cancel this speech
7. This contrasts from the Kora
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
Thank you. I know my many of my posts hurts a lot of innocent Muslims and that my posts are poles apart from them. - But there are reasons why I keep posting this way - I hope you know. There are a lot of innocent people suffering, being tortured because of this religion.


For many people “Islam” is a peaceful religion – who embrace Islam in the rightful sense; I just hope every Muslim say that. Unfortunately, I believe something went wrong in its implementation – apart from these peaceful Muslims, the rest of the Muslims are quite violent, contribute a major chunk to world violence.


Prophet Mohammed being a leader, at peaceful times, would have made very amiable laws, rules and regulations to make his country a better place to live in. and later at the times of war, would have made other extreme laws for the survival of his country. What I am thinking is that why (much of ) the Muslims prepare themselves as if it is a wartime (the laws are very harsh) when the conditions are actually very “peaceful”.


Why should one be punished with a 1000 flogs just because he said “I am an atheist” – just can’t agree with these.
My friend -
muslem Must follow Muhammad
This is the word of the Koran
That's not going to be able to fix Islam ??
Islam is the idea and ideology
Commander on the ground is Muhammad
And those who follow Muhammad carry out what he said in the Quran and Hadith
 

Kirran

Premium Member
A bit of a tangential question maybe, but Mahasn, do you advocate getting rid of Islam? All Muslims leaving the religion and becoming Christian, irreligious, Buddhist, Hindu etc?
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
Every religious text has laws that are unethical to our moral standards. There are phrases in bible that support slavery, not just Quran.

I agree that Muslims are contributing a lot to world violence, despite their population is just about ¼ of the world population and since it is the “action that speaks louder than voice”, it is a real threat to world peace. They reintroduce laws such as stoning, lashing, cut off limbs etc, to the society once they have a major share of the population – all being Islamic laws.


But then there are peaceful Muslims – peace loving ones. I happened to read an article about a doctor who was abducted by some Islamic terrorists in a foreign land and later the US forces rescued him.

The doctor while he was under their custody- they used to torture him mentally and killed a few of his non-American colleagues who were captured along with him. After a few days, he happened to ask a young militant what they are going to do with him – to which he answered “to bargain some money from the Americans government in return for your life”. They later became friends and then this militant said “your parents gave you education and made you a doctor and my parents made me a militant – they had no choice for anything else. If I come to your land, can I live there peacefully? Can I find a job there? Can you take me to your land? The same night he hears an explosion, which wakes him up from his sleep and then some firings and they were terrified. A minute later, a few people rushed into their room which was locked from the outside and said “don’t worry, you are safe” As they moved him to the helicopter, he had a glimpse of his “terrorist friend” lying dead there. The reason why I said this is this “there are peaceful ones even among the terrorists”.
ristianity is not a text supports slavery , terrorism
Christian rights in a free and have full freedom in faith or atheism
There are great words to describe the love
When comparing with the Holy Bible will know the difference
Quran is not the real love of teaching
He teach hatred
Islam human is the enemy of God ??
Do you believe in this ???
Is Atheist enemy of God ??
 

Kirran

Premium Member
The LORD is a jealous God, filled with vengeance and wrath. He takes revenge on all who oppose him and furiously destroys his enemies! The LORD is slow to get angry, but his power is great, and he never lets the guilty go unpunished. He displays his power in the whirlwind and the storm. The billowing clouds are the dust beneath his feet. At his command the oceans and rivers dry up, the lush pastures of Bashan and Carmel fade, and the green forests of Lebanon wilt. In his presence the mountains quake, and the hills melt away; the earth trembles, and its people are destroyed. Who can stand before his fierce anger? Who can survive his burning fury? His rage blazes forth like fire, and the mountains crumble to dust in his presence. The LORD is good. When trouble comes, he is a strong refuge. And he knows everyone who trusts in him. But he sweeps away his enemies in an overwhelming flood. He pursues his foes into the darkness of night. (Nahum 1:2-8 NLT)
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
A bit of a tangential question maybe, but Mahasn, do you advocate getting rid of Islam? All Muslims leaving the religion and becoming Christian, irreligious, Buddhist, Hindu etc?
1 - Yes , I call on every person that knows the difference between the teachings of love and teachings of hatred
It has the freedom of choice
2. Whatever God , whom you serve
The first condition is love and peace
3. Any teach the teachings of peace and love I meet with him
4. Education holds any hatred
I disagree with him
5. I have the right to defend my thoughts peaceful peacefully also
6. Yes, the Koran is not a valid intellectually and humanly
If the teachings of the Buddha which is not hatred or terrorism or fighting
I considered close to the teachings of Christianity
It is important in any religion teachings
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
The LORD is a jealous God, filled with vengeance and wrath. He takes revenge on all who oppose him and furiously destroys his enemies! The LORD is slow to get angry, but his power is great, and he never lets the guilty go unpunished. He displays his power in the whirlwind and the storm. The billowing clouds are the dust beneath his feet. At his command the oceans and rivers dry up, the lush pastures of Bashan and Carmel fade, and the green forests of Lebanon wilt. In his presence the mountains quake, and the hills melt away; the earth trembles, and its people are destroyed. Who can stand before his fierce anger? Who can survive his burning fury? His rage blazes forth like fire, and the mountains crumble to dust in his presence. The LORD is good. When trouble comes, he is a strong refuge. And he knows everyone who trusts in him. But he sweeps away his enemies in an overwhelming flood. He pursues his foes into the darkness of night. (Nahum 1:2-8 NLT)
1-This talk of the Torah
I want to talk only of the Gospel
Because the interpretation of the Bible has a special interpretation
2. Christian says they take only the law of the Torah literary
And either a formal private Jewish people and the Hebrew
It is only their own
3. if Muhammad honest it is necessary not to follow those mistakes
As Christ did
Christ dropped these laws
Christ said the message of love ??
 

Kirran

Premium Member
Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

The above, I think, means Jesus supports the Old Testament.

Matthew 63:3 I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.

Isaiah 13:15 Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is joined unto them shall fall by the sword.
13:16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.

Isaiah 1:20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

Isaiah 2:18 And the idols he shall utterly abolish.

I'm not posting these to say that Christianity is violent. I'm saying that you can interpret a religion however you like.
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

The above, I think, means Jesus supports the Old Testament.
Yes, this is the word of Christ
But we must know the style of the Bible and also interpreted
The style of the Gospel is metaphorical
Words here are not a judgment nor orders
That education is that the sword is the separation between good and evil
It is not an invitation to declare war
There is also a clear word of Christ
When he said to Peter ( who took the sword, with the sword , it is taken )
I wish I could be pink and clear
Matthew 63:3 I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.
This talk of Christ, he is talking about who will get him
Which means that he will speak for himself
Not speak for others
Isaiah 13:15 Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is joined unto them shall fall by the sword.
13:16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.

Isaiah 1:20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

Isaiah 2:18 And the idols he shall utterly abolish.

I'm not posting these to say that Christianity is violent. I'm saying that you can interpret a religion however you like.
This is also from the Torah -
I want only the texts of the Gospels
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
to -Kirran Sadhaka
I offer you a very simple theory
So you know Christianity and Islam, also known as
1-You have three men
2. The first name of Moses
The second named Jesus
And third named Mohammed
3. Moses and his followers have done certain things
There are special reasons
They declared it a sin
This Daoud says in the Torah (you united Akhtaet and evil before thee manufactured)
All the prophets of the Old Testament admitted mistakes this (Is that clear)
4. Jesus did not do those things
It is announced from the past and are not fit with God
5. Mohammed man came and did those mistakes
But he said it was from God and it is not a sin
6. So that Muhammad took his son's wife of adoptions
Zainab, a girl colt
7. Which is correct
Mohammed or Jesus ??
Jesus did not do the actions of Moses
Muhammad did and more of them said it was from God? J
Which is correct?
Mohammed or Jesus?
 

Smart_Guy

...
Premium Member
This verse especially for Muslims only
The rule does not apply to non-Muslims
This verse abrogated and canceled from the following verse
( Fight those who believe not in Allah and the last day)
2. You have the meaning of the copyist and copied in the Koran know
3. You have to know the public and private sectors in the Koran
4. murder is not prohibited in Islam
5. Mohammed killed ( CRFH )
6. The provisions of the fighting in the Holy cancel this speech
7. This contrasts from the Kora

Dude, you're not making any sense! And the other verse you talk about has nothing to do with blowing one's self up, let alone abrogating it! You can also provide the source of that verse in full context instead of giving low blows like that! Oops, the full context is the full Quran, something you claim you know but in reality you know nothing coherent about it.

Dude, keep it together! You believe it abrogates it, be my guest. I'll never believe that and I'll never hurt peaceful non Muslims. You cannot change me and make a murderer out of me.
 
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